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Unread 11-09-2009, 08:40 AM
 
Location: Seattle Area
3,155 posts, read 3,892,873 times
Reputation: 2759
Quote:
Originally Posted by BellevueGuy View Post
Great... here comes the great defender of Seattle.

We are not comparing apples with oranges, LA with New York, San Fran with Hong Kong, Paris with Tokyo here... we are talking about two small, average American cities with little history 10 miles apart. (Please don't educate me on Seattle's "history"... a few 100-year-old broken buildings at crime-filled Pioneer Square is not history... Beijing / Paris / London has history and heritage).

Seattle is a much bigger city with stadia, touristy things, etc. But to say that they are "world's apart" just shows how few places and cities one has been to, so they have to cling to their "Seattleness" to feel either snobbish or secure.
Look here, I am nearly 60 years old and have lived in Paris, London, Copenhagen, Munich, Frankfurt, and Oslo. Not to mention New York, LA, San Francisco, Dallas and Houston so don't lecture me on "history".

Since you are such the expert define "history" for me...

 
Unread 11-09-2009, 11:18 AM
 
7,653 posts, read 12,601,502 times
Reputation: 3290
The truth is somewhere in between. Seattle and Bellevue are not identical, nor are they worlds apart. The Pacific Northwest culture is in both places. We watch the same channels, drink similar lattes, and have the same US Senators. We share the same climate, the same trees, and we dress alike. People live in Bellevue and work in Seattle and vice versa. Both cities have big buildings...
But Seattle has been a city with several hundred thousand people for a long time, and has a fascinating history. It became larger when streetcar and cable car lines went in.
Bellevue's expansion was more automobile oriented,and accelerated after the bridge went in, in 1940.
Prior to WWII, Bellevue only had a population of less than 5000 people, and was 15-20% Japanese American, and ran the many farms in Bellevue.
One character in Bellevue's history is Miller Freeman, the grandfather of Kemper Freeman, the owner of much of downtown Bellevue including Bellevue Square. Miller Freeman was a state legislator and publisher of the Bellevue Journal American. He campaigned from very early on about the danger of Japanese Americans, and was part of a "civic" organization that strongly encouraged their deportation, even though many of these Japanese Americans were US citizens, and many only spoke English. He campaigned hard for the internment of Japanese Americans during WWII, and although he did own land in downtown Bellevue prior to the war, he was able to acquire a lot more of it very inexpensively as a result of the internment of his Japanese American neighbors. His grandson Kemper has been a longtime opponent of rail transit, perhaps another attempt to keep the riffraff out of Bellevue?
This is not to suggest that Seattle politicians have only been honest. They've had their share of scoundrels as well...But to suggest that neither city has any history is patently false.
 
Unread 11-09-2009, 03:33 PM
 
132 posts, read 204,141 times
Reputation: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by seattlerain View Post
Look here, I am nearly 60 years old and have lived in Paris, London, Copenhagen, Munich, Frankfurt, and Oslo. Not to mention New York, LA, San Francisco, Dallas and Houston so don't lecture me on "history".

Since you are such the expert define "history" for me...
Having lived in Paris, London, Copenhagen, Munich, Frankfurt, and Oslo... and you still think Seattle has "history"? Is this similar to one of the previous claims that "oh I can afford to shop at the Bravern but I choose not to"?

I am not denying Seattle is like one or two hundred years old, but there are few historical gems or heritage around that warrants any kind of snobness against cities around it. I don't think "real" history is a hard concept to grasp for anyone who has visited some other places in the world, even some cities on East Coast.
 
Unread 11-09-2009, 04:20 PM
 
343 posts, read 697,042 times
Reputation: 162
Quote:
Originally Posted by BellevueGuy View Post
Having lived in Paris, London, Copenhagen, Munich, Frankfurt, and Oslo... and you still think Seattle has "history"? Is this similar to one of the previous claims that "oh I can afford to shop at the Bravern but I choose not to"?

I am not denying Seattle is like one or two hundred years old, but there are few historical gems or heritage around that warrants any kind of snobness against cities around it. I don't think "real" history is a hard concept to grasp for anyone who has visited some other places in the world, even some cities on East Coast.
mod cut:

Look, Seattle DOES have history. Not quite the history of a Paris or London of course, but history none the less, and a hell of a lot more history than Bellevue does.

Last edited by scirocco22; 11-09-2009 at 05:05 PM.. Reason: debate only the issues, please
 
Unread 11-09-2009, 06:34 PM
 
Location: Seattle Area
3,155 posts, read 3,892,873 times
Reputation: 2759
Quote:
Originally Posted by BellevueGuy View Post
Having lived in Paris, London, Copenhagen, Munich, Frankfurt, and Oslo... and you still think Seattle has "history"? Is this similar to one of the previous claims that "oh I can afford to shop at the Bravern but I choose not to"?

I am not denying Seattle is like one or two hundred years old, but there are few historical gems or heritage around that warrants any kind of snobness against cities around it. I don't think "real" history is a hard concept to grasp for anyone who has visited some other places in the world, even some cities on East Coast.
Answer my question, what is "history"...what is "real history"...and who are you to proclaim that Seattle has no "real history"

As for the rest of your post, yes I "still think Seattle has history"...and I can afford to shop at the Bravern...but choose not to. I have better things to do with my money than spend it on overpriced consumer goods.
 
Unread 11-10-2009, 03:33 AM
 
132 posts, read 204,141 times
Reputation: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by seattlerain View Post
Answer my question, what is "history"...what is "real history"...and who are you to proclaim that Seattle has no "real history"
You said you've been to many places and you are 60-years-old already, so it should be very easy to grasp right?

The city has history when the people in the city identify with it and cherish that heritage. So everywhere you go, every people you meet, there is a culture deepness behind them, there is a sense of history and continuation, there is the feeling of wisdom and experience, and there are treasures in both well-preserved grand buildings and small street corners.

I see Seattle has strong passion for "green" - people really want to protect the trees, the Sound, etc. But if Seattle is serious about heritage, the Pioneer Square wouldn't be overrun by the homeless and ignored by its citizens, the waterfront streetcar wouldn't have been torn down, all the nice buildings along First Ave and in Chinatown wouldn't be relegated to cheap apartments for refugees.

This is all fine, Seattle is a young West Coast city, and not every cities need to be London-ish or Rome-ish, but as I said above, Seattle's little history doesn't really warrant any kind of snobness displayed in this thread or everywhere else I have witnessed.
 
Unread 11-10-2009, 08:19 AM
 
Location: Seattle Area
3,155 posts, read 3,892,873 times
Reputation: 2759
Quote:
Originally Posted by BellevueGuy View Post
You said you've been to many places and you are 60-years-old already, so it should be very easy to grasp right?

The city has history when the people in the city identify with it and cherish that heritage. So everywhere you go, every people you meet, there is a culture deepness behind them, there is a sense of history and continuation, there is the feeling of wisdom and experience, and there are treasures in both well-preserved grand buildings and small street corners.

I see Seattle has strong passion for "green" - people really want to protect the trees, the Sound, etc. But if Seattle is serious about heritage, the Pioneer Square wouldn't be overrun by the homeless and ignored by its citizens, the waterfront streetcar wouldn't have been torn down, all the nice buildings along First Ave and in Chinatown wouldn't be relegated to cheap apartments for refugees.

This is all fine, Seattle is a young West Coast city, and not every cities need to be London-ish or Rome-ish, but as I said above, Seattle's little history doesn't really warrant any kind of snobness displayed in this thread or everywhere else I have witnessed.
The only "snobness" I've seen in this thread is coming from you directed against Seattle...and that is fine too.

Not everybody is going to like Seattle, but to continue to insult the city and its people is wrong.

Like it or not Seattle does have a very interesting history.




























interpose: this thread is now off-topic and getting too many personal attacking posts. thread is now closed.

Last edited by scirocco22; 11-10-2009 at 11:01 AM..
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