Confused in Seattle (Vancouver, Bellevue, Federal Way: felons, landscaping, landlord)

[JesseJB]

^Some (me) would say we (the hippies in charge) are so laid back that we let things get out of hand. That and homeless people of all kinds flock here for that very reason. It really is too bad considering this city has so much going for it. We would have many more children and families closer to dowtown if we were allowed to hold a standard for public conduct.

Its like youre walking around the market, smelling the smells, seeing the sights...you could convince yourself youre in Paris. Youre in Europe somewhere... Then you see fifty bums in a park where there should be families and children playing. Its so sad.

[W & C]

Originally Posted by JesseJB

^
Its like youre walking around the market, smelling the smells, seeing the sights...you could convince yourself youre in Paris. Youre in Europe somewhere... Then you see fifty bums in a park where there should be families and children playing. Its so sad.

Yeah, so it's just like Paris

French Homeless Make Paris Home : NPR

[bvanevery]

Originally Posted by karenk32

it was not the laid-back, socially aware city that I had hoped to find.

I guess you would prefer the old days, when the Seattle PD would beat the homeless people with nightsticks, causing them to leave the city and not mess up anyone's pleasant view of the street. So I've been told, about how it used to be once upon a time. Keeping the homeless out of sight doesn't make a city "socially aware." If you want to do something socially aware, feel free to join one of the many organizations that deal with that sort of thing. I had a friend who lived in one of the Tent Cities for a time. He had a cynical, insider's view of why such organizations exist, but if you haven't found socially progressive organizations in Seattle, you simply haven't looked. Or stood around on a street corner long enough to watch the protesters marching about something, usually the war in Iraq or some such.

Seattle is about as progressive as an American capitalist city is going to be. If you want hard Socialism, move to another country.

[specificnorthwest]

Originally Posted by JesseJB

^Some (me) would say we (the hippies in charge) are so laid back that we let things get out of hand. That and homeless people of all kinds flock here for that very reason. It really is too bad considering this city has so much going for it. We would have many more children and families closer to dowtown if we were allowed to hold a standard for public conduct.

Its like youre walking around the market, smelling the smells, seeing the sights...you could convince yourself youre in Paris. Youre in Europe somewhere... Then you see fifty bums in a park where there should be families and children playing. Its so sad.

sad indeed...its one thing i cant understand about Seattle..why this is more or less accepted as "normal".

[movingwiththewind]

Originally Posted by bvanevery

Seattle is about as progressive as an American capitalist city is going to be. If you want hard Socialism, move to another country.

And what is exactly "hard Socialism"? It's not all black or white, you know. There is a way of life between hard capitalism and hard socialism. It doesn't need to be hard. It's called social democracy. Which, probably, is "hard socialism" in your eyes, anyway.

But why compare with EU? Take Canada, for example. It's not even a social democracy in the way the European Union is. It's very close to the US system. Yet, look at Vancouver, BC. Look at their downtown. Full of families and kids. Vibrant, diverse and safe to live, work and play. Yes, I know about the downtown eastside. However, this small area doesn't make downtown any bit unsafer. I only dream Seattle would have something even remotely similar to downtown Vancouver. Full of families, kids, playgrounds and all other amenities. People can walk everywhere day and night. And free public access to the waterfront as a bonus.

To movewiththewind:

Wow. I highly disagree with your perception of Seattle and believe you havent been immersing with the best Seattle offers, not even close. I moved here from New York City to Seattle 3 months ago and love this city and find it to be a great city with a lot to offer with all types of things. I equally love New York City and Seattle. My mom and sister who visited me here a few months ago agreed that Seattle is a great city too and felt like moving here.

The positives about this place is so much more than just the nature accessibility. I really think you are hanging out in the wrong places or not seeing the great places/things in Seattle and that can happen in any place, even in New York City.

The way you described this place makes it sound as if youre talking about another place such as Phoenix Arizona and not actually Seattle.

Your post about Seattle makes such a lack of sense to me, that I dont even know how to respond. Im shocked by your perception of Seattle.

Ill further defend my post and make my case after I see your response.

[movingwiththewind]

Originally Posted by NaturalUrbanBalence

To movewiththewind:

Wow. I highly disagree with your perception of Seattle and believe you havent been immersing with the best Seattle offers, not even close. I moved here from New York City to Seattle 3 months ago and love this city and find it to be a great city with a lot to offer with all types of things. I equally love New York City and Seattle. My mom and sister who visited me here a few months ago agreed that Seattle is a great city too and felt like moving here.

The positives about this place is so much more than just the nature accessibility. I really think you are hanging out in the wrong places or not seeing the great places/things in Seattle and that can happen in any place, even in New York City.

The way you described this place makes it sound as if youre talking about another place such as Phoenix Arizona and not actually Seattle.

Your post about Seattle makes such a lack of sense to me, that I dont even know how to respond. Im shocked by your perception of Seattle.

Ill further defend my post and make my case after I see your response.

Always a pleasure.

[eskercurve]

Originally Posted by movingwiththewind

And what is exactly "hard Socialism"? It's not all black or white, you know. There is a way of life between hard capitalism and hard socialism. It doesn't need to be hard. It's called social democracy. Which, probably, is "hard socialism" in your eyes, anyway.

But why compare with EU? Take Canada, for example. It's not even a social democracy in the way the European Union is. It's very close to the US system. Yet, look at Vancouver, BC. Look at their downtown. Full of families and kids. Vibrant, diverse and safe to live, work and play. Yes, I know about the downtown eastside. However, this small area doesn't make downtown any bit unsafer. I only dream Seattle would have something even remotely similar to downtown Vancouver. Full of families, kids, playgrounds and all other amenities. People can walk everywhere day and night. And free public access to the waterfront as a bonus.

Seattle's downtown was, for a long time, moving the way that a lot of other American cities were going. Living in NYC, I can see how you wouldn't have seen it. You know, outside of NYC, from 1950 - 1990, families were moving out of downtown areas and city limits. The motivation was mixed - bigger homes, fewer minorities, more opportunity, etc. They abandoned the highrise lifestyle for larger homes, cars, etc. It was the American dream for a looong time. Seattle kinda sorta avoided that in a few neighborhoods (Ballard, Wallingford, Capitol Hill, Queen Anne, Magnolia), but a lot of other neighborhoods were stagnating. Downtown was an area filled with druggies, salty fishermen, and blue collar type of places where people worked, then went home to places in either the aforementioned neighborhoods, or to the suburbs which were bedroom communities until Microsoft came around.

Since the 1990s, more and more families and younger, up and coming couples have been moving back into the cities across America.

I saw the movie Blues Brothers, which to a Chicago native is sorta a throwback type of thing, just like Ferris Bueller's Day Off. Anyway, it shocked me how dirty, abandoned, and desolate looking downtown looked in the early 80s. Nowadays, it's much more bustling, and many many people have moved back downtown. It's really come around.

Seattle suffered a similar decline but is starting to move back up.

Vancouver is a unique situation because their government made a conscious effort to make the downtown areas more family friendly and more accommodating to people wanting to live in a high density area by taxing companies out the wazoo and forcing a lot of them out. They've been doing this for about 20 years now, and interestingly, so has Seattle. Seattle went the private route with families and "the market" determining what should be done. Vancouver took the government subsidy and taxation route to make the inner city infrastructure better for people to live in. It's obvious who was more successful, but in my opinion, it is not the norm, and probably won't for a while. Give it maybe another 20 more years, and Seattle likely will be similar through market forces, and in my opinion, probably a lot more affordable than trying to live in Vancouver's downtown area.

Not trying to prove a point here or anything ... just giving a little different perspective, for what it's worth.

Anyway, a lot of bums move here because of the Tent Cities and the free accommodations and social services, combined with a mild climate. Many go down south to California for the winter.

In reality the number of homeless in Seattle has gone down ... even during the recession. Its weird ... but there is still a lot around downtown and some of the other city neighborhoods.

Maybe if you give Seattle more of a chance, you will like it more and see it in a more positive light. Im surprised the way I feel about Seattle and Vancouver, you only feel the same for Vancouver and have a drastically different opinion about Seattle.

Did you see Seattle's skyline from Alki Beach/West Seattle, a ferry on the puget sound to Bainbridge Island, Kerry Park in Queene Anne, Denny Way/Westlake, and Denny Way/8th avenue?
Did you go to Pioneer Square, Westlake Center, Pikes Place Market, and other areas in downtown? Did you go to one of Seattle's many awesome asian restaurants and independent coffee places that would be ranked very high up there/ on the top if they were in New York City? I could easily name 20 awesome asian restaurants and 20 independent coffee and tea places. Did you really see the best areas of the neighborhoods of Queene Anne, Belltown, West Seattle, Capital Hill, University District, Wallingford, Ballard, Fremont, as well as other places or did see parts of those neighborhoods that werent "the best parts? Do you know that right now in Seattle, the largest film festival is taking place(The Seattle International Film Festival). In the next 2 months, this area is going to have at least 10 awesome festival like events. Have you been to the Seattle art museum, Seattle asian art museum, Fyre Art museum, as well as other museum like places? Living in Seattle for me the past 3 months has been a great urban experience and this is coming from someone who lived in New York City for 18 years and made the most of what New York City offered. What I said, just scratches the surface of the awesomeness of this area.

I personally think Seattle's positives is much more than just the great nature accessibility, and think it would easily stand as a great city without the nature nearby, but it definitely helps.

[Inkpoe]

NUB, Seattle isn't for everyone and not everyone is for Seattle. Its okay if they're not. Seattle ultimately isn't perfect. I do wonder if you're in a honeymoon stage right now.

Moving has been doing his/her due diligence in RE: Researching Seattle. (S)he's asking questions. Moving's perception about Vancouver isn't wrong.

I've lived here for 20 years, and Seattle really isn't as vibrant as it was before. But this is my perception.