What a nightmare! (light, cost, gardening, America)

[SCGranny]

Originally Posted by Rambling Iris

BS = bull sh--
MS = more sh--
PHD = piled higher and deeper

LOL

Good translation, Iris!

[ChrisC]

Originally Posted by redwolf fan

Moderator cut: quoted post deleted

We didn't play games as kids. We were too busy studying history. You should try it sometime. It might be enlightening.

Any government that thinks it has the right to tell you what services you must buy can tell you to do just about anything it wishes (for your own good, of course). Which eventually it will. Good luck in Denialville.

[lifelongMOgal]

Originally Posted by Happy in Wyoming

NexBusiness of Clearfield, Utah owns the website. There's nothing on them so I suspect it's a home-based marketing company. The purpose of the website is very obviously to compile a list of potential customers. Those prizes are a mighty cheap way to do it.

utahgardenchallenge.com WHOIS domain registration information from Network Solutions

..........................It's no wonder people take us for fools.

I don't know about the domain website. All I know is that the Utah Dept of Agriculture is the main sponsor of the registration as evident by their primary link and emblem display on the front page.

The purpose of the garden registration is stated right there on the opening page I linked. As I stated before, it is not the first "garden registration" program I've come across, including one in my own metro area.

If it makes me a fool in your eyes because I am not a techie and don't make assumptions about those who register domain names, so be it.


Moderator cut: quoted post has been deleted, orphaned response

[Mac_Muz]

I hate vivid dreams, and almost as much as the reasons behind them, like Holder saying he believes private individuals do NOT have the Right to Bear Arms.

Almost like 'Heathcare' is not going to be a TAX, which of course now we all know is a TAX, or will be if the loons in the Govt get their way.

But in the case of tasty stock brokers, well you could always eat them....... LOL

[Countrysue]

I went to a meeting with the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service. Edward Pointevent and family were there. They are the largest landowners in St. Tammany Parish, La. They were early settlers and, after the War of Northern Aggression, bought acres and acres of worthless land north of New Orleans. They farm timber and also cut naturally growing timber.

The USFWS has designated 6,477 acres of land a critical habitat for the Mississippi gopher frog (aka dusky gopher frog). The Pointevent family were accessed 1,500 acres. The frog has not been seen in this area since 1965. This didn't stop the USFWS.

The USFWS told the Pointevents that they wanted to visit the land. They did not mention critical habitat, or endangered species. They visited the land and found no frogs or habitat suitable for the frogs. However, there are some ponds on the property. They 'proposed' making the land critical habitat and restricting it's use. However, the Pointevents would be allowed to continue paying the full property tax levee, continue paying for insurance, and would be required to maintain the habitat.

We went to the meeting thinking we were going to discuss the matter and we actually expected them to listen to our opinions. I went since one day I would like to own enough property to feel safe and have a little homestead. We couldn't understand why the property was chosen since it did not contain the frog, or the elements for the frog's survival. The USFWS gave us 5 minutes each to speak (strictly timed). Total waste of words. Instead, we heard the USFWS instruct the people whose landwas going to be taken on how to create the habitat. The landowners were told how to create appropriate ponds, and what kind of vegetation would be needed. By the way, they would also be required to conduct controlled burns each year. (The landowners would need extra insurance for any collateral damage caused by the fires.) Or, the landowners could donate the land to a nature conservancy group.

We are going to sue. It's the only thing left. Maybe my dream is not so far fetched!

[AK-Cathy]

Country Sue,

Regarding the above post: O.M.G.

I think I can't be surprised anymore and then I am. These people need to contact their US Congressman and Senator ASAP to see if they can get some relief.

[MTSilvertip]

Don't worry, if your cases fail and the current administration is still in office, they will do just as they did under clinton and declare it a national monument to lock it down.
Clinton - National Monuments

Or as Salazar is currently doing to take private lands.
Interior Secretary Outlines Goals for Obama Administration — Land Trust Alliance

They have all kinds of resources to "Legally" take the private property of tax paying citizens, and bypass the congress at the same time.

In my state, the favorite tool using the endanger species act is to lock down land for Grizzlys, but now the griz are expanding everywhere, they are moving to introduce buffalo to take prarie ground.

They introduced canadian grey wolves to try and do the same thing, but those things breed like rats so they aren't "endangered" anymore so that scheme fell flat.

They are endlessly devious, and constantly scheming to take private property for a political agenda.

Your nightmare isn't such a far fetched idea as it is a dark look at what could happen if the current political agenda is allowed to proceed unhindered.

It isn't paranoia if they are really after you.

[Nor'Eastah]

The Only Sane Solution

I have said it before and I'll say it again: don't live in a "house", "residence", or "dwelling".

I'm quite serious. For those of you who have already bought and settled, I realize there's not much you can do (other than renting out the "house" and moving yourself into a well-outfitted "barn".

But I know that several of you on this board, as well as myself, plan to build in the future. For those in this fortunate position, here's the best advice I can give:

1) Own your land in a land trust, or an LLC from a state where the LLC info is not readily available. NEVER own property in your own name! NO ONE should ever know where your physical address is! Just read the news about all the raids going on for computers, kidnapped persons (not there), "creative plants" being grown, etc. Use your imagination.

2) Do NOT build a "residence". There are some advantages to this...we just had a thread about someone's troubles with septic systems. If you build a "shop", "barn", "laboratory", "garage", or what-have-you, the issue of the number of bedrooms (and septic size) does not come up.

3) Maintain a rented legal residence elsewhere. Can be same state, or another. BUT don't ever actually LIVE there. You don't need jack-booted thugs kicking your doors down at 3 am.

The aforementioned was given to me by an attorney who shares my views of how things are going. This is his very best advice. I'm following it to a "T". Just my contribution to those with a weather eye.

[lifelongMOgal]

Originally Posted by Countrysue

I went to a meeting with the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service. Edward Pointevent and family were there. They are the largest landowners in St. Tammany Parish, La. They were early settlers and, after the War of Northern Aggression, bought acres and acres of worthless land north of New Orleans. They farm timber and also cut naturally growing timber.

The USFWS has designated 6,477 acres of land a critical habitat for the Mississippi gopher frog (aka dusky gopher frog). The Pointevent family were accessed 1,500 acres. The frog has not been seen in this area since 1965. This didn't stop the USFWS.

The USFWS told the Pointevents that they wanted to visit the land. They did not mention critical habitat, or endangered species. They visited the land and found no frogs or habitat suitable for the frogs. However, there are some ponds on the property. They 'proposed' making the land critical habitat and restricting it's use. However, the Pointevents would be allowed to continue paying the full property tax levee, continue paying for insurance, and would be required to maintain the habitat.

We went to the meeting thinking we were going to discuss the matter and we actually expected them to listen to our opinions. I went since one day I would like to own enough property to feel safe and have a little homestead. We couldn't understand why the property was chosen since it did not contain the frog, or the elements for the frog's survival. The USFWS gave us 5 minutes each to speak (strictly timed). Total waste of words. Instead, we heard the USFWS instruct the people whose landwas going to be taken on how to create the habitat. The landowners were told how to create appropriate ponds, and what kind of vegetation would be needed. By the way, they would also be required to conduct controlled burns each year. (The landowners would need extra insurance for any collateral damage caused by the fires.) Or, the landowners could donate the land to a nature conservancy group.

We are going to sue. It's the only thing left. Maybe my dream is not so far fetched!

Looks like USFWS is in damage control mode: Fox & Friends story about steps to protect endangered Dusky Gopher Frog misses the mark | U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service

[Mac_Muz]

Suddenly this thread got very interesting.....