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I've noticed that religious people, particularly Christians who describe themselves as "born agaiin", are as a group very unsuccessful people. They just don't do very well. Therefore, they can use their religion to comfort themselves in the belief that after they die they'll be the big shots and those nasty and sinful rich people will be burning in hell. I'm sure that they're hoping to be able to watch the torment.
It's too bad that they had to invade this forum where we discuss the most practical topics on all of c-d.
In fairness I will say I've encountered Christian Identity folks on other fora whom I would be happy to have as neighbors. Randy Weaver is a good example. I've also noticed that Mormons will leave religious discussion out of conversations about blacksmithing or guns. Of course, we can't forget that most of the organized Christian churches have taken a position that there should be no guns in the hands of private citizens.
It's amusing that you talk about sheep; Christians love to compare themselves to sheep when they talk about their "good shepherd". Last I heard shepherds protect their sheep for practical purposes only and ultimately plan to kill them and eat them.
............I was gonna argue with you but realized "whats the point" Instead I just put you on my Prayer list
Anyway prior to what we believe will be the rapture of Gods church (believers) many events will take place via bible prophecy.
There's really no scripture that supports a "rapture." Here's an interesting history of this fairly new phenomenon... Chapter 17: The Rapture Theory - Its Surprising Origin
The vast majority of Christians don't believe in a rapture (at least not in a Left Behind sort of way)...
More importantly, I think we need to still keep logic in mind.
The end of the world as we know it is highly unlikely. A disaster like Sandy, OTOH, will probably happen at least once in everyone's lifetime. Mid-range disasters, like the winter of 2009-2010 out here on the plains, are fairly regular. And losing jobs, houses, etc. should be almost expected.
Not being prepared for such things is foolish...God gave us brains, strong backs, and an interdependence with others. We have a responsibility to use these things to the best of our abilities.
Last edited by itsMeFred; 10-31-2012 at 09:21 AM..
Obviously you're not a Christian, so you should not have responded. I expect people who respond to my posts to READ them in full.
Benjamin Franklin, I believe. I like that phrase too but it isn't found in the Bible.
I do agree. God gives us free will for that very reason. That's why I've always figured that "prepping" can reconcile with Christianity perfectly well. After all, we're also exhorted to take care of the poor and needy... and any of us who does prepare but has family and friends who aren't preparing may find ourselves in just such a position. I figure that if it happens in the next 10-20 years, I will have elderly relatives who won't be able to live self-sufficiently... hence, I'm thinking about prepping for numerous people instead of just myself and my wife.
I run my own business. It makes enough money that my wife doesn't have to work outside our home. Most of the time, I work at my home in a T-shirt and shorts. I make my own hours, call my own shots, and get to work in a field I love (music). If ever a person screws me, it's only a small (and usually easily replaceable) hit to the bottom line rather than the boss screwing me out of your entire income stream by laying me off. As soon as all payments come in for this month, I will be 100% debt-free. I have plenty of food in the cabinets, plenty of clothing in the closets, a roof over my head, two vehicles that run fine and pass inspection every time, furniture, musical instruments, cell phones, etc. I'm married to the most beautiful woman in the world, whom I love with all of my heart and who reciprocates those feelings and sentiments for me.
Tell me - does that sound "unsuccessful" to you?
My life has its warts as would any life but at least they're largely warts of my own choosing.
Being rich is not a sin. I've been even wealthier than this before. What's sinful is greed. For example, I used to live in New Jersey. When I was there, I had very few bills and I made several thousand dollars every month. I drove an old Cadillac that cost me $490 cash. Ran and drove just fine, and that V8-6-4 system worked perfectly so it got excellent gas mileage also. A friend of mine had the greedy mentality that is sinful. He suggested that I should buy a brand new Porsche. His rationale was that I should do it because I can. I was like "Why do I need a Porsche? What I have gets me where I want to go just fine, and that's all a Porsche would do!"... that's the practical mentality. His mentality of "buy it if you can", when "it" is not a necessity of life, is a greedy mentality.
Most rich people are greedy, but that's largely a fault of our consumerist, excess-glorifying society. We place glory upon people for the things they have, especially if they're flashy things. That's not the right way to live... and I think that most "preppers" understand this. When the economic collapse happens, those flashy, shiny new things won't be worth much if you can't eat them.
The Bible never says that being rich is a sin. It says that being greedy is a sin.
Since true Christians eschew greed, and the world judges success based upon how many fancy things you have, it's easy enough to see how many people would deem Christians to be largely unsuccessful people.
But I don't have to say "yes sir" or "no sir" to anyone. I don't even have to call anyone "Mister". If I want to take a two-week vacation, I just have to tell my students that I'm taking a two-week vacation... nobody has to approve it... and I can do that as often as I choose to do it- forget about "only once a year". Often it results in reduced income that month, so I have to weigh that in the balance. But I have the freedom to do so. I don't have car payments, I don't have credit card debt, I don't have to fear being laid off. If anyone I know needs money or help for whatever reason, I have the money and the time to help them out. Nobody knows that I'm doing well financially because I walk around wearing old T-shirts, windblown hair doing whatever it wants to do, getting from place to place in my 1996 Chevy truck with 215,000 miles on it... or on my bicycle. Nothing on the outside about me says "this guy's doing well"... and I like it that way. I'm less of a target if people think I'm not likely to have much in my wallet... and around here, it's a very wise idea to make yourself as unattractive a target for crime as you can possibly make yourself.
I'm not hoping to be able to watch the torment of the greedy people who will end up in hell. I'm hoping to help save them so that they don't end up in hell. It's a shame whenever anyone goes to hell, because nobody ever HAS to go. They make the CHOICE to go. I won't even be able to see the torment of those souls that made the wrong decisions in life and never turned from those ways... but even if I could, the only reason why I'd want to would be if I could video-record it and show the videos to those people who resist when I tell them that hell is a real place of torment where they never want to be. I would get no personal joy out of watching people get tormented in hell. What's to like about that? It's grief and sadness to the highest possible degree.
But now that I've got that out of the way, no more talking about my Christianity. If you don't like it, go somewhere else. The title of this forum says "Christian". The original post I made says that I want to hear from "Christians". There's plenty of warning for those who don't want to discuss "Christian" matters. The reason why I put this question here, as opposed to the Christianity forum, is because I doubt I'd find many "preppers" or "survivalists" in the Christianity forum. I figured I was likely to find more Christians in the "self-sufficiency" forum than I would be to find self-sufficient (or wannabe self-sufficient) people in the religion forum.
It's too bad that you are such an unhappy person that you have to spew your vitriol on someone who was doing absolutely nothing to trample on your way of life or shove his ideas down your throat. Get a life.
I don't know where you've gotten your information, but most of the churches (and church-goers) that I know hold a position that people should be able to carry guns, the Bill of Rights is indisputable, and conservative politics is the only thing good for this country. I go to a fairly large church and the pastor carries a gun, along with many of the other people in the church.
There's really no scripture that supports a "rapture." Here's an interesting history of this fairly new phenomenon...
The vast majority of Christians don't believe in a rapture (at least not in a Left Behind sort of way)...
es.
1 THESSALONIANS 4:15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive [and] remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
:17 Then we which are alive [and] remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
:18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words.
I learned about emergency preparedness from a Mormon neighbor. I don't share their faith, but the lessons learned from them helped us immensely. We didn't experience the rapture or a disaster, it was plain old hard financial times.
I don't know why emergency preparedness is important to the Mormons, and it doesn't matter, they are obviously doing something right!
I learned about emergency preparedness from a Mormon neighbor. I don't share their faith, but the lessons learned from them helped us immensely. We didn't experience the rapture or a disaster, it was plain old hard financial times.
I don't know why emergency preparedness is important to the Mormons, and it doesn't matter, they are obviously doing something right!
Actually, it's mostly just because of "plain old hard financial times."
I learned about emergency preparedness from a Mormon neighbor. I don't share their faith, but the lessons learned from them helped us immensely. We didn't experience the rapture or a disaster, it was plain old hard financial times.
I don't know why emergency preparedness is important to the Mormons, and it doesn't matter, they are obviously doing something right!
Mormons (general here so it may not apply to any specific Mormon) believe the end time tribulations to be a true thing, and the Church in general as well as members as a whole stockpile supplies to take care of themselves when it happens. There LDS Church actually has warehouses scattered around just sitting full of food, owns the largest cattle ranch in the US, and has other resources in the event of such things. From my understanding the do dip into these stores from time to time to help people through hard times, but their main purpose is for the end times.
To the topic creator Luke 4:12
And Jesus answering said unto him, It is said, "Thou shalt not tempt the Lord thy God."
1 THESSALONIANS 4:15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive [and] remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
:17 Then we which are alive [and] remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
:18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words.
Most believers think this is the second coming, just not a rapture in a Left Behind sort of way. Like I said, most Christians, including evangelicals, don't believe in the new version of the rapture. I'm not saying YOU cant, just that its not a motivator for most of us.
Somewhat related, I heard more than a few preachers (fundies) tell their folks in the 70s and 80s and perhaps even now not to worry about saving for a retirement because the rapture would come and their problems solved. Well, here that age bracket is and many that I know have no retirement resources but they sure enjoyed cruises, vacations, new cars and big houses. Rapture ain't retirement. This is personal experience mind you. It is my understanding as well, that many of these same preachers opted out of social security so at least they believed their own stuff.
Why anyone would not prepare for hard times that usually show up is beyond me.
That does tend to rattle me because I know that the Bible says God will provide for us (He provides for the birds, and He loves us more)...
And yet, lots of birds die for lots reasons, including starvation. I think you already figured this one out before you posted it.
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Instead I just put you on my Prayer list
