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Old 06-02-2009, 08:14 AM
 
Location: Raleigh, NC
9,059 posts, read 12,967,105 times
Reputation: 1401

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Quote:
Originally Posted by GregW View Post
Personally I do not care if I buy the necessities in gold, silver, or FRNs. So long as the grocer and the gas stations take the money I am OK.

What I do object to is the continuous decrease in the value of the dollars because the increase in my wages is less then the decrease in value. If the dollar amount of my wages increased as fast as or faster than the value dropped I would not care about inflation. We need interest rates high enough to let us save instead of borrow the money we need.

If I read one post correctly there is not enough silver of gold on the planet to make sufficient Legal Money to replace the FRN’s. So what?
You can theoretically run the world on one ounce of gold. Prices just have to rise to compensate. That sucks for dollar holders, but oh well...life isn't fair.

I've stopped accepting dollars in private transactions the day the Fed bought it's first Treasuries. I suspect this will be a cascading event. Of course, since it's technically illegal to not accept cash, stores would have to operate like back alley communist-era businesses. Want toilet paper? Sorry, we don't have any...oh wait, you have silver coins? I must've been mistaken about not having any. Come to the back with me...
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Old 06-02-2009, 08:21 AM
 
Location: Florida
77,005 posts, read 47,597,802 times
Reputation: 14806
Quote:
Originally Posted by GregW View Post
If I read one post correctly there is not enough silver of gold on the planet to make sufficient Legal Money to replace the FRN’s. So what?
Exactly, so what? Our currency was detached from gold after we went broke with Vietnam war. We chose fiat money instead, and fiat money is designed to inflate. Every monetary scientist back then knew what would happen. It is still possible to go back to gold standard. All we need to do is create a new currency, and use the old dollar to pay off the debt we took in the old currency and then declare the USD dead. China and others will be sitting on a montain of dead currency, but maybe they should have known better. And then we link the new currency to gold and start using that. Of course first me must make sure our military is in good shape so they can repel the attacks by the countries who get screwed by the process.
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Old 06-02-2009, 08:26 AM
 
Location: Sinking in the Great Salt Lake
13,138 posts, read 22,804,086 times
Reputation: 14116
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
Only GM and C have been dropped since last year.

They also dropped AIG from the list last year.
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Old 06-02-2009, 08:29 AM
 
Location: Florida
77,005 posts, read 47,597,802 times
Reputation: 14806
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chango View Post
They also dropped AIG from the list last year.
Yes, last year.

They will drop any company who trades below $5.00 for a given period of time. There is no sense in keeping bankcupt companies there.

But is it something to keep in mind when talking about DOW
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Old 06-02-2009, 08:29 AM
 
Location: SE Arizona - FINALLY! :D
20,460 posts, read 26,319,675 times
Reputation: 7627
Quote:
Originally Posted by ViewFromThePeak View Post
You can theoretically run the world on one ounce of gold. Prices just have to rise to compensate. That sucks for dollar holders, but oh well...life isn't fair.

I've stopped accepting dollars in private transactions the day the Fed bought it's first Treasuries.
Surrrrrrrrrre you did.


Ken
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Old 06-02-2009, 11:44 AM
 
Location: Sinking in the Great Salt Lake
13,138 posts, read 22,804,086 times
Reputation: 14116
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
Yes, last year.

They will drop any company who trades below $5.00 for a given period of time. There is no sense in keeping bankcupt companies there.

But is it something to keep in mind when talking about DOW
Exactly my point, which is why I call BS when the media and politicians say: "we're in recovery! Look at how much higher the dow is!"
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Old 06-02-2009, 12:08 PM
 
Location: SE Arizona - FINALLY! :D
20,460 posts, read 26,319,675 times
Reputation: 7627
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chango View Post
Exactly my point, which is why I call BS when the media and politicians say: "we're in recovery! Look at how much higher the dow is!"
It's not just the DOW that has skyrocketed these last 3 months - ALL the major markets (both here in the US and around the world) have done the same.

Ken
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Old 06-02-2009, 12:10 PM
 
Location: Marietta, GA
7,887 posts, read 17,185,835 times
Reputation: 3706
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chango View Post
Exactly my point, which is why I call BS when the media and politicians say: "we're in recovery! Look at how much higher the dow is!"
It's not the "media and the politicians" that are providing the statistics and leading indicators. You have to be blind or not willing to see. Things are tough but rapidly trending in a positive direction.

Even today, despite all the bankruptcy talk, GM and Ford have said that May auto sales have been MUCH better than expected and will exceed 10 million on an annual basis. Housing numbers, consumer confidence, PPI, CPI, the stock markets, credit markets, and even the labor numbers are all moving in the right direction.

You really have to be blind or some kind of conspiracy nut to think this is just some kind of bad PR job by some politicians or media. Do you think that all the economists, including Roubini and Krugman, are just lying? Are they all just spinning what is really the next great depression?
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Old 06-02-2009, 12:30 PM
 
Location: Raleigh, NC
9,059 posts, read 12,967,105 times
Reputation: 1401
Quote:
Originally Posted by LordBalfor View Post
Surrrrrrrrrre you did.


Ken
Why wouldn't I?
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Old 06-02-2009, 12:32 PM
 
Location: SE Arizona - FINALLY! :D
20,460 posts, read 26,319,675 times
Reputation: 7627
Quote:
Originally Posted by neil0311 View Post
It's not the "media and the politicians" that are providing the statistics and leading indicators. You have to be blind or not willing to see. Things are tough but rapidly trending in a positive direction.

Even today, despite all the bankruptcy talk, GM and Ford have said that May auto sales have been MUCH better than expected and will exceed 10 million on an annual basis. Housing numbers, consumer confidence, PPI, CPI, the stock markets, credit markets, and even the labor numbers are all moving in the right direction.

You really have to be blind or some kind of conspiracy nut to think this is just some kind of bad PR job by some politicians or media. Do you think that all the economists, including Roubini and Krugman, are just lying? Are they all just spinning what is really the next great depression?
Yeah, but all that inconvenient reality doesn't bolster their argument that "Obama and the Democrats are ruining the country" so they they just ignore it. I've been saying for 3 months now that there are increasing signs that this VERY BAD recession is coming to a close - and there are lots of signs of it. Is there still plenty of bad news mixed in? Of course there is - that's the nature of being at or near the bottom of a recession, some indicators will show improvement, some indicators will not. Not everything turns around at once - unemployment numbers for example will be the LAST thing recover (so you can expect the Obamabashers to still be quoting those when ALL the other indicators have turned the corner). The fact is, however, that as time goes by, more and more of these indicators will first show a decreasing level of bad news (the state we have been in the last couple of months), then some will start to show actual GOOD news (the state we are probably starting to enter), then there will be more GOOD news than bad, then the bad news will become pretty rare.

That's the way all recoveries come about, and that's the way this one will show up as well.

Are there still major potential problems? Heck year. The deficit is a big one that could cause us lots of grief - but those issues will have to be dealt with once we are actually starting to recover. NOW we have more urgent issues.

So far though, I'm VERY pleased. I certainly know my 401K is - between the new money I've been adding, the market recovery that happened, and the fact that I jumped out for a while when it was heading down then jumped back in just 2 days after the turnaround in March, I'm nearly back to where I was a year ago.

Ken
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