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Old 05-03-2011, 06:31 AM
 
2,850 posts, read 3,941,049 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RjRobb2 View Post
The EPL at the very least needs a wage scale limitation, if not a stern salary cap.
Yup, EPL needs a wage cap and required financial solvency.
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Old 05-03-2011, 07:48 AM
 
Location: Kansas City, MO
5,763 posts, read 9,752,866 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paull805 View Post
in your opinion, PLENTY, i would say the vast majority of people love the EPL the way it is, and the mls will never have a world class team, unless they get a few breaking off from the pack, world football has always had it's big teams, the sports around 150 years old, it is fine the way it is, the people of england and elsewhere love the EPL, so if you have a problem with it, they clearly don't share it! you are trying to tell me you wouldn't rather have the same quality of the EPL in the MLS?

The only reason they love it the way it is is because they dont know any better.

Do you not think that fans of Birmingham, West Ham, Charlton Athletic, and other mid-table clubs would love a chance to win a title? Do you not think they would not welcome a setup that allowed them to actually compete?

If you think most fans in the EPL would turn down a system that would allow ALL teams to compete for the title over what currently exist then you are an idiot.
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Old 05-03-2011, 08:02 AM
 
Location: Kansas City, MO
5,763 posts, read 9,752,866 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrianH View Post
Liverpool, Arsenal, City, Chelsea, Spurs and Utd all had a chance realistically to win the league at the beginning of the season. 3 of those teams are in it to win it still.
Not really, it was always going to be Man U.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrianH View Post
The teams at the top dont just outspend other teams they have a much better youth acadamy than most of the other teams.
Yeah, because most of the players on those teams came up through their youth academy. You better check the records. Wow, do you see that drop off after Villa?



Yeah, the top teams dont outspend everyone else, huh? How laughable is that statement now.



Quote:
Originally Posted by BrianH View Post
If you just sit there and pay attention Man Utd you may get bored but if you look at the league as a whole it is much more exciting than the MLS setup. West Brom being a yo-yo the last few years has been extremely interesting to watch. I am a liverpool fan but watch football in England as a whole down to the Conference and it is way more exciting than any MLS Playoff that comes along. The MLS League structure is a complete joke.

Are you talking about the MLS league structure that officials in the EPL, La Liga, and Serie A have been quoted talking positive about? The same league structure that the EPL is talking about implementing certain elements? The same league structure that the Sports Business Journal has called the best ran sports league in the United States? The same league structure where no teams are on the verge of bankruptcy?

How many teams in European football are broke? How many are on the verge of bankruptcy or have already filed? How many teams are players basically demanding the amount of money they want and teams paying up ever when they dont have it?

The EPL is fun to watch but as far as complete competition goes from top to bottom, it cannot touch the MLS with a 10 foot pole. You cant argue it because the facts back me up, not you.

Your clueless. The MLS structure is changing the business world of sports. Everyone has taken notice. It promotes parity and complete competition from top to bottom. What is the point of having a sports league when the payroll determines who wins?
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Old 05-03-2011, 08:06 AM
 
Location: Tejas
7,551 posts, read 16,398,736 times
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No need to call paull an idiot, specially considering he is right in what he says. Are you gonna tell us now you know more fans in the EPL because youre on BigSoccer like you do when you talk about the MLS :S

I dont know a single fan who would like any drastic changes in the EPL. Even if you had a wage cap it is still not going to stop the "Big 5" competing for the title as it stands now. What you dont seem to get is that there is alot more to the EPL than winning the title.

Last edited by BrianH; 05-03-2011 at 08:15 AM..
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Old 05-03-2011, 08:15 AM
 
Location: Tejas
7,551 posts, read 16,398,736 times
Reputation: 5087
Quote:
Originally Posted by RjRobb2 View Post
Not really, it was always going to be Man U.



Yeah, because most of the players on those teams came up through their youth academy. You better check the records. Wow, do you see that drop off after Villa?



Yeah, the top teams dont outspend everyone else, huh? How laughable is that statement now.






Are you talking about the MLS league structure that officials in the EPL, La Liga, and Serie A have been quoted talking positive about? The same league structure that the EPL is talking about implementing certain elements? The same league structure that the Sports Business Journal has called the best ran sports league in the United States? The same league structure where no teams are on the verge of bankruptcy?

How many teams in European football are broke? How many are on the verge of bankruptcy or have already filed? How many teams are players basically demanding the amount of money they want and teams paying up ever when they dont have it?

The EPL is fun to watch but as far as complete competition goes from top to bottom, it cannot touch the MLS with a 10 foot pole. You cant argue it because the facts back me up, not you.

Your clueless. The MLS structure is changing the business world of sports. Everyone has taken notice. It promotes parity and complete competition from top to bottom. What is the point of having a sports league when the payroll determines who wins?
Take a deep breah and read what I said, I NEVER said the top teams dont outspend other teams. Sometimes talking to you is like talking to a 12 year old, have to repeat everything but you still dont get whats being said.

Show me where the EPL officials are talking about the MLS being a good league structure. Show me where there is any favortism towards having an MLS style play off. You seem to love telling us all these things but never seem to want to show us quote, and a bigsoccer.com forum post wont cut it.

Show me these facts that the MLS is better. The MLS is not better, its pretty boring till you get to the Playoffs. In England you have the FA and League Cup to generate that kind of excitement. In England the best overall team in the league wins, simple as. In the MLS you barely have to compete to make the playoffs.

Youre right I am cluess :S I love how you always resort to insulting people when you are losing a debate, it really shows who the cluess people are ....
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Old 05-03-2011, 08:19 AM
 
Location: Kansas City, MO
5,763 posts, read 9,752,866 times
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Hypothetical scenario:

You sit fans from the following teams in a room: Charlton, Birmingham, Fulham, Sunderland, Bolton, Wolves, and Blackburn. Actually, we will just invite everyone that is not a fan of the big 4.

You ask them if they would prefer to keep the EPL exactly how it is or if they would prefer to implement a system that would allow them to be more competitive and perhaps even compete for the league title.

What do you think they are going to choose? Do you think they are going to choose to be dominated forever? Do you think they are going to choose to continue to be mediocre? Only a fool would choose that option. No one likes to lose or be mediocre. People want their teams to win.

Yes, it would stop it because the Big 4 wouldnt be able to sign everyone they want. They would be limited on who they could sign so some of those players would be forced to choose other teams. You do you realize how a cap works, right?
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Old 05-03-2011, 08:35 AM
 
Location: Tejas
7,551 posts, read 16,398,736 times
Reputation: 5087
Keep it the same.
Just because you think its done better in America does not mean the whole world thinks it is.

I have already spoken to my dad about the MLS setup and he does not like it. Being a West Brom supporter I think that qualifies him to sit in that hypothetical scenario. My friend I speak to every weekend back home is a Blackburn supporter and thinks the same.

My cousin, a Brummie even said that he does not think that the MLS setup is exciting. No relegation and the best team does not always win. Nobody that I know of likes the Playoff situation, nobody.

There you go again, you seem to think that the English league is only about winning the premiere league. You have TEAMS in England. Teams that are rooted in communities and have been for over 100 years. There is alot to play for every season, not just winning the league. It is an exciting setup.

Of course I understand what a cap is. You do understand taht somebody like Cristiano Ronaldo would not sign for West Brom regardless, right ? Even if there was a wage cap the teams wouldnt generate enough $$$$ to buy him in the first place. If you limit wages to $50,000 a week per player West Brom, Sunderland, Bolton and all the teams you named could still not afford 11 players on them wages wheras Liverpool, Utd and all them teams could have 25 players on the books earning $50,000 a week. The lower teams dont get the attenedence to support caps anyawy, they simply dont generate the interest from fans.
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Old 05-03-2011, 08:37 AM
 
Location: Kansas City, MO
5,763 posts, read 9,752,866 times
Reputation: 2809
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrianH View Post
Take a deep breah and read what I said, I NEVER said the top teams dont outspend other teams. Sometimes talking to you is like talking to a 12 year old, have to repeat everything but you still dont get whats being said.
You did say that they are better due to their youth academies rather than there spending. Everton has one of the best youth academies in England and their best players run off to other teams like Rooney did once he had a good season because they can pay him. Teams that win the EPL dont win the trophy, they purchase it. Much like the Yankees and Red Sox.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrianH View Post
Show me where the EPL officials are talking about the MLS being a good league structure. Show me where there is any favortism towards having an MLS style play off. You seem to love telling us all these things but never seem to want to show us quote, and a bigsoccer.com forum post wont cut it.
Big Soccer has a thread that is done daily that has links to soccer articles all over the world. Every so often there is an article about how an official from a European league recognizes the parity in MLS and how leagues have even gone as far as to talk about implementing MLS elements into their league structure.

If I have time this week, I can find some. I never said anything about a playoff.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrianH View Post
Show me these facts that the MLS is better. The MLS is not better, its pretty boring till you get to the Playoffs. In England you have the FA and League Cup to generate that kind of excitement. In England the best overall team in the league wins, simple as. In the MLS you barely have to compete to make the playoffs.
How is it boring in MLS? You never know who is going to win matches and until late in the season, there are only a few points to seperate the best team from the worst. The race is much closer and it is more of a "any given Sunday" scenario than the EPL where you pretty much know who is going to win a lot of the matches.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrianH View Post
Youre right I am cluess :S I love how you always resort to insulting people when you are losing a debate, it really shows who the cluess people are ....
I'm losing the debate? I am sharing actual information while you just making the same point over and over again.
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Old 05-03-2011, 08:50 AM
 
Location: Kansas City, MO
5,763 posts, read 9,752,866 times
Reputation: 2809
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrianH View Post
Keep it the same.
Just because you think its done better in America does not mean the whole world thinks it is.

I have already spoken to my dad about the MLS setup and he does not like it. Being a West Brom supporter I think that qualifies him to sit in that hypothetical scenario. My friend I speak to every weekend back home is a Blackburn supporter and thinks the same.

My cousin, a Brummie even said that he does not think that the MLS setup is exciting. No relegation and the best team does not always win. Nobody that I know of likes the Playoff situation, nobody.

Let me get this right. You asked fans of mediocre and sometimes just bad teams in their league if they would rather have a structure that would allow them to compete and they said no? These fans would prefer to stay mediocre and not compete with the big boys?

That's like asking someone if they would like a million bucks and then them turning it down.

Why would fans of a team turn down a chance to be something better? These are teams that generally finish on the bottom half of the table and you offer them a chance to finish at the top half or maybe even qualify for UEFA and they turn it down? They are satisfied with mediocrity?

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrianH View Post
There you go again, you seem to think that the English league is only about winning the premiere league. You have TEAMS in England. Teams that are rooted in communities and have been for over 100 years. There is alot to play for every season, not just winning the league. It is an exciting setup.

No, I dont. However, this conversation is about winning the league, not the other competitions. We are talking just about winning the league. Everything else is a consolation prize.


Quote:
Originally Posted by BrianH View Post
Of course I understand what a cap is. You do understand taht somebody like Cristiano Ronaldo would not sign for West Brom regardless, right ? Even if there was a wage cap the teams wouldnt generate enough $$$$ to buy him in the first place. If you limit wages to $50,000 a week per player West Brom, Sunderland, Bolton and all the teams you named could still not afford 11 players on them wages wheras Liverpool, Utd and all them teams could have 25 players on the books earning $50,000 a week. The lower teams dont get the attenedence to support caps anyawy, they simply dont generate the interest from fans.

I think it would take awhile but sooner or later players would no longer look down on sides like West Brom because there would be more parity.

That mentality that players like C. Ronaldo would not sign with sides like West Brom is a huge part of the problem. If your league is setup like that, there is an issue. Every side should have an equal shot at signing players. If it isnt, your league is not working correctly.

When two teams lineup to play each other in the same league, there should be an equal shot at each winning the game. There payrolls should be similar and the talent level should be in the same range, if that is not the case then your league structure is failing. The EPL is so far off from that it isnt even funny.
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Old 05-03-2011, 09:01 AM
 
Location: Tejas
7,551 posts, read 16,398,736 times
Reputation: 5087
Dude listen. I spoke to people about it and they gave me their answers. I dont know what else to say on that subject. Obviously you being a SKC fan you know better than everybody else, your opinion counts for more. Every country in the world has a league setup becauset they think its better but the MLS does not so you think everybody else has a bad setup. Leagues that have been around for 100+ years vs MLS's what, 4th attempt that I know of at making a soccer league. So yeh, everybody else has the wrong setup that has worked for 100 years :S

Youre not sharing actual facts, youre stating stuff taht you have not yet linked to do prove its true. You say EPL and other leagues say the MLS is a great setup and you have not shown me where that is. Thats not a fact thats a dude on a forum saything things are factual and thats it.
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