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Old 11-22-2013, 12:13 PM
 
Location: Belgium
1,173 posts, read 1,675,901 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by easthome View Post
Why is the world so obsessed with English football and English football fans?? Why do people even care what the English think anyway??? Is it because of the Premiership? I really couldn't say, perhaps a Mexican (for example) should concern him/her self as much with English football as an Englishman would with Mexican football ie not at all. As an Englishman I really couldn't give a sh#t if a Frenchman thinks France can win the world cup or not so why does it bother so many what an Englishman thinks anyway??
That's what you get when your league is one of the very best in the world and involves tons of players from all over the globe. Frankly, I too take more than usual interest in the English national team, and that has to do with the connection between top-class Belgian players and England.
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Old 11-22-2013, 12:57 PM
 
Location: Tejas
7,551 posts, read 16,400,231 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by easthome View Post
I often hear people 'claim' that the English always consider themselves as potential winners but in reality I have NEVER met any Englishman with this belief - in fact I would say on average the English have a bigger 'downer' on their own team than most others. Most nationals are allowed to support their teams and dream their dreams in peace but as soon as an Englishman utters ANYTHING positive about English football scorn rains down on him from all angles!! Why is the world so obsessed with English football and English football fans?? Why do people even care what the English think anyway??? Is it because of the Premiership? I really couldn't say, perhaps a Mexican (for example) should concern him/her self as much with English football as an Englishman would with Mexican football ie not at all. As an Englishman I really couldn't give a sh#t if a Frenchman thinks France can win the world cup or not so why does it bother so many what an Englishman thinks anyway??
I am from Ireland (have English relatives and lived in England myself for a time) and in my personal experience a large portion buy into the media hype that they are better than they actually are. I think you can see why I care about English football.
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Old 11-22-2013, 03:52 PM
 
Location: Utica, NY
1,912 posts, read 2,549,448 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Avondrood View Post
(Ah the 1990 WC. I'm still traumatized by that round of 16 game against England, David Platt scoring in the last minute of extra-time . I was ten years old, and cried like a baby after that game pfff).

Why is it, btw, that England, not being a small country, with such a huge football tradition and with one of the best leagues in the world, doesn't manage to create some more real world-class players?? Keeps on baffling me.
Of the players that I've actually seen playing (wasn't born in 1966), very few thrilled me. Paul Gascoigne and Matt Le Tissier were probably the only ones. There's very good players such as Wayne Rooney, Gary Lineker, Paul Scholes, Alan Shearer, David Beckham. But for me, only Le Tissier and Gascoigne (funny, the two players with French surnames) really possessed that "spark", that touch of brilliance...
Sorry I don't remember that WC from inside the womb. I had to look up the game you mentioned. England beat Belgium! But that was the year they had Lineker, Gascoigne and Robson as manager. Those glory days have never been replicated, but the WC in France was the first one I somewhat remember when Hoddle was in charge and England weren't a bad team then. Were Belgium as good then as they are now?

The problem in England is clerks at grass roots level. A nation of 48 million people and a footballing tradition must have the talent, but it is not being nurtured correctly. Of recent years, really Lampard, Gerrard Beckham and Rooney could be considered anywhere near world class. England are still way too dependent on all but Beckham who is obviously now retired.

I also feel that more British players should go abroad to experience playing in Europe, even if it's the Dutch or Scandinavian leagues at first.
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Old 11-23-2013, 01:05 AM
 
Location: Belgium
1,173 posts, read 1,675,901 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by non-creep View Post
Sorry I don't remember that WC from inside the womb. I had to look up the game you mentioned. England beat Belgium! But that was the year they had Lineker, Gascoigne and Robson as manager. Those glory days have never been replicated, but the WC in France was the first one I somewhat remember when Hoddle was in charge and England weren't a bad team then. Were Belgium as good then as they are now?

The problem in England is clerks at grass roots level. A nation of 48 million people and a footballing tradition must have the talent, but it is not being nurtured correctly. Of recent years, really Lampard, Gerrard Beckham and Rooney could be considered anywhere near world class. England are still way too dependent on all but Beckham who is obviously now retired.

I also feel that more British players should go abroad to experience playing in Europe, even if it's the Dutch or Scandinavian leagues at first.
Yes, Belgium had a good squad back in the eighties (vice-champion of Europe in 1980, semi-finals in 1986).

England should implement a good youth education program, based on technical skills. I've recently read an article about the Elite Player Performance Plan. Maybe that is the way to go.
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Old 11-23-2013, 04:55 AM
 
Location: SE UK
7,841 posts, read 6,656,030 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Avondrood View Post
(Ah the 1990 WC. I'm still traumatized by that round of 16 game against England, David Platt scoring in the last minute of extra-time . I was ten years old, and cried like a baby after that game pfff).

Why is it, btw, that England, not being a small country, with such a huge football tradition and with one of the best leagues in the world, doesn't manage to create some more real world-class players?? Keeps on baffling me.
Of the players that I've actually seen playing (wasn't born in 1966), very few thrilled me. Paul Gascoigne and Matt Le Tissier were probably the only ones. There's very good players such as Wayne Rooney, Gary Lineker, Paul Scholes, Alan Shearer, David Beckham. But for me, only Le Tissier and Gascoigne (funny, the two players with French surnames) really possessed that "spark", that touch of brilliance...
England is a small country isn't it?
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Old 11-23-2013, 11:27 PM
 
17 posts, read 33,598 times
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It's actually painful to watch this team. Technically we are light years behind of other nations.
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Old 11-24-2013, 10:32 AM
 
Location: The Netherlands
2,942 posts, read 4,395,920 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by easthome View Post
England is a small country isn't it?
Not in terms of population. It's bigger than Argentina, Spain, Netherlands, Portugal, etc. and not much smaller than France or Italy.

Considering the size of the population and the footballing tradition, England consistently underperforms. At least they won a WC though, unlike *some other country that lost three finals and a semi-final*
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Old 11-24-2013, 11:38 AM
 
Location: Finland
24,268 posts, read 18,823,188 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by non-creep View Post
I also feel that more British players should go abroad to experience playing in Europe, even if it's the Dutch or Scandinavian leagues at first.
Why? The Swedish and Norwegian leagues are in terms of class somewhere between the Championship and League One, closer to the latter. The Danish league is a bit better and the Finnish league a bit worse. HJK Helsinki, which has won 5 consecutive Finnish championships would have problems qualifying in the top 4 in the Scottish Premier League!

Top Swedish or Norwegian teams like Malmö FF, Rosenborg and IFK Gothenburg would all probably be relegated from the Championship, and low class teams like Sogndal and Vålerenga would probably be relegated straight to League Two! I'm not that familiar with the Danish league, but it's not a huge step up from Norway.

I don't really see the benefits coming to this part of the World.
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Old 11-24-2013, 02:51 PM
 
Location: Utica, NY
1,912 posts, read 2,549,448 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ariete View Post
Why? The Swedish and Norwegian leagues are in terms of class somewhere between the Championship and League One, closer to the latter. The Danish league is a bit better and the Finnish league a bit worse. HJK Helsinki, which has won 5 consecutive Finnish championships would have problems qualifying in the top 4 in the Scottish Premier League!

Top Swedish or Norwegian teams like Malmö FF, Rosenborg and IFK Gothenburg would all probably be relegated from the Championship, and low class teams like Sogndal and Vålerenga would probably be relegated straight to League Two! I'm not that familiar with the Danish league, but it's not a huge step up from Norway.

I don't really see the benefits coming to this part of the World.
European experience. The experience of living in another country and learning another language to eradicate the little Englander syndrome. English teams could make an effort to loan out young English talent to clubs outside of England. Such players would not get into the first team but would do well in the Dutch league for example. Wilfred Zaha is one example of a player that would benefit from such a loan spell.

An English player would get far more benefit from going on loan to a team like Malmö or IFK than Coventry City or Milton Keynes Dons.
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Old 11-25-2013, 06:02 AM
 
Location: SE UK
7,841 posts, read 6,656,030 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LindavG View Post
Not in terms of population. It's bigger than Argentina, Spain, Netherlands, Portugal, etc. and not much smaller than France or Italy.

Considering the size of the population and the footballing tradition, England consistently underperforms. At least they won a WC though, unlike *some other country that lost three finals and a semi-final*
Nevertheless 40 something million doesn't make England a big country - I think because of the British Empire (some) people (perceive) England to be bigger than it really is.
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