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Old 05-12-2014, 06:59 AM
 
3,200 posts, read 3,892,243 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CD2013 View Post
Haha, I never "trashed" Charlotte. You do that to Charleston...by saying things like its a city full of college dropouts working for tips. I don't make comments like that. I make comments about what I like or don't like about Charlotte, but I don't trash it like you do other places, Charleston in particular.

Your original point was addressed early and often, and it still boils down to a couple easy things:

1) Most SC representatives are from the 3 main metros in SC, and thus, they work to push those areas.
2) Businesses do their own research. There isn't a single thing some politician or Chamber of Commerce member can tell a company like Toyota....that Toyota's own internal researchers don't know already.

That's it. Your question was answered. And then you got upset and started attacking.
With regards for #2, if you think it is that simple, you don't understand how Econ development works, not surprised.

As for charleston, I do like to visit, you just take economic fact as an attack. You take stating that Charlotte is on a different level as an attack and then start in on this cube city garbage.
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Old 05-12-2014, 04:37 PM
 
1,912 posts, read 2,004,876 times
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Originally Posted by GSP101 View Post
With regards for #2, if you think it is that simple, you don't understand how Econ development works, not surprised.

As for charleston, I do like to visit, you just take economic fact as an attack. You take stating that Charlotte is on a different level as an attack and then start in on this cube city garbage.
No, you're just too sensitive. You read-in what you want to hear from people saying stuff back to you. You WANT to be offended by it, and you want to have some avenue or reason to attack the SC cities, so you look for stuff to start a gripe about.


I don't deny Charlotte is "on a different level" than Charleston. They are polar opposite cities. And I couldn't be happier about it Charleston offers me things that no amount of money can buy, or deny, and that I can enjoy 100% just as much as the guy who gets his Bentley serviced in Charlotte.

When the Bentley driver from Charlotte drives over the crest of the Isle of Palms connector, and views that beautiful scene of the ocean ahead and the Charleston peninsula to the right, and feels the sea breeze and smells the wonderful smells of the great oceanfront restaurants and enjoys the sand and surf.....he is driving into that wonderful scene right behind me in my 20K Honda. And he and I are having the same experience.

I'll take that as my daily option over a view of some towers. Just my choice. The Bentley driver chooses the towers, and a 3 hour planned trip for that. His choice.
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Old 05-13-2014, 04:57 PM
 
3,200 posts, read 3,892,243 times
Reputation: 750
Quote:
Originally Posted by CD2013 View Post
No, you're just too sensitive. You read-in what you want to hear from people saying stuff back to you. You WANT to be offended by it, and you want to have some avenue or reason to attack the SC cities, so you look for stuff to start a gripe about.


I don't deny Charlotte is "on a different level" than Charleston. They are polar opposite cities. And I couldn't be happier about it Charleston offers me things that no amount of money can buy, or deny, and that I can enjoy 100% just as much as the guy who gets his Bentley serviced in Charlotte.

When the Bentley driver from Charlotte drives over the crest of the Isle of Palms connector, and views that beautiful scene of the ocean ahead and the Charleston peninsula to the right, and feels the sea breeze and smells the wonderful smells of the great oceanfront restaurants and enjoys the sand and surf.....he is driving into that wonderful scene right behind me in my 20K Honda. And he and I are having the same experience.

I'll take that as my daily option over a view of some towers. Just my choice. The Bentley driver chooses the towers, and a 3 hour planned trip for that. His choice.
.

You don't offend me, I am actually amused at a lot of what you write.

If that makes you happy great........it is a nice scene. Personally, I prefer Pawleys over IOP/wild Dunes because it is less crowded.

But, the reason this thread went off course has nothing to do with beach scenes. It has to do with growth and how SC recruits industry. When I bring up metrics to support what I am writing, you and other Charleston residents get mad because you don't like the numbers. Charleston has always thought of itself as the only city in SC and you see that on this board. I actually like visiting the city for reasons that you cited above. But, when recruiting business to SC, while nice, that is not going to convince a company to relocate to SC if they want 700+ flights per day, international service and a deep/talented labor pool. Although I wish TM was coming to Charlotte, I am happy that we were on the list because historically, they would not have considered Charlotte. You are actually the ones that get offended and ask me to leave when I post that even the commerce department uses Charlotte in writings.
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Old 05-13-2014, 08:49 PM
 
1,912 posts, read 2,004,876 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GSP101 View Post
.

You don't offend me, I am actually amused at a lot of what you write.

If that makes you happy great........it is a nice scene. Personally, I prefer Pawleys over IOP/wild Dunes because it is less crowded.

But, the reason this thread went off course has nothing to do with beach scenes. It has to do with growth and how SC recruits industry. When I bring up metrics to support what I am writing, you and other Charleston residents get mad because you don't like the numbers. Charleston has always thought of itself as the only city in SC and you see that on this board. I actually like visiting the city for reasons that you cited above. But, when recruiting business to SC, while nice, that is not going to convince a company to relocate to SC if they want 700+ flights per day, international service and a deep/talented labor pool. Although I wish TM was coming to Charlotte, I am happy that we were on the list because historically, they would not have considered Charlotte. You are actually the ones that get offended and ask me to leave when I post that even the commerce department uses Charlotte in writings.
Pawleys is nice, only about a 45 minute drive for me.

No, it went off course when you asked a question, you got an answer, and didn't like it.

Its simple. York/Chester/Lancaster are not one of the 3 main SC metro areas, and historically have little influence in Columbia. That's just a fact.

Second fact- because of the above fact, they aren't gonna get a lot of effort or money or influence in Columbia to push their development.

Third fact- because they are SC counties, don't expect the NC or Charlotte chambers of commerce to spend time, money, effort trying to lure development OUT of their own state into those SC counties.

In short, SC and NC both have interests, financial and political, that don't include York, Chester, Lancaster anywhere near the top.

A large part of development in those counties will be done by officials of those counties, or, private people and business in the Charlotte metro discovering it on their own and making the move.

Its a very logical answer if you understand people and politics even a little bit. Most of the power people in the SC government are from the Greenville, Columbia or Charleston areas. Its simple human and political nature that they will serve the interests of their home constituents first. Same for those in NC and Charlotte governments- why would they push York when its a SC county, and York wont get as much love in Columbia because the folks in Columbia are mostly not from York.

Its simple dude.
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Old 05-13-2014, 09:36 PM
 
3,200 posts, read 3,892,243 times
Reputation: 750
Quote:
Originally Posted by CD2013 View Post
Pawleys is nice, only about a 45 minute drive for me.

No, it went off course when you asked a question, you got an answer, and didn't like it.

Its simple. York/Chester/Lancaster are not one of the 3 main SC metro areas, and historically have little influence in Columbia. That's just a fact.

Second fact- because of the above fact, they aren't gonna get a lot of effort or money or influence in Columbia to push their development.

Third fact- because they are SC counties, don't expect the NC or Charlotte chambers of commerce to spend time, money, effort trying to lure development OUT of their own state into those SC counties.

In short, SC and NC both have interests, financial and political, that don't include York, Chester, Lancaster anywhere near the top.

A large part of development in those counties will be done by officials of those counties, or, private people and business in the Charlotte metro discovering it on their own and making the move.

Its a very logical answer if you understand people and politics even a little bit. Most of the power people in the SC government are from the Greenville, Columbia or Charleston areas. Its simple human and political nature that they will serve the interests of their home constituents first. Same for those in NC and Charlotte governments- why would they push York when its a SC county, and York wont get as much love in Columbia because the folks in Columbia are mostly not from York.

Its simple dude.
In missing the point entirely yet again, you actually supported exactly what I have been saying. Politics is part of why these counties are ignored, I said that a while back. The point you don't understand is how SC could improve itself by recruiting companies that will not look at Greenville or Charleston......and believe it or not, there are a lot of projects where these cities don't make the top 20 sites, especially with high impact jobs. So, instead of playing politics, the state can improve itself in a couple of areas.....increased tax revenue to the state that otherwise would be 0, and getting exposure in this type of development that does not exist today. As I said with TM, having that sit on 77 with high visibility tells other companies that SC can support that type of operation much like BMW tells other manufacturers that it can be built in SC. Where you just see a building with Toyota at the top, others see a message that legitimizes SC as a place for these projects. there are great views in Charleston but that is not enough to convince a company looking to fill thousands of high paying jobs to move there, especially when the area's growth tilts towards the above 55 crowd. Not sure why this is hard to understand, it is basic economic development.

But, as usual, you spend a lot of time trying to be funny instead of understanding metrics and economic drivers. You seem to believe Internet blogs and thats fine, don't get so mad when metrics prove it wrong.

As for an answer, I got the answer I expected to get, it does not make it right and the state misses an opportunity. If you can live with that, great.
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Old 05-13-2014, 09:54 PM
 
1,912 posts, read 2,004,876 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GSP101 View Post
In missing the point entirely yet again, you actually supported exactly what I have been saying. Politics is part of why these counties are ignored, I said that a while back. The point you don't understand is how SC could improve itself by recruiting companies that will not look at Greenville or Charleston......and believe it or not, there are a lot of projects where these cities don't make the top 20 sites, especially with high impact jobs. So, instead of playing politics, the state can improve itself in a couple of areas.....increased tax revenue to the state that otherwise would be 0, and getting exposure in this type of development that does not exist today. As I said with TM, having that sit on 77 with high visibility tells other companies that SC can support that type of operation much like BMW tells other manufacturers that it can be built in SC. Where you just see a building with Toyota at the top, others see a message that legitimizes SC as a place for these projects. there are great views in Charleston but that is not enough to convince a company looking to fill thousands of high paying jobs to move there, especially when the area's growth tilts towards the above 55 crowd. Not sure why this is hard to understand, it is basic economic development.

But, as usual, you spend a lot of time trying to be funny instead of understanding metrics and economic drivers. You seem to believe Internet blogs and thats fine, don't get so mad when metrics prove it wrong.

As for an answer, I got the answer I expected to get, it does not make it right and the state misses an opportunity. If you can live with that, great.
OH.........so your point is why don't we just reverse or change the natural tendencies of all politicians??? OH why didn't you say so before

If Greenville and Charleston were such bad options for big business to locate to, then BMW and Boeing never would have come.

So, ALL YOU ARE ASKING......is how can we get our elected politicians- the majority of whose votes came from the 3 main metro areas in SC........to change the natural tendency of politicians to try to help their voting base, and instead to put energy towards attracting business to the 3 counties below Charlotte.....instead of taking that energy and trying to lure the next Boeing or BMW to one of the main 3 metro areas?

Im starting to think you just don't get people. Heres an example. In Charleston, we elected Mark Sanford as our Congressman last year. Now, lets say a big business is considering South Carolina. Toyota? Ok. Lets say Sanford is meeting with the Governor and the Chamber of Commerce, and with some Toyota folks.

Would we, the Charleston voters, want him lobbying for Charleston? Or York? Simple politics buddy.

You say he should lobby for York, since Toyota would never come to Charleston? Maybe. But....Sanford put in years of work as former Governor lobbying Boeing to Charleston, and he got it done. Maybe the folks of Charleston remembered that, and that he helped bring Boeing here...not to York...and we elected him as our Congressman.


When York/Chester/Lancaster get as much political power in Columbia as Charleston, Greenville, Columbia have....then the leaders in SC will push business to move there. Until then, York should hope the North Carolina Chamber of Commerce and reps from Charlotte will push York to business.

Oh wait, they wont. They represent the NC counties and cities of influence.

You starting to see how this works now?
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Old 05-13-2014, 09:57 PM
 
1,912 posts, read 2,004,876 times
Reputation: 865
Quote:
Originally Posted by GSP101 View Post
As for an answer, I got the answer I expected to get, it does not make it right and the state misses an opportunity. If you can live with that, great.
Ill address this one separately.

What opportunity did we miss? If Toyota wanted to be near Charlotte, it would have come to the area, with or without help from SC.

In fact, its BRILLIANT that South Carolina leaders DONT spend any time or money trying to lure business to York. Charlotte and NC folks do that for us, for free. I'm sure Toyota looked at Charlotte, and researched the surrounding areas, including York, as well as the tax rates, overhead costs, labor pool, of all the surrounding counties.

SC leaders will, and should, push its 3 main metro areas. The York area will get overflow from Charlotte, and the folks in Charlotte and North Carolina will do the work for us as far as promoting that area. If Toyota didn't come......it sure as hell was NOT due to them not knowing about York County being near Charlotte.
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Old 05-13-2014, 10:10 PM
 
3,200 posts, read 3,892,243 times
Reputation: 750
Quote:
Originally Posted by CD2013 View Post
OH.........so your point is why don't we just reverse or change the natural tendencies of all politicians??? OH why didn't you say so before

If Greenville and Charleston were such bad options for big business to locate to, then BMW and Boeing never would have come.

So, ALL YOU ARE ASKING......is how can we get our elected politicians- the majority of whose votes came from the 3 main metro areas in SC........to change the natural tendency of politicians to try to help their voting base, and instead to put energy towards attracting business to the 3 counties below Charlotte.....instead of taking that energy and trying to lure the next Boeing or BMW to one of the main 3 metro areas?

Im starting to think you just don't get people. Heres an example. In Charleston, we elected Mark Sanford as our Congressman last year. Now, lets say a big business is considering South Carolina. Toyota? Ok. Lets say Sanford is meeting with the Governor and the Chamber of Commerce, and with some Toyota folks.

Would we, the Charleston voters, want him lobbying for Charleston? Or York? Simple politics buddy.

You say he should lobby for York, since Toyota would never come to Charleston? Maybe. But....Sanford put in years of work as former Governor lobbying Boeing to Charleston, and he got it done. Maybe the folks of Charleston remembered that, and that he helped bring Boeing here...not to York...and we elected him as our Congressman.


When York/Chester/Lancaster get as much political power in Columbia as Charleston, Greenville, Columbia have....then the leaders in SC will push business to move there. Until then, York should hope the North Carolina Chamber of Commerce and reps from Charlotte will push York to business.

Oh wait, they wont. They represent the NC counties and cities of influence.

You starting to see how this works now?
Again, you said what happens politically, I get it. You don't get the business aspect at all.

Here is the difference you don't understand, BMW located a manufacturing operation in SC...same jobs that Mexico also gets.... that is much different than Toyota's US HQ. Sanford won't get the opportunity to recruit these companies at all if he is pitching Charleston to a company which wants an educated workforce (not close to retirement), great air service, a Good quality of life, good schools, etc....Charleston does not have a deep labor pool ( ask Boeing), and forget about air service. Additionally, an operation like TM would have a hard time filling 4k jobs in a market of roughly 320k jobs in total. TM would be 1% of the jobs in Charleston in this operation, that influence will not be a success. Charlotte has typically not been on lists for operations of this magnitude, much less a small market like Charleston.

So, instead of playing politics, do what is best for the state and spend $500k to have a recruiting group targeting industries/operations that are now not looking at SC. Politics is why SC has watched NC and Georgia grow to 10m residents with high growth metros like Atlanta, Charlotte and Raleigh. It is why people flock to these state for high impact jobs and why SCs growth is slanted towards retirees.

Sounds like you accept politics as usual.
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Old 05-13-2014, 10:14 PM
 
3,200 posts, read 3,892,243 times
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Originally Posted by CD2013 View Post
Ill address this one separately.

What opportunity did we miss? If Toyota wanted to be near Charlotte, it would have come to the area, with or without help from SC.

In fact, its BRILLIANT that South Carolina leaders DONT spend any time or money trying to lure business to York. Charlotte and NC folks do that for us, for free. I'm sure Toyota looked at Charlotte, and researched the surrounding areas, including York, as well as the tax rates, overhead costs, labor pool, of all the surrounding counties.

SC leaders will, and should, push its 3 main metro areas. The York area will get overflow from Charlotte, and the folks in Charlotte and North Carolina will do the work for us as far as promoting that area. If Toyota didn't come......it sure as hell was NOT due to them not knowing about York County being near Charlotte.
You missed an opportunity for SC to be home to Toyota's US HQ with 4k income tax paying jobs. Do you think TM will locate in SC without meeting with the government or commerce? So, the state should ignore this area and hope to get noticed....great strategy.
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Old 05-13-2014, 10:17 PM
 
Location: Meggett, SC
10,644 posts, read 9,007,867 times
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Originally Posted by GSP101 View Post
Again, you said what happens politically, I get it. You don't get the business aspect at all.

Here is the difference you don't understand, BMW located a manufacturing operation in SC...same jobs that Mexico also gets.... that is much different than Toyota's US HQ. Sanford won't get the opportunity to recruit these companies at all if he is pitching Charleston to a company which wants an educated workforce (not close to retirement), great air service, a Good quality of life, good schools, etc....Charleston does not have a deep labor pool ( ask Boeing), and forget about air service. Additionally, an operation like TM would have a hard time filling 4k jobs in a market of roughly 320k jobs in total. TM would be 1% of the jobs in Charleston in this operation, that influence will not be a success. Charlotte has typically not been on lists for operations of this magnitude, much less a small market like Charleston.

So, instead of playing politics, do what is best for the state and spend $500k to have a recruiting group targeting industries/operations that are now not looking at SC. Politics is why SC has watched NC and Georgia grow to 10m residents with high growth metros like Atlanta, Charlotte and Raleigh. It is why people flock to these state for high impact jobs and why SCs growth is slanted towards retirees.

Sounds like you accept politics as usual.
Go tell it to the NC forum. I used to live in one of those 'high growth metros', Atlanta to be specific, and I would never want to go back to that. I am happy with our small metros and I suspect so are most of the residents. You're 'suggestions' are nothing more than thinly veiled insults badly disguised in a pretty wrapper.
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