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Old 04-24-2014, 01:16 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GSP101 View Post
He thinks the Charlotte suburbs are irrelevant.
I don't think he thinks there irrelevant, just that they hold less importance in the state than Columbia, Charleston, or, Greenville.
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Old 04-24-2014, 01:35 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by g-man430 View Post
They aren't. A big reason is due to the tourism factor like Carowinds and Concord Mills.
Concord Mills? I seriously doubt the Fort Mill area has anything to do with visitors to Concord Mills.

Quote:
Originally Posted by redcliffe View Post
I don't think he thinks there irrelevant, just that they hold less importance in the state than Columbia, Charleston, or, Greenville.
THANK YOU.
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Old 04-24-2014, 03:28 PM
 
Location: Greenville, SC
10,338 posts, read 20,598,463 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mutiny77 View Post
Concord Mills? I seriously doubt the Fort Mill area has anything to do with visitors to Concord Mills.



THANK YOU.
I wasn't talking about only Fort Mill but all of the suburbs surrounding Charlotte.
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Old 04-24-2014, 03:43 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by g-man430 View Post
I wasn't talking about only Fort Mill but all of the suburbs surrounding Charlotte.
We were specifically talking about the SC suburbs of Charlotte. That's what this thread has been about all along.
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Old 04-24-2014, 04:55 PM
 
Location: Greenville, SC
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mutiny77 View Post
We were specifically talking about the SC suburbs of Charlotte. That's what this thread has been about all along.
Ahhh...didn't realize that.
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Old 04-24-2014, 05:08 PM
 
3,200 posts, read 3,893,976 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mutiny77 View Post
You initially said that VA and NJ sells companies on the benefits of being in their state and in a large metro, but it's really apples to oranges. NOVA and northern NJ, even while being part of a larger metro area, have distinct economic specialties to the point where they would be major contenders as standalone metros. You've got finance and a whole slew of other industries in northern NJ and tech and defense contracting in NOVA. And again, they have the infrastructure (rail transit, airports) to support a large degree of high-impact industries. Fort Mill doesn't have an economic specialty and lacks that sort of infrastructure because Charlotte isn't a major metro on the level of DC or NYC; Fort Mill is basically just a low-tax haven for Charlotte-area companies and not much else. That's a key difference in how recruitment is handled.

You're making a ton of assumptions here with no evidence to back it up. First of all, if, after being presented with options in multiple areas, the company ran the numbers and did its due diligence and discovered that Charleston would suit its operations just as good as Fort Mill, then it would be preferable that that company locate in Charleston because practically all of the ripple effects from that decision would be felt wholly within SC. The resulting population growth will be all within SC and those people will also play in SC, so you'll see increased tax revenue from property taxes, sales taxes, hospitality taxes, and so on. But if a company were to locate in Fort Mill, you're simply not going to have the same type of impact because of the presence of Charlotte which is in NC.

Well LPL hasn't made a decision yet so they are still a Charlotte-based company. As far as RedVentures go, I used to work there when I lived in Charlotte so I'm very familiar with them. They have extremely high turnover rates and don't need a particularly skilled workforce; trust me, a site in the Upstate, Columbia, or Charleston would have worked just as well. However they chose to remain in the Charlotte area because of very practical reasons, including the ties they have to the city. There would be no need to move somewhere else in the state and sever all their existing business relationships and recruit and train completely new staff. However, the point is that if they were located elsewhere and were looking to relocate to SC, the Big Three would have worked just as well as Fort Mill.

But do you even know what the state is doing? You just asked about the state department of commerce practices so you're only going off a lot of assumptions. It just seems that in your mind, Fort Mill should be leading the pack only because it's near your own Shangri-La. Obviously most business chose to locate in Charlotte itself over Fort Mill; lower taxes as a prime selling point only goes but so far. Uptown, South Park, University, and Ballantyne all have a host of advantages over Fort Mill, and the advantages that the Big Three in SC offer outweighs the advantages of Fort Mill alone when taking Charlotte's other office districts into account.

Here you go again, being disingenuous and misconstruing people's words because they don't agree with you even when they've plainly laid out their position. You consistently do this with people who don't see eye-to-eye with you and it's quite annoying.
In your dissertation and statement that this area holds less importance to SC than the three SC based metros, you are completely missing a lot of points. First, this is not the state's decision where a company wants to locate, the company is the customer. It is the state's responsibility to not drive them to Greenville, Charleston or Columbia but to provide what is available in the entire state and then work from there. You and others suggest that the three metros are more important and should get more recruiting efforts which is the complete wrong way to approach the issue. It starts with the company.

In the case of companies locating in York County, most have said they look for a deep well educated labor pool, reasonable taxes, good class A space with large floor plates, free parking, and proximity to direct flights. You said any of the SC metros could meet the criteria for these companies. Based on the company requests, Greenville is out because the college education rates are still too low, Charleston's population growth has been slanted to the 50+ crowd as stated by CRDA so while their education stats are not bad, they are skewed to an older crowd which is not the deep labor pool you are looking for. FM gets to tap into Charlotte's labor pool which is one of the top city's for millenials. And, none of the three SC metros have access to an international airport with over 700 flights per day.

So no, these companies could not operate as efficiently or get ramped up as quickly as they could in metro Charlotte. Charlotte was just named a top B city for its ability to attract talent from the top tier cities (see, no need to take shots at Charlotte, I understand what it is and is not, you don't have to sensationalize how much larger DC and NYC are to try and slam Charlotte.....it gets old and is irrational) Additionally, if a company like Met Life wants to add 1,400 jobs, they will struggle to find enough qualified applicants in the SC based metros because of the shallow labor pool....Columbia may have an advantage because of the university but it would be a struggle. Met Life chose Ballantyne not because FM was bad but because Johnny Harris just completed 2 spec buildings with 550k of available sq feet. The fact that SC is not routinely on the list of companies like Met Life and LPL (outside of FM) speaks to the problems the SC metros face in attracting these companies.

And that is why I have said over and over, the state needs to leverage Charlotte in recruitment. Not because as you mention via a personal attack "It just seems that in your mind, Fort Mill should be leading the pack only because it's near your own Shangri-La." but because it diversifies what the state is doing economically. It is a different type of industry that the state has recruited. But, it is a sector that could help whether the company is in Charleston, Columbia, Myrtle Beach or Fort Mill. I disagree that a company located in Charleston is more beneficial to the state than one in FM, that is pure speculation on your part. And, wrong.

As for NJ & NOVA, they are completely irrelevant to this discussion. The only relevant information from these areas is that they are dominant in their state because they are in a major metro centered in a neighboring state. Virginia and NJ were smart enough to see that leveraging a larger city's assets could help development in their home state.........exactly what I have said from page 1.

Based on your reaction in this thread and another involving York/Lancaster, you seem to have a problem with this area and have been quick to undercut any positives the area has and reduce the counties to cheap tax havens for Charlotte. That is completely wrong. The area has great schools, a 2,100 acre greenway for recreation, quick access to shopping in Charlotte and great neighborhoods.

As for me twisting words when folks disagree with me, that is pure trash. You have gotten a little too personal in discussing these issues, try and keep it on topic, there is no need to attack me. if you have a problem with me personally, PM me. But, there is no need to speculate as to why I am writing in an effort to minimize what I say and then claim it gets annoying. If you are only here to win an argument, go back to urbanplanet where you can edit folks out that you don't like.
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Old 04-24-2014, 05:49 PM
 
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Let's just let this post below stand. You have been operating on assumptions since you created this thread and admitted that the state just may already be doing what you're advocating. So this discussion should pretty much be a wrap.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GSP101 View Post
I can't make out the structure looking at the commerce website. Some other departments are functionally aligned and some are aligned by target industry, just can determine how SC operates. There are many agency heads of things like small business, international, research, grants, innovation, legal etc......I suppose they have strong contacts with a lot of the site selection agencies and then work from there on leads.

I do like their data page, it seems to be somewhat up to date and includes metro Charlotte & Augusta in the statistics for SC (a little surprised to see how much York is growing, it has already passed their 2015 assumptions at a 40%+ growth rate). That is good to see from a business standpoint. Maybe I am being to critical and they are selling York, Lancaster & Chester to outside companies.

Although LPL is would just move across the line, this may help the state recruit more top financial companies to the area.

Here is the abbreviated story on LPL......the roughly 15 story building will look nice on I77 if they leave Charlotte.
SC incentives could lure LPL Financial to Fort Mill - Charlotte Business Journal
Now as far as my "reaction," I have absolutely nothing against York and Lancaster counties; unlike you, I was educated, resided, and worked in that area so I have more ties to it than you do. I'm just under no illusions that it compares to the Big Three. And yes you twisted my words when you said that I'm saying that the area is irrelevant when you know I said no such thing. Just because I don't think the area is on the same level as the Big Three doesn't mean I think it should get no attention at all. I simply think the type of attention it should be first and foremost should be the type that will primarily help the central cities in those counties which have been not been getting the Charlotte spillover effect. It's a shame to see the towns of Rock Hill, Lancaster, and Chester--home to longtime SC residents who truly consider themselves South Carolinians who have suffered with the decline of the textile industry--so easily dismissed in favor of brand new transplants and NC'ers who only cross the border for work, cheap gas, and fireworks.
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Old 04-24-2014, 05:54 PM
 
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Gotta say, I agree with GSP101 on this whole thread. SC is being very shortsighted to not promote the burbs of Charlotte that exist within the SC boundary. Charlotte's best burbs head South / Southeast toward SC.....SC could walk away with some prized business developments if it promoted the area more. Reminds me of Memphis, TN and the Mississippi burbs of Memphis.....Mississippi got smart and "grabbed some of the gold" away from Memphis and TN. Disagree with Akhenaton06/Rochelle/Mutiny77 or whatever other multiple post banned name he is going by at the moment on City-Data.
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Old 04-24-2014, 06:18 PM
 
3,200 posts, read 3,893,976 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mutiny77 View Post
Let's just let this post below stand. You have been operating on assumptions since you created this thread and admitted that the state just may already be doing what you're advocating. So this discussion should pretty much be a wrap.

Now as far as my "reaction," I have absolutely nothing against York and Lancaster counties; unlike you, I was educated, resided, and worked in that area so I have more ties to it than you do. I'm just under no illusions that it compares to the Big Three. And yes you twisted my words when you said that I'm saying that the area is irrelevant when you know I said no such thing. Just because I don't think the area is on the same level as the Big Three doesn't mean I think it should get no attention at all. I simply think the type of attention it should be first and foremost should be the type that will primarily help the central cities in those counties which have been not been getting the Charlotte spillover effect. It's a shame to see the towns of Rock Hill, Lancaster, and Chester--home to longtime SC residents who truly consider themselves South Carolinians who have suffered with the decline of the textile industry--so easily dismissed in favor of brand new transplants and NC'ers who only cross the border for work, cheap gas, and fireworks.
Don't confuse trying to understand the structure of the department with the politics of SC. Just because I am trying to understand how the department is structured does not mean I don't believe for a second that the state promotes the three SC based metros as you have advocated.....I would hesitate to call them the big three, they are not big.

So, answer this........why is it fair to the people that I highlighted for them to pay taxes and watch the state focus development efforts primarily on Greenville, Charleston & Columbia? Especially when selling this area to companies that would never look at Greenville, Charleston or Columbia could enhance their area dramatically? Adding this element to SC's recruiting efforts helps the state with higher tax collections and also gets it in the game to go after other companies that just may locate elsewhere in the state? Right now, SC is not good at attracting those companies other than grabbing a few from Charlotte. It has the ability and tools to go after more but, with your approach, seems limited by protecting the three SC based metros, that is sad.

The fact that this is an argument is embarrassing. If state officials are having these same arguments, SC is not going to advance much past attracting manufacturing because of cheap labor. Honestly, when I started this thread, I thought it would be much more about including all parts of the state in development efforts. There will always be a manufacturing, tourism, and government aspect to SC's economy. But, to dismiss the notion of attracting large international high impact companies to the state only because you want to focus on the three SC based metros is way beyond logic. And then you make the assumption that I care only because I am offended because SC is not focusing on helping to grow Charlotte? That is garbage, you accused me of twisting words and yet you are trying to speak for me?

Your take on FM is interesting...cheap gas, fireworks, etc.....Allen Tate spoke about how quickly the York/FM area was growing and labeled it as the next Southpark/Ballantyne. Not to be dismissive but I think Allen Tate knows a little bit about real estate in the Carolinas. In other words, a lot of people see the value in this area except those trying to protect the traditional three SC based metros of SC. I don't understand that logic.
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Old 04-24-2014, 06:20 PM
 
3,200 posts, read 3,893,976 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gsupstate View Post
Gotta say, I agree with GSP101 on this whole thread. SC is being very shortsighted to not promote the burbs of Charlotte that exist within the SC boundary. Charlotte's best burbs head South / Southeast toward SC.....SC could walk away with some prized business developments if it promoted the area more. Reminds me of Memphis, TN and the Mississippi burbs of Memphis.....Mississippi got smart and "grabbed some of the gold" away from Memphis and TN. Disagree with Akhenaton06/Rochelle/Mutiny77 or whatever other multiple post banned name he is going by at the moment on City-Data.
You know GS, this one baffles me. SC has an opportunity to grow in other sectors where is weak. But, these guys want to protect the three SC based metros. I don't get it. And, even worse, it would not cost a ton to recruit, the payback would be well worth it.
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