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To date, Pay Pal has cancelled a 500 job operation in Charlotte, Deutsch Bank has cancelled expansion in Raleigh....at least 250 jobs. Asheville lost out on a 500 job opportunity and the pipeline of new job announcements is drying up. Business recruiters for the state have said that the phone calls are falling in a big way. This is in addition to the many many concerts that have cancelled and conventions which have moved. Charlotte will most likely lose the NBA All star game costing the state close to $100m not to mention international exposure. The NCAA just passed legislation that will forbid any state to host events which has these laws on the books.
The costs to the state are enormous considering the law was passed so that someone who does not agree with the LGBT lifestyle can refuse service to them or fire them without cause. The state is losing a ton of cash to appease less than 1% of the population. Not a good business proposition.
On the flip side, Bobby Hitt needs to be calling all of the businesses looking at NC and recruiting them across the state line.
Ok. The NCAA and NBA, etc, are not typical businesses.
Boycotts can go both ways too. You are going to see a lot of people stop watching NBA, for example. Good busineeses don't get entangled in politics, partly because their own employees have a diversity of political stances.
I don't think there is any evidence most companies have a problem with NC not allowing men in female restrooms. A few vocal CEO's opposed to the law does not make a majority.
There are obviously not a ton of men who even want to use the women's bathroom so it is basically a non-issue.
I don' think anybody beleives that a majority of lawmakers and citizens in SC are opposed to the NC law so doubtful it is going to be a good recruiting tool for SC.
Last edited by ClemVegas; 05-03-2016 at 08:15 PM..
Pay Pal and Deutsche Bank are very real. The NBA is very real in terms of dollars.
Here is the bottom line.....the bathroom part of the bill is a sideshow. The law protected a set of citizens except LGBT. It removed the right to sue in state court, a lower hurdle than federal courts. It removed rights from local governments. Now, NC is controlled by a guy from Henderson County who resembles Porky Pig and a redneck lawyer from Cleveland County and Rockingham County.
Johnny Harris is one of the top developers in the SE, his thoughts were that HB2 is hurting NC in so many ways. NASCAR has come out against HB2.....hardly a "liberal" group.
Some pharm companies in the triangle have stopped expansion plans. Econ development is partly a momentum game, it is hard to get back once lost. Right now, NC is on the verge of taking a backseat to neighboring state because the state leaders think it is a good idea to segregate a group of people so that a few florist can refuse service to a gay wedding......sad but true.
The bathroom stuff is just to divert attention from the real part of the radical law......interestingly written by Dan Bishop, a one term rep from SE Charlotte.
I doubt the Charlotte Hornests franchise does that great in ticket sales already due to it not having very good teams most of the time. I don't think it is smart for them to do what they are doing given majority view in NC is ok with the law. I won't be surprised at all if the franchise has to move in a few years.
How can we be free people if we must provide a service to somebody else? That sounds like slavery to me. How can you be for freedom of religion if you want people to be forced to do things that go against their religion. If somebody doesn't want to sell me a pencil, I'll just buy a pencil from somebody else. I'm not going to try to get government to force specific people who don't want to sell me something to sell it to me.
There is money to be made in NC, it it just a matter of which companies make the money. I don't beleve a majority of companies are so political that they want to lose money over this issue. 'Transgender' people are a tiny percentage of the population.
That bathroom issue was the main focus of the bill.
Last edited by ClemVegas; 05-03-2016 at 09:06 PM..
The hornets average around 17,500 per game, not too bad. Current value of franchise exceeds $750,000,000, again, not too bad. Not many businesses are worth that much.
so, if you open a business and intrepret your religion to not serve black people.....why is that ok? Same logic. I do see your point, I would buy elsewhere and doubt anyone foolish enough to turn away business will be around long term.
But, the main points of HB2 are not about the bathroom, McCrory wants to play that out. He was on John Boy and Billy laughing about it. The main points are about having different rights for different people......something clearly against the constitution.
From a business perspective, you want to be able to attract top talent and operate in a place with good laws but also a place where people want to live. It's why Charlotte and Raleigh are growing so rapidly. If NC changes, as the politics are suggesting, companies can go elsewhere. Pay Pal is being recruited by Maryland. Other states have reached out to BofA about moving the HQ. HB2 makes it easier to drop NC from relo considerations and that is what is happening. The majority of NC citizens want HB2 repealed but Dan Bishop is talking about Carpet bombing and McCrory is on John Boy and Billy......not a good example for recruiting business.
The hornets average around 17,500 per game, not too bad. Current value of franchise exceeds $750,000,000, again, not too bad. Not many businesses are worth that much.
so, if you open a business and intrepret your religion to not serve black people.....why is that ok? Same logic. I do see your point, I would buy elsewhere and doubt anyone foolish enough to turn away business will be around long term.
But, the main points of HB2 are not about the bathroom, McCrory wants to play that out. He was on John Boy and Billy laughing about it. The main points are about having different rights for different people......something clearly against the constitution.
From a business perspective, you want to be able to attract top talent and operate in a place with good laws but also a place where people want to live. It's why Charlotte and Raleigh are growing so rapidly. If NC changes, as the politics are suggesting, companies can go elsewhere. Pay Pal is being recruited by Maryland. Other states have reached out to BofA about moving the HQ. HB2 makes it easier to drop NC from relo considerations and that is what is happening. The majority of NC citizens want HB2 repealed but Dan Bishop is talking about Carpet bombing and McCrory is on John Boy and Billy......not a good example for recruiting business.
Without the Jim Crow laws, there would have been ton of white people serving black people back in the day. The free market and capalitism and the profit motive will provide the things people need if not interfered with by the government. People have numerous options for cakes and flowers etc for weddings. It is a total non-issue.
Companies were never attracted to NC because of the kinds of things that you are talking about. They came to make money. Business and political activism are not the same thing. It is not reasonable to believe that all companies are going to leave, if some companies leave, that means others companies are going to come in to take their market share. Most people want to make money. It is not like every company is going to make a pact with each other not to do business in NC.
You brought up the law as a negative for NC and its business climate, which I disagree with and you also asserted somehow SC would benefit from it. Given SC is a 'red' state, I am pointing out that SC is not going to benefit from the NC law. SC has not had any city issue the same ordinance that incentivized the passing of the state law in NC, otherwise a similar law would have been passed here. Companies that want to bail a state for passing that kind of law ought to just stick in states like NY and Vermont.
I do not believe the majority of people in NC want it repealed. I think it would be upheld quite easily in a referendum vote and I hope they do allow the citizens to vote on it.
Last edited by ClemVegas; 05-03-2016 at 09:51 PM..
Without the Jim Crow laws, there would have been ton of white people serving black people back in the day. The free market and capalitism and the profit motive will provide the things people need if not interfered with by the government. People have numerous options for cakes and flowers etc for weddings. It is a total non-issue.
Companies were never attracted to NC because of the kinds of things that you are talking about. They came to make money. Business and political activism are not the same thing. It is not reasonable to believe that all companies are going to leave, if some companies leave, that means others companies are going to come in to take their market share. Most people want to make money. It is not like every company is going to make a pact with each other not to do business in NC.
You brought up the law as a negative for NC and its business climate, which I disagree with and you also asserted somehow SC would benefit from it. Given SC is a 'red' state, I am pointing out that SC is not going to benefit from the NC law. SC has not had any city issue the same ordinance that incentivized the passing of the state law in NC, otherwise a similar law would have been passed here.
I do not believe the majority of people in NC want it repealed. I think it would be upheld quite easily in a referendum vote and I hope they do allow the citizens to vote on it.
First......you said NC was not losing business because of the law.....wrong.
Now, you think companies are not moving to NC because of the talented workforce.....wrong.
You think companies will come in to file void of Pay Pal...etc.....wrong.
Most polls, not associated with right wing activist groups, have shown that the majority epwant HB2 repealed.
In short, you are clearly wrong and should just drop it. You really don't know much about what you are writing.
NC is not going to lose net business over time. Your premise is that every company cares about the issues that you care about, based on a few vocal CEOs, who have not moved their businesses out of the state thus far.
People in NC a few years ago voted aainst gay marriage so it is not reasonable to believe a majority of them are ok with men going into female restrooms, or against the religious liberty laws that you oppose. I believe more people in NC are for this bill then opposed gay marriage.
I don't believe a majority of legislators in NC would have passed the bill if they knew they were out of touch with the citizens of the state. They have put themselves at risk of losing their next election if true.
Companies move to NC, or any state, because there is a business reason and it helps them serve their client and remain profitable. It isn't about politics.
Any business that leaves the state is gong to have 1 or more replace it if there is a viable market. The ones that don't leave may even expand as they start getting more business do the lack of competitition created by the companies that leave.
Last edited by ClemVegas; 05-03-2016 at 10:14 PM..
As far as NC cities go, Wilmington, Greensboro, Winston Salem are all fine for most people, and there are numerous other small cities that are fine like Southern Pines. In my view, you are not limited to Raleigh and Charlotte and Asheville. Asheville is not for everybody so I would research it on the Western NC forum.
Wilimington has the best downtown in my view, and it doesn't hurt the beach is nearby as well.
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