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We cant say the people misusing the loans is a few bad apples, but then label every person on unemployment as a lazy weasel whos trying to avoid work.
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Originally Posted by Labonte18
Now.. We can go round and round and round about the 'living wage'. the $15/hr crowd is out of their minds.. HERE. Elsewhere.. That's probably too low. And let's be honest. There's not a whole lot of jobs left out there that pay minimum wage. That big chicken plant up on Rutherford? They're up to $11/hr, I think, plus I believe there's a ton of hiring bonuses. I went by Pizza Hut on Butler a few minutes ago. They have a sign hiring drivers with a $600 sign on bonus. Look around at these places. they're NOT paying minimum wage.
Not sure why people act like its such a crime for other people to get paid, and want to be paid. And for the record, I dont think the government should just throw $15 at everybody either, for multiple reasons. Also dont get the obsession with the number 15. $15 is great in Bamberg or Union, but is poverty in Miami.
I think everyones wages should go up. If fast food goes up, teachers, firefighters, nurses, associates, engineers, young professionals, construction workers, farmers, flight attendants...everyone deserves a raise. But we should stop demonizing people for wanting better pay because of how we perceive the worth of their job.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Labonte18
So.. Why can't they get people? I'd love to say that all the worker pool they relied on went to college during the pandemic and has better jobs now. We both know that's not the case.
Why were people who were working at Pizza Hut before the pandemic expected to come back to Pizza Hut after the pandemic? Not everyone who was teaching pre-pandemic will be teaching come August. People move to other fields, find other opportunities, go into work for themselves, go back to school, do side hustles, do online work, etc. There's also people who are still staying home - and not collecting unemployment. Yes some people want try to take the easy way out, but that's some people, not everyone.
Also no one said people now have it better. I know someone who was working at Chickfila making $10...now hes at McDonalds making $10. This pandemic has been long, peoples plans change.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Labonte18
No, the people who were really hurt and still are hurting are the gig workers. It's getting better for them, but it's still.. Not great. Your DJs.. Weddings have been scaled back, bars aren't necessarily doing karaoke nights.. Things like that.
Sure, but the problem is: McMaster and friends arent focused on DJs and wedding planners. Everyone is focused on factory and service workers. When people say "everyone needs to get back to work", no one is referring to DJs, everyone is referring to "the fast food workers who are staying home and collecting checks, making more than me." But we ignore one big thing: that most companies still aren't back hiring in full force.
Glad you can read minds. We all know what PDude meant. It was rather obvious. Don't be so obtuse.
What exactly do you think "PDude" meant? I guess I'm obtuse 'cause I don't have a friggin' clue what you're suggesting I said.
After benefits run out, of course people will go back to work, even for pathetic wages. It is stupid to even suggest otherwise. Many employers know that also, which is why they went whining to the guvnah.
What I meant was exactly what I said. If employers, particularly in the service industry, would pay people wages that would support something resembling a life, there would not be a workforce shortage of any meaningful size. I guess I'm lazy, because if I could only work two jobs while federal pandemic benefits were available to me, I would take the benefits and get a break from the third job I otherwise needed to pay rent and buy food.
What I meant was exactly what I said. If employers, particularly in the service industry, would pay people wages that would support something resembling a life, there would not be a workforce shortage of any meaningful size. I guess I'm lazy, because if I could only work two jobs while federal pandemic benefits were available to me, I would take the benefits and get a break from the third job I otherwise needed to pay rent and buy food.
Real world translation: You've just described someone who has made poor life choices and instead of obtaining a marketable skill, they chose to knowingly enter an occupation that pays low. And the market determines wages moreso than the employers. Yeah, Econ 101 states this.
Yes, yes....the world needs servers, kitchen help, etc. Teenagers and young adults working their way thru college/culinary school can take them. Very, very few servers make exceptional wages (tips + wage).
Kindness and empathy don't care about reality & facts. Raise wages to levels they aren't intended to be at, and restaurants close and more people are out of work. The automated kiosks are coming.....
Real world translation: You've just described someone who has made poor life choices and instead of obtaining a marketable skill, they chose to knowingly enter an occupation that pays low. And the market determines wages moreso than the employers. Yeah, Econ 101 states this.
Yes, yes....the world needs servers, kitchen help, etc. Teenagers and young adults working their way thru college/culinary school can take them. Very, very few servers make exceptional wages (tips + wage).
Kindness and empathy don't care about reality & facts. Raise wages to levels they aren't intended to be at, and restaurants close and more people are out of work. The automated kiosks are coming.....
Since you know it all, what do you say to the folks who have marketable skills and marketable degrees, but still can't get a job because [white collar] companies aren't hiring? What do you say to a recent grad who just spent 5 years getting a specialized masters degree from a top 10 university, and still cant get hired right now?
You could say "work any job until they land that position they deserve", okay...and most do, but, they're supposed to sit there with that marketable skill and get paid s---t while they wait for HR to hopefully one day respond to them?
And man: I just love how "not learning a marketable skill" is a poor life choice, yet using business loans to fund personal vacations, strip club visits, new cars, and a llama farm is not one...interesting.
Also automated kiosks were coming before covid-19 and before wage hikes. Theyre not "stealing jobs."
His order doesn't take effect until the end of June, which if current trends keep up could be completely reasonable. Of course the federal unemployment expires 60 days after that anyway.
But no business paying waiting staff $2.13/hour plus tips should ever be complaining about staffing shortages.
Well said. To many low paying jobs and those owners as the ones bytching the most.
Wah wah wah I cant find workers and I’m going to go out of business. How the **** do you think workers felt in 2008-2010 when no one was hiring? Shut up and taste the medicine and we will call you a wahmbulance. Honestly I’m so sick of this ****. What’s good for the goose is good for the gander. That’s how a market works. It’s a two way street. Workers don’t get to go cry to daddy government every time something doesn’t go their way and employers shouldn’t be able to either.
Owning and managing a business comes with risks. If your business can’t make it then that’s just how it is. Try again later. I’m sick of the government bowing to employers and inflating demand by propping up failing industries and companies. Let them fail (within reason - 2008 was an exception for the security of everyone).
I’m just over it. I’m sick of “the free market” except when it isn’t convenient for you. Pull yourself up by those bootstraps. Maybe you should have been saving and investing over the last 11 years when we had a bull market. I’m sorry but if your business consistently runs at a loss then it should go under because it’s not sustainable. Suck it up. That’s life. People lose their jobs, homes, and livelihood at the hands of the market and employers shouldn’t get special treatment.
Realize that we are in the middle of a ****ing pandemic not seen since the early 1900s and that maybe, just maybe, if we had handled this the way China did and shut down for a month we could have all been back to semi normalcy since last May. But no we couldn’t do that could we? Now we want to complain instead of owning the mess we created.
If you want to attract workers then offer a living wage, full time hours, benefits, leave time, and convince people that you have the necessary precautions in place to keep your employees safe AND respected. If a customer disrespects your workers throw them tf out. Deny them service. Stand up for your front line workers. Value them and they will do what you hired them to do.
And for the restaurants complaining that no one wants to work because they won’t get paid enough even at $12/hour because tips aren’t involved and you can’t raise wages higher because restaurants run at a loss, THEN YOU CANT AFFORD TO RUN A BUSINESS. LET ME REPEAT. YOUR BROKE ASS CANT AFFORD A BUSINESS. Seriously. That’s like opening an ice cream shop and not budgeting for the ice cream machine.
This hacks me off so much. I’m sick of it. Whiny sniveling ass misers. To all the small business owners that value their employees and are doing everything right, I empathize. But there are funds available and you can always close and reopen later on. Save in the meantime. Get a side gig. You have to make your own success in life. That’s just how it is for all of us. To the scumbag employers, you reap what you sow. Lie in the bed you made and cross your fingers they don’t come for PPP loan money next.
Wah wah wah I cant find workers and I’m going to go out of business. How the **** do you think workers felt in 2008-2010 when no one was hiring? Shut up and taste the medicine and we will call you a wahmbulance. Honestly I’m so sick of this ****. What’s good for the goose is good for the gander. That’s how a market works. It’s a two way street. Workers don’t get to go cry to daddy government every time something doesn’t go their way and employers shouldn’t be able to either.
Owning and managing a business comes with risks. If your business can’t make it then that’s just how it is. Try again later. I’m sick of the government bowing to employers and inflating demand by propping up failing industries and companies. Let them fail (within reason - 2008 was an exception for the security of everyone).
I’m just over it. I’m sick of “the free market” except when it isn’t convenient for you. Pull yourself up by those bootstraps. Maybe you should have been saving and investing over the last 11 years when we had a bull market. I’m sorry but if your business consistently runs at a loss then it should go under because it’s not sustainable. Suck it up. That’s life. People lose their jobs, homes, and livelihood at the hands of the market and employers shouldn’t get special treatment.
Realize that we are in the middle of a ****ing pandemic not seen since the early 1900s and that maybe, just maybe, if we had handled this the way China did and shut down for a month we could have all been back to semi normalcy since last May. But no we couldn’t do that could we? Now we want to complain instead of owning the mess we created.
If you want to attract workers then offer a living wage, full time hours, benefits, leave time, and convince people that you have the necessary precautions in place to keep your employees safe AND respected. If a customer disrespects your workers throw them tf out. Deny them service. Stand up for your front line workers. Value them and they will do what you hired them to do.
And for the restaurants complaining that no one wants to work because they won’t get paid enough even at $12/hour because tips aren’t involved and you can’t raise wages higher because restaurants run at a loss, THEN YOU CANT AFFORD TO RUN A BUSINESS. LET ME REPEAT. YOUR BROKE ASS CANT AFFORD A BUSINESS. Seriously. That’s like opening an ice cream shop and not budgeting for the ice cream machine.
This hacks me off so much. I’m sick of it. Whiny sniveling ass misers. To all the small business owners that value their employees and are doing everything right, I empathize. But there are funds available and you can always close and reopen later on. Save in the meantime. Get a side gig. You have to make your own success in life. That’s just how it is for all of us. To the scumbag employers, you reap what you sow. Lie in the bed you made and cross your fingers they don’t come for PPP loan money next.
Classic example of someone who shoots themselves in the foot.
Businesses can't get workers, can't make money, can't keep the business. They don't buy product, the people who supply/make the product get laid off.. Vicious cycle that reaches far and wide.
Too many people have this attitude right here.. All about them. What they fail to realize is that the better the business they work for does, the better it is for them.
Admittedly.. In some places that's a rose colored glasses view of things and employees/employers don't have such a symbiotic relationship, or don't recognize it needs to be that way. But one thing is for certain.. if the business you work for goes under.. That becomes a problem for you.
I’m going to leave this here, don’t care to get into the politics of it. But a lot of the businesses are complaining about not having enough workers because there’s too much business. As someone that works in food and bev, I see this first hand. We’re understaffed for the amount of business we’re getting, as we’re almost doing double the sales a day we were before COVID. I’m averaging about $25 an hour on what has become our usual day, a bad day it might come down to $15 and hour, and on good day, $30-50 an hour. Most people just don’t want to work because they can sit at home and live comfortable. But there’s also a lot of opportunity out there for people to make money on their on time like Uber, Lyft, Doordash, etc. I would say I’m underemployed as far as the job title goes, compared to my skills and background. But I make the same and sometimes more than people that are at my skill set. Walking away with 4-7k a month, working 4 or 5 days a week at 8-9 hours a day. I would gladly support dropping the unemployment pay amount, to get people back into the workforce.
Remember PUA is $300/week, $1200/month. This doesn't include any health benefits either. I don't think people are sitting at home living comfortably on that.
We are still in the middle of a pandemic and you don't just shut the switch off. There are people that can't go back to work because their doctor has told them they need to isolate. There are other reasons why people haven't returned to work. This isn't a one size fits all situation. I am sure people would love to get back to work. As another poster mentioned, there are ways to do this correctly such as give incentives or other options. The PUA will run out before you know it. Why not just let it run it's course like every other state is doing? People are aware of this. Hopefully all of this will encourage employers to increase wages and pay a living wage as well.
Remember PUA is $300/week, $1200/month. This doesn't include any health benefits either. I don't think people are sitting at home living comfortably on that.
We are still in the middle of a pandemic and you don't just shut the switch off. There are people that can't go back to work because their doctor has told them they need to isolate. There are other reasons why people haven't returned to work. This isn't a one size fits all situation. I am sure people would love to get back to work. As another poster mentioned, there are ways to do this correctly such as give incentives or other options. The PUA will run out before you know it. Why not just let it run it's course like every other state is doing? People are aware of this. Hopefully all of this will encourage employers to increase wages and pay a living wage as well.
We are at the end of a pandemic. At least the downhill side.
We have vaccines available that are HIGHLY effective, though not perfect.
Very few people are being told to isolate or quarantine. Only those who test positive and they are a small and getting smaller number. Today was a high number in the state. 400 cases. A far cry from the thousands back in January.
Again.. I see this as an opportunity to convince those that are hesitant. I don't care about the anti-vax group.. nothing's gonna change their mind. But that group that thinks things were done too fast.. Well, there's 100+ million people in the US vaccinated. No vaccine ever has had a side effect discovered more than 2 months after the first administration of it.. I look at this, in a way, as a crap or get off the pot moment.
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