Lakota Indians Withdraw Treaties Signed With U.S. 150 Years Ago (Sioux Falls: 2010, crime)

[Jammie]

Am I now banned from using smilies?

It sounds like you don't like negativity, so it's best if you just present your story and what you also know first hand. You point the finger at how everyone else is so negative, but please reread the things you've written. It's too bad that after all the things you have gotten throughout your life, you have the nerve to make the comment about us wanting to renege on your medical and dental care, too.

I don't believe that Russell Means is white or ever has been white so which group won't let go of the past?

Now, I'll just give you the floor so you can explain to all the out of staters who have no clue about the history of all of this just how oppressed and hated and neglected you've all been. My only hope is that they themselves research the treaties and also the amount of money that goes to the reservations yearly.

[smitter]

Wow the floor....wow!! Thank you!
Learn how to read first.

What have I gotten through out my life , do you know me personally?

Neither side is letting go of the past... hows that.

I will not and can not speak for others. L i k e I s a i d , I can only speak for myself.
What would you like to know about me?

( are the cameras on?) that is supposed to be at least amusing.

[Chris19]

Originally Posted by smitter

I am 27/32 enrolled member if that means anything to anybody but me and mine. Russell Means can speak for himself. I speak for myself.

It only gets very unproductive to be negative. It doesn't require much to become perturbed when I read such a snowball effect.
One person starts " well my friends are native and they do this or that" then others jump right in with their "I saw this happen" A vicious cycle that never ends, so discouraging.
I guess I will continue to try not to speak badly of others, that is a very hard thing to accomplish and I don't succeed many times.
Being negative is the easiest thing to do.
Another easy thing is to giving advice when none is asked. Yes, your way maybe a better way but, by gosh getting it shoved in front of oneself isn't appreciated, it only makes for more bad feelings. H e l l o !! I could probably find fault with every person I meet, every person has faults that is the easy way.

Teach a man how to fish. Maybe understand your pupils. From what I see, there really is a lack of knowledge in many areas.

White people need to forget the past and forwards also. A person can hog the two way street, but there will be consequences usually not a positive one either.
Every action has a reaction doesn't it?

Education is the only thing that can help any people not just natives.

I sense that there is a misunderstanding. I did not intend for my post to be used as a tool in a pie throwing contest. The arguing seems childish. I can understand some of the points brought up by Smitter, but Jammie has some valid points and is trying to be fair and reasonable given the misunderstanding. I understand that the Native American/White issues is a very touchy topic; but it can be discussed on the forum with expressing opinions without turning it into a pie throwing contest.

The teaching a man how to fish part was poorly done by the US government decades ago along with some of the corrupt tribal governments but the leaders of the tribes along with tribal members need to take a sincere initiative to improve education: one being making sure the kids go to school and having parents involved in the kids' education. They also need to see to that the students succeed in school and graduate high school and go on to vo-tech, university, or trade school to develop vocational skills to offer talents and services in the reservations. The finger pointing and pie throwing contest will not solve this: cooperation and effort from both whites and natives is key to improving education. It will benefit whites with lower amounts of tax dollars going to welfare programs and Native Americans with a chance to succeed and a better way of life. To succeed, there has to be a will and a vision. I honestly feel that the Native Amercians can do this.

[Butterfly777]

Originally Posted by awoods2

I have had the "pleasure" of meeting Mr. Means. I do not hate him.... I do not trust him, I do not like him.... but I do not hate him.
I have spent a lot of time on the Pine Ridge Reservation, I have many Native American friends on and off the Rez. The truth is Russell and the American Indian Movement (AIM) are terrorists and murders, (maybe some prefer freedom fighters????). Take a look at their record, you will find the truth. Russell has done his time for his crimes, but I just wish he stop trying to start wars. Many on the front lines are my friends.

Adam

Oh, I apoligize, i didn't mean that others were being hateful to R. Means. I ment I can hear the hate in his voice when he speaks, I can feel his rage towards the U.S, the government and the white race. I personnally believe he is a racest. So then, how does one who has so much hate for everyone else stop hate??

He cannot, all he is doing is feeding more hate! What a person feeds will grow.

[DannyBanany]

Originally Posted by Butterfly777

Oh, I apoligize, i didn't mean that others were being hateful to R. Means. I ment I can hear the hate in his voice when he speaks, I can feel his rage towards the U.S, the government and the white race. I personnally believe he is a racest. So then, how does one who has so much hate for everyone else stop hate??

He cannot, all he is doing is feeding more hate! What a person feeds will grow.

Great theory: How does one who has so much hate... stop hate? I think that summarizes my entire perspective on Russell Means and his whck-job ideas.

[blackhillsdreams]

Originally Posted by Jammie

First of all, New City~I don't know where they get those stats from. Visit the reservations and you'll understand why I say that. They do have running water, but often sell their sinks and bathtubs that the government has provided for them in the new homes they give them.

Yes, they have a very high rate of TB. I'm sure once they become totally independent from the white man, they will tackle that issue.

Is it everyone else's fault that they over eat and over drink and have Type 2 diabetes? And yes, they do have a very short lifespan. Suicide and accidents while intoxicated can definitely shorten a life.

Again, are we to blame that they break laws and become incarcerated? Wish we could all do things we wanted to do and when we're caught, place the blame on others.

Since the Sioux receive free medical and dental care as long as they're registered with a tribe, it might be time for the females to go in and receive their free medical exams. It may lower their cervical cancer deaths.

Since they will no longer be relying on government commodities, it will take care of the awful sugary food that the government is poisoning them with.

Yes, my income would be very low, too if I didn't go out and get a job and KEEP it. Most employers frown on you skipping the following two work days after you receive a paycheck.

Whoever wrote those stats~I'm requesting addresses of the Indian homes that lack sewage and electricity. They don't pay their own heat bills~the government gives them an alloted amount yearly to heat their homes. Maybe if they could at least work part time, they could subsidize their heat. I'd also like to see the stats of names and addys of all those that freeze to death every winter. I've read about it on occasion such as someone who went out and laid in a ditch or on the road and was found frozen to death the next morning. It's just not wise for anyone to do that.

17 people in each home? Where are these numbers coming from? I've been to many reservations and none of this is even factual.

Jammie is spot on. Every one of the tragedies listed in New City's post could and should be addressed by the people suffering from them.

The biggest problem in this equation is their entitlement mentality and the need to place blame on others for their problems instead of taking responsibility for themselves.

White people don't speak Lakota? How is it remotely our responsibility to ensure that they "average age 65" Lakota speaking elder passes the language on to younger generations that don't care to learn it?

How is it our responsibility to continuously offer jobs to people that don't want them and don't want to work in the first place? (Don't push me on that one, I've personally done it and was totally taken advantage of).

How is it our responsibility to give land back to a people that sold it for $$ when they actually conquered others to get it in the first place?

The gang/rap/thug culture is huge on the res with the younger generation. If you don't think that opens up doors to criminal behavior, you are blind. That entire cultural program centers on taking what you want because you are entitled to it. It doesn't promote a reward for hard work and effort or even intelligence.

Russell Means' grandaughter was pregnant at 13 and not living with her parents.... maybe that was our fault too.

[smitter]

I am here on a new years eve night, not drunk like all the other natives.


I actually detest alcoholic drinking (oh no, one slipped through), but don't you worry I will probably die of something before my time. (tb, diabeties type2, SMALLPOX Sorry, couldn't resist)


blackhills dreamer >Spot on<...what? are you from England, I'd rather doubt it, I think your just trying to impress somebody, maybe yourself, maybe Jammie, who knows???? Sorry, I don't know you.... either

Jammie> I read from your previous post; that you wish you could do the things you want to do and when get caught, blame others. What kind of things do you wish to do and place the blame on others? Should people be worried? sorry, couldn't resist that either.

Please, keep reading.

Jammie another question would be from another post from your, not small minded opinion (Sorry,still having a hard time resisting) is concerning the natives you know, being as you described as "happy and content" is this something they told you or is this what you assume, because they get everything for free?
Can you answer it ....please? Yes, I know there should probably be an apology from me, why I don't know!

Here is a little something to think about.

Maybe if your ancestors were more careful with their words you people wouldn't be in your "why should we be responsible" predicament.

It is your responsibility by inheritance, because your ancestors signed the treaties to provide, as long as the grass grows and the river flows. Even if it wasn't your particular ancestors that signed the treaties, your ancestors and you have profited, from said treaties.

My opinion is:
Apparently, native foresight provided for more than you think. If you don't like it, move to another country and make treaties that you like better, maybe by then, you will be more adept at wiping out the indigenous.
Maybe, then you can think of your future generations to come too.

You made the rules to play by and now you don't like them. Sorry!
Pretty simple.


I know, I am a terrible person for saying what is the truth.

Didn't think a prairie ****** had a clue did you?


Believe what you will its still is a free country .

Blame it on Russell Means, hell, blame it on Bush, just blame somebody huh?

Oh yeah....Sorry! and ....have a nice day.

[awoods2]

Originally Posted by Butterfly777

Oh, I apoligize, i didn't mean that others were being hateful to R. Means. I ment I can hear the hate in his voice when he speaks, I can feel his rage towards the U.S, the government and the white race. I personnally believe he is a racest. So then, how does one who has so much hate for everyone else stop hate??

He cannot, all he is doing is feeding more hate! What a person feeds will grow.

I am truely sorry that I snaped back so quickly at you. I am misunderstood your intentions. I guess I have run into too many people in this world that belive that Russell (and others like him no matter race) speak the truth and speak for "their" people.

Adam

[SCGranny]

For heaven's sake.
I'm married to a 1/2 Indian (Blackfoot-Cherokee) and his father (full) was the hardest working man I ever knew including my own father. He refused his roll number and refused to pass the info down to his family (some of whom wanted the benefits without the tribal commitment) so that they could sign up for their numbers. Tough old man.

So I can't speak to the reservation life. What I can speak to is this: for 20 years I have worked with the poor, the downtrodden, the suicidal, the alcoholics, the domestic abusers, the children-having-children, uneducated people who populate my area. I have delivered 7 babies in my ambulance - all but one who were born crack-addicted or HIV pos, or both. I have physically held down drug and and alcohol addicts who were attacking members of their own family or police officers or themselves or emergency workers until they could be either arrested or have their wounds bandaged. (I am 5'3", 130 lbs). I have cleaned them up from drunken wrecks where they have done things in vehicles that were nothing short of mechanically amazing... and a year or so later, did the same thing again. and again. I have listened to them complain about how hard their lives are, how everyone is against them, how they cannot make it on their own. And my hubby of 25 years was by my side on the ambulance, doing the same thing. We. Know. Poor. We. Know. Suffering. We. Know. Addiction. We. Know. Disease.

And one thing we do know is that you cannot help those who refuse to help themselves. You cannot educate, house, medicate, clean, provide for, or ever fund people like this enough - because instead of taking up the challenge to better themselves, they sit back and demand still more, insisting that they are 'owed'. Know what? I don't owe them a danged thing. And neither does anyone else. It is called personal responsibility, and everyone is responsible for their own lives in a Constitutional Republic - even the descendants of slaves, even the descendants of murdered masses, even the descendants of the malformed, mistreated, abandoned, and abused.

My father in law would be angry and ashamed of his tribal heritage if he saw this. He got off the reservation, got an education, got a career, got the wife/kids/house with the white picket fence he wanted, without taking a durned thing from anyone. And his son my husband carried on that tradition. It is a much prouder tradition, much more productive tradition, and much more permanently satisfactory tradition than one of sloth and self-pity. And everyone has the ability to do the same thing - whether they choose to do it or not. Because that is what it all boils down to, no matter your heritage - a choice.

No smilies here. We have a saying in our family - if you want "sympathy", you'll find it in the dictionary, between "syphilis" and "s#!*". You can talk about the nobility of whatever, you can talk about rights and values, you can blame the gummint or your mommy or daddy or society or racism or even twinkies, but it boils down to this - each person is responsible for their own life. You decide if you will add to, or detract from, the nobility or respect that your race or your family - or even you - receive.

Flame away.

[Jammie]

SC, that was a very good post. Cheers to your family and ancestors who took pride in rising above their situation. You sound like you're in a compassionate profession where you unfortunately see firsthand all the things talked about here.