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Old 03-14-2019, 06:11 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2Q&Lrn&Hlp View Post
Isaiah 45:8-10 shares God's reason for creating the earth:


"For this is what Jehovah says,The Creator of the heavens, the true God,
The One who formed the earth, its Maker who firmly established it,
Who did not create it simply for nothing, but formed it to be inhabited:
'I am Jehovah, and there is no one else'."


I believe it stands to reason that one could exchange the word 'universe' for earth', & see the reason that God created -& is continually expanding- the universe. I do not believe, however, that the time has come yet, to spread living creatures living on other planets throughout the universe. He is too wise for that! First must come the complete settling of all the issues between God & his creations thus far. Only then will it be in the best interests of all concerned to expand life onto other planets. There will be a universal precedent set, based upon the failure of mankind to rule himself, which will go into place, and it will keep peace throughout the universe for all eternity. . . .



However, there already are other life forms in the universe, just not living on planets of the universe:


"Are There Intelligent Creatures in Outer Space?"

You might want to read the forum rules.
To clarify as there seems to be some confusion about this lately:
This is the Science forum. We have a separate Religion forum where you can post about Religion, but please don't do it here. There is a clear line between the two, and if you cross it your thread/post might be moved/deleted and you might get an infraction for it.
Yac.

This is the Science forum, not Religion forum.
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Old 03-20-2019, 08:43 AM
 
Location: In the realm of possiblities
2,713 posts, read 2,332,191 times
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I have always had my beliefs about life beyond Earth, and that was based on the sheer number of worlds that are scattered throughout the universe. Even if someone based their belief of life on other worlds on the formulas that Carl Sagan, and others have put forth, there is still randomness in the universe, and that cannot be predicted.


There are so many anomalies in just our world alone that it boggles the mind. If we struggle just to explain discoveries, and past events here on Earth, then it seems unjustified in making statements about the unlikelihood of life elsewhere. We just cannot be certain.



I am in no way dismissing the efforts of any science professional as their work has been a boon to innumerable discoveries in many different fields. Possibly one day in our future we will have the ways, and means to travel to other worlds. Then, so many questions will be answered.
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Old 03-20-2019, 09:00 PM
 
Location: Earth
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jQ5lPt9edzQ
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Old 03-23-2019, 01:45 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by harry chickpea View Post
I agree that it is irrelevant anyway, barring the discovery of some previously unknown dimension at the core of "spooky action at a distance."

The idea that because there are many stars there must be many with planets holding intelligent life is a flawed use of probability.

"No amount of fancy probabilistic analysis can justify treating guesswork and wishful thinking as having any sort of scientific weight."
https://medium.com/starts-with-a-ban...e-8f31a559f741


The old Drake equation is:

N = R ∗ ⋅ f p ⋅ n e ⋅ f l ⋅ f i ⋅ f c ⋅ L

where:

N = the number of civilizations in our galaxy with which communication might be possible and
R∗ = the average rate of star formation in our galaxy
fp = the fraction of those stars that have planets
ne = the average number of planets that can potentially support life per star that has planets
fl = the fraction of planets that could support life that actually develop life at some point
fi = the fraction of planets with life that actually go on to develop intelligent life (civilizations)
fc = the fraction of civilizations that develop a technology that releases detectable signs of their existence into space
L = the length of time for which such civilizations release detectable signals into space

The problem with this is that it is far too neat and simplistic and doesn't take into account factors that were unknown at the time. Even a cursory examination shows that "fl" assumes "at some point" and then uses that as a number - as if the planet ALWAYS could carry life. "fl" has other problems as well. Vast swaths of planets or moons get eliminated for various failings, some of which we likely don't even yet know. Instead of a single "fl", that part of the equation needs to be broken down further.

So, in doing that, we run into multiple exclusions of planets that make the fraction almost impossibly rare if we consider life based on carbon and water as the only life capable of advanced evolution.

Must be in Goldilocks zone AND
Must have a magnetic pole as shielding AND
Must have a suitable mix of elements on it (leaving out most early arrivals) AND
Must not be bombarded with radiation (leaving out just about all stars and planets near a galactic core) AND
Must have sufficient atmosphere with suitable mix of gases AND
Must not have an excess of toxic or mutagenic compounds AND
I could go on with dozens of other requirements.

These are not "choose any three" but every single box must be checked.

As for advanced life, Earth has had multiple mass extinction events, millions of tries at various plants and animals, created intelligent life in animals that can't be effective with tools, such as dolphins and whales, and even only one of many species of humans made the jump to social intelligence and cooperative civilization resulting in advanced technology.

Stating that because there are massive numbers of stars there must be numerous civilizations of intelligent beings is like saying that because there are massive numbers of grains of sand on a beach that one of them must have created a pizza.

Once we have a greater understanding of the extreme rarity of the combination of events that created our civilization we might have a more realistic understanding of whether any others exist. Remember that evolution favors brute strength, toxicity, size, fecundity, and meanness. Intelligence has never been a big marker of evolutionary success before.

If I had to guess, I would place the odds (at best) as about one civilization capable of getting into space per medium sized galaxy.
Even if that was accurate, it would still mean there are millions of advanced civilizations out there though!!
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Old 03-24-2019, 07:19 PM
 
Location: Somewhere in northern Alabama
18,547 posts, read 55,485,543 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rstevens62 View Post
Even if that was accurate, it would still mean there arexxx could be millions of advanced civilizations out there though!!
Fixed it for you. Lack of knowledge does not equal certainty. For all we know there could be some weird other requirement for intelligent life.
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Old 03-25-2019, 01:41 PM
 
Location: Seattle
2,396 posts, read 506,465 times
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I've sometimes wondered, in the potentially vast diversity of the multiverse, is it possible that some form of space is itself is capable of being intelligent? I.e. can points in this hypothetical space store, process, and communicate reasonably sophisticated information with other points in space? I can't even imagine how immensely smart such a life form could become.
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Old 03-25-2019, 08:33 PM
 
Location: Somewhere in northern Alabama
18,547 posts, read 55,485,543 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rjshae View Post
I've sometimes wondered, in the potentially vast diversity of the multiverse, is it possible that some form of space is itself is capable of being intelligent? I.e. can points in this hypothetical space store, process, and communicate reasonably sophisticated information with other points in space? I can't even imagine how immensely smart such a life form could become.
You might want to read https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Maker I think it is in public domain and on Project Gutenberg as an ebook.

Also https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Black_Cloud

Hindu thought is sort of based on what you describe as well.
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Old 04-05-2019, 03:21 AM
 
5 posts, read 1,211 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peregrine
How any sane person can't fathom life as advanced as ours or even more advanced in this universe is beyond me.
Indeed so Peregrine... I think there may be other life like ours here in our own galaxy... (Hidden from view)

Space is amazing,i cant comprehend it and I dont think anyone can.......

Space fascinates me...... I have alot of questions that I dont think anyone can answer!
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Old 09-03-2019, 10:49 AM
 
4,264 posts, read 8,019,405 times
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This video has some interesting points.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PqEmYU8Y_rI
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Old 09-04-2019, 07:34 AM
 
Location: Maryland
2,180 posts, read 737,031 times
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The bottom line is, we really don’t know. The following quote is by someone I saw on a talk show and expresses my sentiments precisely; I unfortunately cannot remember the author of this line.

“We are either alone in the universe, or we are not. Either way, it’s incredible.”
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