Can a public school MAKE a parent accept placement in "Special Ed" class for an Asperger child? (autistic, functioning)

[h886]

Originally Posted by syracusa

I am not sure I understand. Is he in regular classes but has some Special Ed support? If he is in a Special Ed class, what does it mean to be "mainstreamed"? Thanks.

Being "in special ed" doesn't mean the same thing it did when we were kids. Back then, it was more common that any kid with a label be sent to a different room. In this century, the focus is on keeping any kid who can possibly stay in the classroom in the class room. The law requires the "least restrictive environment" or LRE. That means that if your kid could function with an aide in a regular classroom, that is where they have to put them, not put them in a separate classroom with only special ed kids. If your kid cannot function in a regular classroom even with extra support, then they might need to go to that separate classroom to get the help they need. This could be for some classes (maybe just math or English) or all classes. Or it could mean he has such a profound disability that he needs to work on life skills and not be in the regular classroom. But again, it doesn't sound like that would be necessary in your son's case. That is generally done for kids who are profoundly affected or for kids who are very far behind academically and cannot catch up in a regular ed classroom.

"Mainstreamed" means to be in a regular ed classroom. He may have some accommodations listed on his special ed paperwork, such as him being seated next to the teacher or near the front of the room to minimize distraction or to make it where the teacher can tap on his desk subtly if she sees him getting off task, rather than have to walk across the room and make a scene. It may mean he gets more time for tests, or has an aide come work with him so many hours per week. It may mean that his teacher and special ed caseworker have a different behavioral modification plan for him than other kids. So maybe the rest of the class has one set of rules, but your son gets an extra warning or he and the teacher have a secret signal or code word to remind him a behavior is not okay. They have seen this before and will help work on a way for your son to be the most successful.

[DubbleT]

Education For Special Needs Children GA (http://www.atlantalegalaid.org/education_special.htm - broken link)

I suggest telling the school and getting an IEP set up. You, as a parent, have a say in how the IEP is drawn up.
My son's IEP had plans and goals for helping him deal with ADHD, it spelled out very specifically some of the ways in which his teachers were required to help him.
It's a legal document that you can fall back on if you feel the school is not accommodating your son's needs.

As far as the labeling goes, frankly I'd rather the teacher know ahead of time that my child has problems with this or that, than to let them draw their own conclusions and label him as just lazy, stubborn, etc.

[nana053]

To the OP:

I think that in general, many children with autism are in regular education classrooms with support nowadays. The law says that the child must be in the Least Restrictive Environment that he can function in.

My grandson is 7 and his autism is relatively severe in terms of his ability to do things verbally. He was in a special needs classroom at 5, but mainstreamed part of the day with one of the aides from the classroom. He was taken to the kindergarten for circle time and for some other activities. He also gets speech therapy and consultative OT.

He went to kindergarten in a regular class last year with no aide and a resource teacher for pull outs so that he got small group teaching for the academic skills he was weak in. His strength is math, his weakness is reading comprehension. His kindergarten teacher was fantastic and made accommodations for him so that he never missed the same activities when he was in his pullout classes.

He will be going into a regular first grade classroom with resource support at the beginning of the year with the option of re-evaluating for special needs classroom after 6 weeks (He has problems with the larger class size of the regular room and sometimes melts down when it gets to be too much for him. He is allowed to have a break in the resource room when that happens).

With a child who has asperger's who does not have behavior problems, it is very unlikely that a school will want to place the child in a special ed classroom. Note too that the special ed classrooms you see today are quite different from those that kids were placed in years ago. I can't speak for Georgia, but I see much better trained teachers here and they have access to specialists for help with difficult behaviors. There are, of course, some bad schools and bad districts where abuses happen, but it is unlikely that your child would be in that situation.

[syracusa]

Originally Posted by Zimbochick

I am saddened that you would label other children with issues in such a disparaging light, but are so defensive of your own child. All parents wish the best for their own children.

Zimbo,

I am now rushing out the door to drive to another city. I guess I will comment more on the above when I get there, as you have severely misunderstood what I said.

In a nutshell, I believe my own child, with his weaknesses, could bring out the worst in other children with weaknesses!! When placed together, children with weaknesses simply influence each other in not so positive ways instead of pulling each other up.

If you understood that I see my own child as a perfect snowflake who would be damaged by "bad kids", then you got it wrong.

I just simply don't want him encapsulated with children with behavior problems just like I wouldn't want HIM to have the opportunity to manifest his own weaknesses and mess up - HIMSELF! - other people's kids that way.

For example, I noticed that, when in the presence of smaller, less mature children and when left to his own devices, he tends to get way too silly for his age. Socially mature children definitely have a better influence on him than a Special Ed kid would have. The reverse would apply. Other kids with such weaknesses could benefit from being with socially mature kids as opposed to just kids like my son - who has his "moments".

[Zimbochick]

Originally Posted by syracusa

Zimbo,

I am now rushing out the door to drive to another city. I guess I will comment more on the above when I get there, as you have severely misunderstood what I said.

In a nutshell, I believe my own child, with his weaknesses, could bring out the worst in other children with weaknesses!! When placed together, children with weaknesses simply influence each other in not so positive ways instead of pulling each other up.

If you understood that I see my own child as a perfect snowflake who would be damaged by "bad kids", then you got it wrong.

I just simply don't want him encapsulated with children with behavior problems just like I wouldn't want HIM to have the opportunity to manifest his own weaknesses and mess up - HIMSELF! - other people's kids that way.

For example, I noticed that, when in the presence of smaller, less mature children and when left to his own devices, he tends to get way too silly for his age. Socially mature children definitely have a better influence on him than a Special Ed kid would have. The reverse would apply. Other kids with such weaknesses could benefit from being with socially mature kids as opposed to just kids like my son - who has his "moments".

Sorry if I misunderstood you. The use of the word "weakness" generally has negative connotations. In a school setting children are always going to react to the way other children act, and other's personalities, you can't get away from that. That is the same argument many parents have against placing their children in inclusion classes wih children who have issues. But it's important to remember so-called "normal" classes are filled with challenging children too. The bottom line is you are going to tie yourself in knots if you try to control every little aspects of your child's education. Sometimes you have to give the school and the teacher the information and trust them to do their job. Sometimes things go awry, but in most all instances they actually know what they are doing.

[h886]

Originally Posted by Zimbochick

Sorry if I misunderstood you. The use of the word "weakness" generally has negative connotations. In a school setting children are always going to react to the way other children act, and other's personalities, you can't get away from that. That is the same argument many parents have against placing their children in inclusion classes wih children who have issues. But it's important to remember so-called "normal" classes are filled with challenging children too. The bottom line is you are going to tie yourself in knots if you try to control every little aspects of your child's education. Sometimes you have to give the school and the teacher the information and trust them to do their job. Sometimes things go awry, but in most all instances they actually know what they are doing.

This is sound advice. And it's prudent to remember that every parent wants the best possible scenario for their child. It's simply an innate biological response to want the very best for your offspring, even at the expense of others, to want the situation tailor-made to the benefit of your child. So many parents of "average" kids would love their kids placed in an advanced class, if such a thing exists at that level, so they can be influenced by the more gifted kids. Some parents of advanced students want their class only limited to the same so that they aren't slowed down by average students. The parents of well-behaved children want the kids with behavioral issues (sp ed or not) kicked out of class, but if your child has behavioral issues (and only so much of that is nurture--some kids are just bull-headed), you'll be the first to advocate on their behalf. The same pattern follows no matter where your child is, all the way to parents of a child with a mild disability not wanting them placed with children with profound disabilities.

It's impossible to please everyone. Much of the time now they simply mix everyone who can feasibly be mixed, which I think is one of the better of the imperfect solutions. You're going to encounter the same in real life anyway.

[jasper12]

I am all for Least Restrictive Environment, but...sometimes it is not in the best interest of the child. If a child will recieve more specialized attention, and assistance in a smaller, SPED class, that may be better. In the case of your son, I think that you are not aware that other SPED kids might have the same issues as your son, and yet you are already discriminating against SPED kids...interesting...you automatically assume he will be in with kids who have behavior problems, or whatever...I think that you need to listen to the school on this, go into the classroom yourself, and evaluated what is best for your child. A smaller environment now, might help him develop his social skills. And then, he could be mainstreamed at first or second grade.

[nana053]

Originally Posted by jasper12

I am all for Least Restrictive Environment, but...sometimes it is not in the best interest of the child. If a child will receive more specialized attention, and assistance in a smaller, SPED class, that may be better. In the case of your son, I think that you are not aware that other SPED kids might have the same issues as your son, and yet you are already discriminating against SPED kids...interesting...you automatically assume he will be in with kids who have behavior problems, or whatever...I think that you need to listen to the school on this, go into the classroom yourself, and evaluated what is best for your child. A smaller environment now, might help him develop his social skills. And then, he could be mainstreamed at first or second grade.

Most children with aspergers do NOT require a special education class. They *may* require supports in the regular class.

Many children with autism require special education classrooms because they cannot work in the larger classroom, however there are others who can and do function in the regular classroom.

My granddaughter has never had an aide or any official accommodations and does well in the regular ed classroom. She needs social supports, but functions well in the classroom and scores in the 97% on the standardized tests. I would never want her in a special education class given what she needs. Children are individuals. Some need special classrooms and some don't. My grandson, her brother, otoh, may need a special classroom if he cannot function in the regular 1st grade classroom next year. We are worried that having the noise of 25 to 30 children will be a problem for him. Of course, the problem with the special education classrooms here is that they are not necessarily appropriate for him either. We would love to find a private school with a regular ed curriculum, but small classes of around 15 children. Not doable where we are though. Even the private schools have large classes and the special schools are far away (it would mean an hour travel each way to the school we like).

[Zimbochick]

Let me just re-iterate the school district where the OP's son is going has "inclusion" classes which is a regular ed curriculum, and has a mix of kids, those needing extra services, and those not needing extras. This is separate from traditional SPED.

[syracusa]

Originally Posted by jasper12

I am all for Least Restrictive Environment, but...sometimes it is not in the best interest of the child. If a child will recieve more specialized attention, and assistance in a smaller, SPED class, that may be better. In the case of your son, I think that you are not aware that other SPED kids might have the same issues as your son, and yet you are already discriminating against SPED kids...interesting...you automatically assume he will be in with kids who have behavior problems, or whatever...I think that you need to listen to the school on this, go into the classroom yourself, and evaluated what is best for your child. A smaller environment now, might help him develop his social skills. And then, he could be mainstreamed at first or second grade.

I am sorry to be so blunt, but you didn't understand a thing. I am not discriminating against ANYBODY. I am discriminating against a certain type of environment that I, as a parent, along with the psychologist who evaluated him, along with any sane person who met my son, would deem completely inapropriate for him. The psychologist herself reiterated in her report that he belongs in a regular class.

He is a normal child in one million ways. He is connected, he can converse like no tomorrow, especially with adults (with children too), he has a huge vocabulary, he is highly sensitive and perceptive and he DOES (very much does) understand emotions, facial expressions and everthing in between. He just has some weakness areas - including ability to join in a game with more children, a bit too self-driven, tends to interrupt and sometimes gets carried away with what he wants to say and looks away while talking, can become very naggy once he experiences some negative emotion, deals poorly with spur-of-the-moment changes, particularly when it is something he was looking forard to and now it has to be canceled, changed, postponed, etc.

However, none of his behavior would strike anyone as "weird". Most would shrug it off within the range of "normal but difficult child".
He is the kind of child that you would have to get to know very intimately to realize that he has some oddities/difficult behavior-related aspects.

A child like that DOES not belong in a SPED class. If a school (any school) decided so about this child, that would no longer be called "our school".
It is as simple as that.

I don't know for sure what would be best for SPED kids.
I do know what is best for this child and that would NOT be a SPED class.