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You're in for a surprise. "A normal attention span is 3 to 5 minutes per year of a child's age. Therefore, a 2-year-old should be able to concentrate on a particular task for at least 6 minutes, and a child entering kindergarten should be able to concentrate for at least 15 minutes." ~ Pediatric Advisor: Attention Deficit/Hyperactivity Disorder (ADHD): How to Help Your Child
5 seconds is extremely short since he should be able to concentrate for 9 minutes at three years old. It would be different if he was off by a few minutes, but you are literally saying seconds, and that's extremely abnormal even at his age.
Oh thank you good web doctor! This is a prime example! I don't believe in normal btw.
My son is a healthy, active little boy above any cookie cutter assesment. I don't want him to sit still for 15 minutes, it's not who he is. We are raising a generation of robots, apparently.
Good luck with labeling your ducklings instead of accepting them.
The reality is the majority of children with either ADHD and/or learning difficulties fall within the grey area making them quite difficult to diagnose, so false positives and false negatives are quite common.
Most of the time children who are diagnosed with ADHD or learning difficulties know they are different. Ignoring the fact does nothing but make them feel more "other". Educating them on what they need to do to accomplish goals is far more beneficial for their overall success and ego than denial.
I agree. Kids know when they're different and need to be taught tools to develop their strengths and accommodate their weaknesses. The other kids usually know when one of their classmates is different.
At FIVE and THREE the brain isn't even developed. Basically you're giving a child a lifelong identity before he/she can even read. That just sounds off. Kidd are smarter than we think. Sometimes letting them know something is wrong can cause problems.
Billy: Am I stupid Mommy?
Parent: Of course not, honey!
Billy: Well why is my desk away from all the other children's?
Now I know this doesn't indicate low intelligence at all, but it would confuse a 6 year old. Children strive to "fit in", so we shouldn't make them feel like the odd one out by unnecessary overtreatment.
I agree. Kids know when they're different and need to be taught tools to develop their strengths and accommodate their weaknesses. The other kids usually know when one of their classmates is different.
Do all the kids diagnosed know? Or sometimes do the parents become paranoid?
I remember being 7, I wouldn't notice if there was ketchup on my chin.
Sometimes letting them know something is wrong can cause problems.
Children strive to "fit in", so we shouldn't make them feel like the odd one out by unnecessary overtreatment.
You're right, sometimes letting them know causes problems. But not addressing the problems can be just as bad. You have to look at the child and his or her situation. There's always a risk/benefit analysis. If the right approach is being used, the likely benefits need to outweigh the known risks before a child is separated from his or her peers and before they're told something is "wrong."
Over treatment is a problems, but so is undertreating children who need help. And I'm not talking about medicating kids. There are a lot of things that need to be tried before any discussion about medication should be held.
Do all the kids diagnosed know? Or sometimes do the parents become paranoid?
I remember being 7, I wouldn't notice if there was ketchup on my chin.
Yes, I don't think many kids "know" at a young age they are different. My daughter didn't. I think even many adults assume that others experience reality in the same way they do, and that of course is not the case. It wasn't until about fifth grade. for example, my daughter mentioned that her brain sometimes "blanks out," and she may briefly see images or flashes of light etc. She thought this was something everyone experienced. At that point, we had her tested for a possible seizure disorder. This was just one of many issues she has encountered over the years, and when she was little, she just didn't know she was not in step with other kids her age.
I know my daughter is certainly not alone in this. I used to help the struggling readers at my daughters' school, and they didn't seem to realize they were "different." My dd even mentioned that one kid told his friend happily that he was in a higher reading group in class. He had no idea that other kids his age were not struggling like him. He is a very high energy, happy kid, who is using his energy on the sports field. I'm glad no one is telling a kid like him that there is something "wrong" with him. Instead he is quietly getting the help he needs.
If kids are not aware that they are "different" from the norm, then great. But when they do know, are people seriously suggesting not saying anything to avoid "labels"? If you haven't had to address this issue I think having an opinion about it is swell but pretty meaningless. Unless you've had to deal with a child crying every night because they are different and can't keep up with their peers you really don't know. Explaining a child's learning difficulty to them is most often the kindest thing to do. It doesn't give them excuses but answers.
Another child at risk for low self esteem issues: the child who is constantly disrupting class for the other students because the teacher has to continually turn his or her direction away from the rest of the class to stop and redirect him or her from dangerous and disruptive pursuits. I have observed it many times, especially in pre-k programs...other kids latch onto who is the "disruptive" kid right away and complain about and avoid him or her. The child then gets frustrated at being avoided and acts out further, and disruptive behavior escalates. Peers get sick of the kid who can't/won't attend and routinely derails class, too, even at a very young age.
I was reading a favorite story to a mixed classroom of three- and four- year olds about a week ago, and 19 of 20 kids were seated, listening raptly. Now, this particular program does take into account that children are not at uniform developmental levels, and we do have several children with developmental disabilities who do, at times, have problems attending for the length of time it takes to read a 6-7 minute long story. It is not a problem if a student is not able to attend to the story, they may excuse themselves and choose one of a variety of non-disruptive options in which they may safely engage without intensive adult supervision until the teacher is done reading with the other children.
That is not the case with the 20th child, in this scenario, we'll call him "Tommy." His repeated behavior of choice is to engage in attentionseeking behavior until the activity is successfully derailed and he has successfully obtained negative attention from everyone in the room, peers and teachers alike. During any group activity (happen only during transition times and last 10 minutes at most, usually with a song, group game, movement activity, or story), he will immediately jump up, start running around the classroom, pull bins of toys and materials off shelves, scatter them, repeatedly shout over the top of the person leading the activity, etc. Most disruptive behavior does function as attentionseeking, and is therefore most effectively extinguished by simply not attending to it. However, this effective response is not feasible in all settings. In a group of preschoolers, it is dangerous to simply ignore a child running at top speed around a classroom, throwing things, as he or she will likely injure himself or others, and may escalate until that outcome occurs. And even if a teacher chooses to ignore even minor disruptions, peers will not, as the "tattle-tale" stage of development is in full swing at this age. "Umm, Ms. S....Tommy's in the kitchen throwing plastic food at the window, not listening to the storrrrrryyyyyyy," will get repeated 15 times, and the group activity has been successfully derailed, even if the teacher has been attemting to extinguish the undesirable behavior through her own refusal to attend to it. The kid still got the negative attention, which reinforced the behavior, and will cause it to repeat.
The harsh reality for Tommy is that because he can't/won't comply with classroom routines, he has few friends. The other kids won't play with him, have to be prompted to include him, etc., because he is so disruptive. Which of course causes him to feel socially excluded and act out more,often aggressively, in response. Tommy's issues are behavioral and escalating. He will struggle in kindergarten, behaviorally, in large part because his social skills are far behind, and he has been unsuccessful in practicing attending to activities. It's sad, because his current setting is a great time for early intervention. His issues have been well-documented, with loads of data taken on behavioral antecedents, etc., patterns identified. But without parental support, intervention can't happen. And Tommy's parents are of the "He's just a little boy, why SHOULD he be expected to sit still" persuasion. To them, learning how to follow classroom routines is akin to "being a robot," rather than a necessary skill for future success. The end result is a child with severely escalating behavior that is growing increasingly dangerous, and is contributing to peers' ostracizing. In short, making excuses for age inappropriate behavior has snowballed and has not done him any favors.
Children "feel different" when their behavior sets them apart and alienates them from peers. This can have tremendous effects on self esteem. But when parents refuse recommended intervention, and choose to turn a blind eye to red flags early on, it can definitely be an outcome.
If the child is in an environment around other kids, they'll figure it out sooner or later (assuming that they don't have severe cognitive delays). I think letting them know that they're different is fine as long as you don't make it seem like a bad thing.
ETA: The child with Autism that I babysit knows that he's different. He gets pulled out and goes to a special group when he has reading/language arts while the rest of the class stays with the teacher. He has a lead vest that he wears whenever he needs to calm down (other kids don't). He knows that he's different. I don't think he cares.
Oh thank you good web doctor! This is a prime example! I don't believe in normal btw.
My son is a healthy, active little boy above any cookie cutter assesment. I don't want him to sit still for 15 minutes, it's not who he is. We are raising a generation of robots, apparently.
You're in for a big surprise. The schools won't let your son be "who he is" without an IEP or a 504 requiring them to accommodate his inability to sit still. You either want him to be who he is or you don't want labels. You can't have both. Since you're so fearful of labels destroying his self esteem, I anticipate you will homeschool him eventually.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Megan2514
Good luck with labeling your ducklings instead of accepting them.
My ducklings are in their twenties leading independent, productive lives in different states. They both have very unique careers that they couldn't have achieved if I didn't accept them for being unique individuals with unique talents and interests.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Megan2514
And..I'm entering the snake pit.
At FIVE and THREE the brain isn't even developed. Basically you're giving a child a lifelong identity before he/she can even read. That just sounds off. Kidd are smarter than we think. Sometimes letting them know something is wrong can cause problems.
Billy: Am I stupid Mommy?
Parent: Of course not, honey!
Billy: Well why is my desk away from all the other children's?
Now I know this doesn't indicate low intelligence at all, but it would confuse a 6 year old. Children strive to "fit in", so we shouldn't make them feel like the odd one out by unnecessary overtreatment.
What makes you think your son's desk will be away from the other children's? What makes you think he won't notice he's not doing as well as the other children even if he doesn't have services?
No matter what you do, even not having him evaluated and avoiding labels, your son will notice his performance isn't measuring up to his peers if he is struggling and has an ounce of intelligence in him. The only way you can avoid that is to put him a bubble to prevent him from having access to other children's performance.
Even without an IEP or 504, your son will probably be required to sit in the front of the classroom due to his inability to sit still. That way the teacher can minimize distractions and reprimand him every time he moves. Doesn't that sound like a nice future for your healthy, active boy? You're not doing your son any favors by not helping him learn how to sit still for a few moments.
Last edited by Hopes; 09-15-2014 at 10:02 AM..
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