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Old 09-12-2013, 12:13 AM
 
119 posts, read 180,176 times
Reputation: 229

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My husband and I are feed up as well. My husband grew up here and hoped to raise a family here. My parents bought a retirement home here (we are from new England) and after my father died I came here and ended up getting married. I lived in Draper and SLC for a few years (for better medical care) and now in st George.

It started with little things like how now matter how much I paid for a building lot every CCR or the city turned down a plan for a brick house, or solar, or even a few said I needed to have my master bedroom on the bottom floor. Then watching the city turn down so many businesses and projects (like a roller rink, water park, ice skating rink and stores that like habor freight, soma(a bra store), hobby lobby, cvs). Then watching kids summer camps go away. Sure there are a few rec center sports but not much else(compared to cities our size, for art, music, cultures, diversity). Next watching a new hospital yet few specialists (and not built to OSHA standards), so still driving to slc for a 15 check up with a dr.
My husband never thought he would not like it here till he started to see the massive welfare fraud , and this is done by LDS and non LDS and the some very weathly people. My husband saw how many of our self employed LDS neighbors cheated to get mediciad especially for maternity while we are paying over $1k a month for bare bones coverage. When a few got investgated for fraud the coverup was so blatant. Then at the high school being told they only had information on Utah colleges and if your child wants to go to school outside find out for yourself. I did my research to ensure my kids can go to whatever college or program that they want to but so many kids are disappointed when it is too late. I see so many smart hard working kids that could have gotten into wonderful out of state schools with scholarships but no one told them they need more foreign language or science, they took they "Utah" requirements.

The jobs make me sad for the young people. I am lucky due to my education and I have a flexible income. My husband worked for peanuts for years, when he got married he got a raise (his lds boss said he now had a wife and future family to support). When my husbands boss became a bishop my husband had to run everything so he ended up starting his own business. Best thing we ever did. Taxes stink and insurance is high but we took the LDS culture and it made his business successful. My husband will answer his phone 24/7. My husband will work on a sunday or evening. This has made all the difference. If LDS don't want to work on sunday, great my husband will. If the LDS don't want to work after 5 to be with kids , great my husband will. My husband works less then 40 years, just odd hours that no one else will work and does very well. I hate seeing all these 19-22 year old newlyweds working $8-10 a hour jobs and starting families and trying to get a house and struggling. If you want to get married young fine, but get a certificate, trade, skill, or go to college. Just waiting a few years would mean so much stability. It also means maybe going out of state to train if you really want to live here for a career like a medical specilaity that Dixie doesn't offer, or technical skill.

I just get sad seeing my kids grow up and have no real chance for independence. What happened to been a teen and going to a mall? or riding your bike to by a candy bar? (most kids I know live in Bloomington/little valley/Washington fields/santa clara) These kids just go to school, maybe play a sport or 2, go to scouts, maybe play the violin and take 1 family vacation a year. I know kids (from good families that have educated career parents) and they just never leave the neighborhood. Going out to the factory outlet 2 times a year is a big deal. I have kids that are excited to go to a grocery store or to pick up dry cleaning with me and my kids because they never get out of the neighborhood. Would it be so horrible if a city area of over a 100k have a roller rink, Hollywood connection, water park, ice skating rink, something for kids to do? I grew up in a town of 15k and we had over 100 summer camps(from candle making, Japanese, law, painting etc), ice skating and roller skating. I even lived in a village in New England of less then 2k people with more for kids and families to do.

The only issue I have had with LDS stuff is my daughter get teased for wanting to go to college and have a career before marriage. Gasp, my daughter even said she might not want kids or only 1 and she took a lot of abuse for that!

Our final straw is our neighbor rented out their home and it is now has over 20 people crashing in and it has been a year and nothing is done. I live in a nice neighborhood near school and the city will do nothing even though at least 10 laws are being broken daily. I have lived driving 650 in a day to see a dr, ignored the massive welfare fraud, fighting for classes to get my kids ready for college, making my own summer camps, traveling in the summer for my kids to see museums and try new activites but now that I have to live in fear every night(It is literally that bad) I think it is time to leave. It is such a hard stage of our lives to move and my husband business is great but if you don't feel safe and your quality of life is poor, what good is nice weather and "outdoor activities and parks".
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Old 09-12-2013, 09:11 AM
 
359 posts, read 573,115 times
Reputation: 356
Good luck Silverspoons, I know many people in your same boat that moved. Sad it has to be that way!
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Old 09-27-2013, 04:54 PM
 
1 posts, read 8,937 times
Reputation: 34
I can relate to much of what is written here... we've been in St George for over 4 years and still feel like outsiders. If you are part of the LDS community, then you have your brothers and sisters, but they are not overly kind to non LDS. We have a neighbor in a nice community that has decided to start a puppy mill, and have to put up with barking dogs. Animal control has done nothing. We will likely relocate in the very near future.

It is too bad, there are a lot of nice things about St George, relatively low crime, excellent 2A rights, etc.

Very hard to make friends if you are not LDS. We are catholic and not biased about religion...

Last edited by RedRock; 09-27-2013 at 05:03 PM.. Reason: grammar
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Old 10-03-2013, 09:22 AM
 
Location: Southern New Jersey
175 posts, read 536,404 times
Reputation: 405
So in other words- If you're not LDS, you're not worthy of being treated Christian or with kindness? Sounds a lot like the Amish in Pa. If you're not Amish, you're not really "welcome" in their area. This isn't 100% of the Amish- but some, not all Amish will not help other non-Amish people. For insistence, my sister-in-law lives in a heavily populated Amish area, and she can't even get the local Amish mechanic to look at her vehicle. Nor can she get her car towed unless she calls a tow truck from much father away because the local Amish truck driver won't help non-Amish people. I'm sure that this doesn't happen everywhere-and that not all Amish people are like this. But if you're not LDS, you basically don't exist or aren't worthy of being treated Christian? I don't get it. And I've heard over the years how beautiful St. George is, and at one time even considered moving there. But a Christian like me in a non-Christian community? Not gonna happen. I'd be a pariah from day one since I'm not of their faith. Yes-I did say non-Christian. If you cannot treat others the way the Bible dictates, then in my book you're not really Christian. LDS are another whole religion that doesn't fit into any Christian category as far as I can see. You set up a religion based on the fact that the only ones who matter are your own? So sad that so many people come there to St. George and are never felt welcome or that they truly belong. Guess a lot of places are like this. Shouldn't be that way- but it is.
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Old 10-03-2013, 01:11 PM
 
Location: Salt Lake City
21,866 posts, read 21,987,770 times
Reputation: 10620
Quote:
Originally Posted by ohnonothimagain View Post
LDS are another whole religion that doesn't fit into any Christian category as far as I can see.
When you have this attitude towards them, why on earth would you expect them to have any warm, fuzzy feelings towards you?
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Old 10-03-2013, 01:56 PM
 
1,961 posts, read 3,746,962 times
Reputation: 2762
Quote:
Originally Posted by ohnonothimagain View Post
So For insistence, my sister-in-law lives in a heavily populated Amish area, and she can't even get the local Amish mechanic to look at her vehicle. Nor can she get her car towed unless she calls a tow truck from much father away because the local Amish truck driver won't help non-Amish people.
I know this is taking it off topic here, but since you brought it up. I am not sure if you realize what you are saying here. I am sure she would not get an Amish tow truck drive to tow her car because they DONT DRIVE. and perhaps the mechanic would not look at her car, because, well they DONT DRIVE.
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Old 10-03-2013, 04:16 PM
 
1,009 posts, read 3,627,779 times
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Whenever there is regional flooding, the Mormons always seem to be the most organized (as compared to non-Mormons) and help everyone! They just get things done, often in unison with non-Mormons . . example. They open some of their facilities (not the temples) to the public for purposes such as blood drives, and even to other denominations who have lost their church in a fire or flood for example.
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Old 10-04-2013, 03:29 PM
 
119 posts, read 180,176 times
Reputation: 229
Quote:
Originally Posted by tortoise View Post
Whenever there is regional flooding, the Mormons always seem to be the most organized (as compared to non-Mormons) and help everyone! They just get things done, often in unison with non-Mormons . . example. They open some of their facilities (not the temples) to the public for purposes such as blood drives, and even to other denominations who have lost their church in a fire or flood for example.
I lived in a subdivision that lost homes during the big flood. The LDS church was wonderful and organized. There is no arguing that as an organization they do a lot of good work, both here in Utah and in other areas. When I went to college in new England I remember some missionaries totally transforming an older community park. It doesn't take away from watching a 10 year old in tears because she is the only non-lds girl in her class and is rarely invited to a birthday party. The charity work as an organization is great but it is not carried on to the individual level(in most cases).
My daughter's class got 6 new out of state kids that moved here because of parents jobs. These parents are shocked by the lack of ability to be "real friends" with your neighbors. Yes my neighbors are nice. yes they would help me if my car didn't start or if I needed a cup of sugar. Will I ever see a dinner invite, NO. Will we ever get invited to go camping, atv riding, or to the park, NO. I do not drink, smoke and am pretty conservative with my kids (maybe even more strict then my lds neighbors) so there is no reason 2 faiths can't be friends? I grew up in a half Jewish, half Christian town. Religion wasn't an issue, of course we worshiped on different days and my Jewish neighbors had traditions about cooking food that we respected during dinners. I almost get the feeling some families do not want kids to know there are any other faiths out there? I know very smart teenagers, 4.0 students, that look dumbfounded when I talk about how many people in the world are Muslim or Catholic, they really think LDS is the majority. One parent got upset when a teen asked how many Mormons were at my high school and I said 1 out of over 2500 students.
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Old 10-04-2013, 04:02 PM
 
Location: Salt Lake City
21,866 posts, read 21,987,770 times
Reputation: 10620
Quote:
Originally Posted by silverspoons View Post
Will I ever see a dinner invite, NO. Will we ever get invited to go camping, atv riding, or to the park...
Just curious. Have you ever taken the initiative and invited any of your LDS neighbors out to dinner, camping, ATV riding or to the park? It does work both ways, you know.

Quote:
I know very smart teenagers, 4.0 students, that look dumbfounded when I talk about how many people in the world are Muslim or Catholic, they really think LDS is the majority.
You're probably right. I think this is simply a matter of ignorance. Here's a quick fact you might want to consider sharing with such kids the next time this topic arises in a conversation. The LDS Conference Center in Salt Lake City seats 21,000 people. If you were to take the world's population today and condense it into 21,000, strictly along religious lines, and were to put those 21,000 individuals in the Conference Center, only 42 seats out of the 21,000 would be occupied by Mormons. That simple fact might help put things into proportion for these decent but clueless kids.
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Old 10-24-2013, 09:45 AM
 
4 posts, read 11,835 times
Reputation: 25
I'll respond to the OP. I don't really "hear" any bitterness in your writing but instead an attempt to delve into what went wrong with the life that you were trying to create here in St. George. The part about the low wage problem is correct. I'm in healthcare and I actually live in St. George and work in California because the pay in my case is about a 17.00 dollars an hour difference. It's worth it to me to go and work several 12-hour shifts in a row and come back for a week or two and then go do it again. Yes, it's cheaper to live in St. George compared to CA but not 35,000 dollars a year cheaper - so comparatively speaking the wages are low. I also agree that St. George is absolutely stunning. St. George, to me, has actually managed to pull off growth in an attractive way. I love the downtown - and the trail system is amazing and they continue to improve it.

I think a lot of people who didn't grow up LDS won't understand what I believe to be the main problem that you were hashing out here in your post. People who grew up LDS and are still active in the Church won't get it either.
I think I hear you. I DO understand your sorrow about the experience you had in your Ward. My heart hurts for you just reading about it. I'm sorry that you and your wife had to experience that.

GoOutSideAndPlay has some very good advice, “In religion, you obey, therefore you are accepted. With grace, you are accepted, therefore you obey. In religion, motivation is based on fear and insecurity. With grace, motivation is based on grateful joy. In religion, you obey God in order to get things from God. With grace, you obey God to get God, to delight in and resemble Him, (Keller, 2012) ” There’s a huge difference. Don’t be discouraged - once you find it, you can really be happy anywhere. While God never promised life would be easy, he did promise he would always be by our side." Very well said, GoOutSideAndPlay.

There is nothing wrong with exploring different places, and different ways, to worship until we find our "home" with like-minded people. While St. George is predominately LDS, there are other options - I've heard good things about the "New Life Christian Center". It is difficult though to make a commitment to another religious group, after being LDS your entire life - the idea of it can seem very wrong - but there is nothing wrong with trying it to see if you can find a better fit for your life.

I wish you well.

P.S. Don't go back to AZ - it can in no way compare to St. George.

Last edited by annieq; 10-24-2013 at 09:52 AM.. Reason: to
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