Which area to move to in and around St. George (Hurricane: sale, rentals)

[Chickrae]

Sounds great, I will have to check it out and thanks for the link. I am not really artsy but I do like outdoor concerts etc

[nicknageli]

Originally Posted by Steadykat

IMHO: The bust hasn't even truly begun here yet.

"The report says the St. George area saw filings jump 446 percent year-over-year and 56 percent from the first quarter of 2008 to the second quarter."

"Vardell Curtis, chief executive officer of the Washington County Board of Realtors, said . . . for potential home buyers, waiting limits choices and can increase cost. With inventory levels going down, homes will cost more."

http://www.thespectrum.com/apps/pbcs...WS01/808030308

Never ever trust what a realtor tells you, even your own.

[GentilePatriot]

Originally Posted by Nomianca

...As for St. George neighborhoods, I would stay away from Dixie Downs area...[snip]

I might be relocating to St. George and am investigating the community for this purpose. If I may ask, what's wrong with the Dixie Downs area? Since there are very few blacks in St. George, does your comment suggest Dixie Downs is where the Mexicans live?

My main concerns are safety, convenience, and affordability, in that order. Although very few people will admit it in public, we all know that where there are relatively large concentrations of blacks or Mexicans, there also will be relatively higher violent crime rates.

If Dixie Downs is concentrated with Mexicans, then obviously it will have a higher violent crime rate, as well as higher dependency on taxpayer-provided welfare and other government services.

[coolcats]

Originally Posted by GentilePatriot

I might be relocating to St. George and am investigating the community for this purpose. If I may ask, what's wrong with the Dixie Downs area? Since there are very few blacks in St. George, does your comment suggest Dixie Downs is where the Mexicans live?

My main concerns are safety, convenience, and affordability, in that order. Although very few people will admit it in public, we all know that where there are relatively large concentrations of blacks or Mexicans, there also will be relatively higher violent crime rates.

If Dixie Downs is concentrated with Mexicans, then obviously it will have a higher violent crime rate, as well as higher dependency on taxpayer-provided welfare and other government services.

Oh boy, as a moderator, this one gives me heartburn, especially given the debate as of late. You may or may not be able to find some stats to back that up. But is that the ultimate answer? Could the correlation have more to do with income levels than race? For example, if you find an area with lower income white residents, does their crime rate correlate to the same level as Latino residents of the same income bracket?

[GentilePatriot]

Originally Posted by coolcats

Oh boy, as a moderator, this one gives me heartburn, especially given the debate as of late. You may or may not be able to find some stats to back that up. But is that the ultimate answer? Could the correlation have more to do with income levels than race? For example, if you find an area with lower income white residents, does their crime rate correlate to the same level as Latino residents of the same income bracket?

Usually it's a waste of my time "proving" to someone that the presence of blacks and/or Mexicans in a community will inevitably lead to higher crime rates. It's rather like trying to "prove" that jumping off a high building will cause great bodily harm. In other words, why waste time trying to prove the obvious?

But your query has a sincere tone, and perhaps reflects your insulation from such realities by virtue of you living in one of the whitest states in the country. So I'll bite this one time.

In answer to your question, yes, there are volumes of statistics that document the presence of blacks and/or "Latinos" leads directly to higher crime rates. This holds true even when you correct for economic differences. Indeed, it is true that even middle-class blacks commit crime at *much* higher rates than do lower-class whites. For a spectacular example see Prince George's County, Maryland. It is the largest and richest black metropolitan area in the country (mainly because of the plethora of relatively high paying government jobs in and around D.C.), and their violent crime rates are among the highest in the nation. In addition, see the middle-class black neighborhoods in virtually any major city in America: Chicago, Detroit, Philadelphia, Baltimore, Milwaukee, and the list goes on and on and on. The middle-class black neighborhoods ALL have violent crime rates much higher than the national average.

Indeed, the single best predictor of violent criminal behavior is race (or ethnicity, in the case of Mexicans). It predicts violent behavior better than economics, population density, family structure, infant birth weights, education, nutrition, sun spots, astrological signs, and any other factor that academe, the media, and our pop culture typically try to attribute it to.

I only hope the residents of Utah learn this simple truth before it’s too late, although in this age of rampant and pathological Political Correctness, especially on the issue of race, I am skeptical you’ll understand this.

But this begs a different question: Even if it were true, as you suggest, that poverty causes violent crime (which generally speaking it does not), why does this excuse, in your view, the violent behavior of blacks and Mexicans?

Of yes, you wanted some stats. I recommend you read an outstanding analysis by Yale graduate Jared Taylor. Titled "The Color of Crime," this free download will teach you and others all the essential facts on the issue of race and violent criminal behavior: http://www.colorofcrime.com/colorofcrime2005.pdf

[GentilePatriot]

Originally Posted by GentilePatriot

Usually it's a waste of my time "proving" to someone that the presence of blacks and/or Mexicans in a community will inevitably lead to higher crime rates. It's rather like trying to "prove" that jumping off a high building will cause great bodily harm. In other words, why waste time trying to prove the obvious?

But your query has a sincere tone, and perhaps reflects your insulation from such realities by virtue of you living in one of the whitest states in the country. So I'll bite this one time.

In answer to your question, yes, there are volumes of statistics that document the presence of blacks and/or "Latinos" leads directly to higher crime rates. This holds true even when you correct for economic differences. Indeed, it is true that even middle-class blacks commit crime at *much* higher rates than do lower-class whites. For a spectacular example see Prince George's County, Maryland. It is the largest and richest black metropolitan area in the country (mainly because of the plethora of relatively high paying government jobs in and around D.C.), and their violent crime rates are among the highest in the nation. In addition, see the middle-class black neighborhoods in virtually any major city in America: Chicago, Detroit, Philadelphia, Baltimore, Milwaukee, and the list goes on and on and on. The middle-class black neighborhoods ALL have violent crime rates much higher than the national average.

Indeed, the single best predictor of violent criminal behavior is race (or ethnicity, in the case of Mexicans). It predicts violent behavior better than economics, population density, family structure, infant birth weights, education, nutrition, sun spots, astrological signs, and any other factor that academe, the media, and our pop culture typically try to attribute it to.

I only hope the residents of Utah learn this simple truth before it’s too late, although in this age of rampant and pathological Political Correctness, especially on the issue of race, I am skeptical you’ll understand this.

But this begs a different question: Even if it were true, as you suggest, that poverty causes violent crime (which generally speaking it does not), why does this excuse, in your view, the violent behavior of blacks and Mexicans?

Of yes, you wanted some stats. I recommend you read an outstanding analysis by Yale graduate Jared Taylor. Titled "The Color of Crime," this free download will teach you and others all the essential facts on the issue of race and violent criminal behavior: http://www.colorofcrime.com/colorofcrime2005.pdf

P.S. Sorry for all the deleted posts. I'm new to this forum and I was having a problem with the formatting of this post.

[coolcats]

Originally Posted by GentilePatriot

Usually it's a waste of my time "proving" to someone that the presence of blacks and/or Mexicans in a community will inevitably lead to higher crime rates. It's rather like trying to "prove" that jumping off a high building will cause great bodily harm. In other words, why waste time trying to prove the obvious?

But your query has a sincere tone, and perhaps reflects your insulation from such realities by virtue of you living in one of the whitest states in the country. So I'll bite this one time.

In answer to your question, yes, there are volumes of statistics that document the presence of blacks and/or "Latinos" leads directly to higher crime rates. This holds true even when you correct for economic differences. Indeed, it is true that even middle-class blacks commit crime at *much* higher rates than do lower-class whites. For a spectacular example see Prince George's County, Maryland. It is the largest and richest black metropolitan area in the country (mainly because of the plethora of relatively high paying government jobs in and around D.C.), and their violent crime rates are among the highest in the nation. In addition, see the middle-class black neighborhoods in virtually any major city in America: Chicago, Detroit, Philadelphia, Baltimore, Milwaukee, and the list goes on and on and on. The middle-class black neighborhoods ALL have violent crime rates much higher than the national average.

Indeed, the single best predictor of violent criminal behavior is race (or ethnicity, in the case of Mexicans). It predicts violent behavior better than economics, population density, family structure, infant birth weights, education, nutrition, sun spots, astrological signs, and any other factor that academe, the media, and our pop culture typically try to attribute it to.

I only hope the residents of Utah learn this simple truth before it’s too late, although in this age of rampant and pathological Political Correctness, especially on the issue of race, I am skeptical you’ll understand this.

But this begs a different question: Even if it were true, as you suggest, that poverty causes violent crime (which generally speaking it does not), why does this excuse, in your view, the violent behavior of blacks and Mexicans?

Of yes, you wanted some stats. I recommend you read an outstanding analysis by Yale graduate Jared Taylor. Titled "The Color of Crime," this free download will teach you and others all the essential facts on the issue of race and violent criminal behavior: http://www.colorofcrime.com/colorofcrime2005.pdf

I don’t have the time or energy to do a lot of research on this. But, even if your correlation of race and ethnicity to violence is correct, that does not answer the question of why that is. Anyway, you have given us a flavor of your opinions on this board. I know you don’t like political correctness, but please keep in mind that your opinions are dangerously close to offensive for many of our readers. Please keep to the forum rules on racism and / or find a different venue for your opinions.

[Chickrae]

Originally Posted by smbinaz

Hello All
Wanting to move to the St. George area but dont really know the best place to start looking. I have 2 kids 12yr old son 15 yr old daughter and so I am looking for a couple of things. Good Schools, close to shopping (1-10 miles) to Costco, Target, Kohls, Home Depot, etc.
What is the best place to move to?
----St. George, Santa Clara, Washington, Ivins????----
Looking to spend about $300-350K, but want 4 bed 3 bath about 3000 sq ft less than 5 years old!
Any suggestions on what neighborhoods to look at would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks

g

Just my two cents...after looking at homes this past week non stop for three days. Washington is nice, right in the St. George vicinity. Ivins is absolutely gorgeous, but a little farther from St. George. La Verkin has some good and bad areas but my opinion is its too far from shopping. If you are buying a home make sure you check out some of the areas in Santa Clara...they have that blue clay and you don't want to buy there. We put in an offer on a short sale in Coral Canyon area....very beautiful developement.

[wrestlingmama]

Hi Steadykat -
I enjoyed reading your informative post about some of the developments around Hurricane and St. George. We live in Pleasant Grove and are interested in retiring in the St. George area someday. We would like to invest in some land in or around St. George possibly. We are wondering if Dixie Springs is a good investment in your estimation. We have found a listing for two 1/4 acre lots for $38,000 each and wonder if this sounds like a good deal and wonder about the undeveloped areas of Dixie Springs. These lots are located in Plat C which is currently undeveloped. Let me know what you think.

[Chickrae]

I have not heard of Dixie Springs. Is that a subdivision? I am not from there. I am from northern Utah. It sounds reasonable for lots but as you know St. George has really dropped in home prices, lots etc, so check out all the area. We are going to stay pretty centrally located in St. George, and thats where we are retiring in three years also. We found a house we loved in Ivins, but then found out it had sinking soil or slippage or some sort.