Cities that are most like St. Louis (Ozark, Bonne Terre: distance, county)

[ConservativeMissouri]

Originally Posted by GunnerTHB

For example parts of northern Scott County express a much more midwestern feel than many parts in southern Cape Girardeau County. Several towns in northern Scott County are heavily Catholic with German & French ancestries. Cape Girardeau County has no rural Catholic churches.

Scott County is still DIxie though where southness still is the majority.

[ConservativeMissouri]

Originally Posted by Smtchll

So would you say that Jefferson County is the most Midwestern of the 3 and that Perry is the most Southern (culturally)? Because if you look at demographics, Perry looks very Midwestern, German, Catholic/Lutheran, while Jefferson has some typically Southern demographics. I'm just questioning the idea that regional culture works in such a uniform way. I'm just saying that a place could display more Southern characteristics even if it's further North and vice-versa.

I live in south Stl county, I can head to Jefferson county down Lemay Ferry in about ten minutes time. Arnold, northern Jeffco might as well be part of the county.

Again the rural, SW parts of the county can have some influences though. The county below it, St. Francois county is protestant, southern Baptist.

[ConservativeMissouri]

Originally Posted by CoffeeAndBeer

I was aware of that, there's an old photo in Time magazine of the hillbilly slum. St. Louis definitely used to have hillbilly bars (and of course hillbilly slums) in certain areas, they are long gone. There were some on Manchester Ave were the Grove is, I think, according to my dad. The tap of southerners/country folk moving into St. Louis turned off a generation ago (at the previous rate, anyway) when the last car plant was built, I believe. Kansas City now seems to takes up almost all of the rural flight population, often from the plains.

I believe that. Maybe up until the 1930s or so. Due to the older people being born in the mid 1800s, and their parents being southern stock. Just like Harry Truman was a southern, born in Western MO little dixie area. His family owned a plantation and slaves.

St. Louis in 1850 was a totally different city than it is today culturally. Those people and their children have long died out now. The racial democgraphics are also changing. Less whites are living in south city.

[kshe95girl]

Originally Posted by Smtchll

So would you say that Jefferson County is the most Midwestern of the 3 and that Perry is the most Southern (culturally)? Because if you look at demographics, Perry looks very Midwestern, German, Catholic/Lutheran, while Jefferson has some typically Southern demographics. I'm just questioning the idea that regional culture works in such a uniform way. I'm just saying that a place could display more Southern characteristics even if it's further North and vice-versa.

No, I would not say that at all.
I think I have been pretty clear about all this in this thread, as well as others.
At the Jeffco/STL county line, its rather indistinguishable from the rest of STL county.
After all, that part of Jeffco is a bedroom community for STL.
The central part of the county is typically Midwestern rural, the Festus/Crystal City area is solidly Midwestern, while the southern part of Jeffco blends right into Ste Gen county.
Perry county is even a bit more rural-feeling than Ste Gen, if that possible.
Like I said upthread, one has to live, or spend an extended period of time in the area in question to understand some of the very subtle nuances.
What I find hilarious is that some of the people in the 3 counties in question look down on one another as being hoosiers.

[kshe95girl]

Originally Posted by Smtchll

Interesting, yeah that's what I mean. I think it's more about where certain groups settled rather than just drawing a line and saying "this side is the North, this side is the South. The further you get from the line, the more Northern/Southern it gets" I think maybe more Southerners settled in Jefferson County while more Germans/French settled in Ste. Genevieve & Perry Counties.

A lot of the German/French folks moved into Jeffco for an easier commute into STL.
I know tons that have.

[ConservativeMissouri]

Originally Posted by kshe95girl

No, I would not say that at all.
I think I have been pretty clear about all this in this thread, as well as others.
At the Jeffco/STL county line, its rather indistinguishable from the rest of STL county.
After all, that part of Jeffco is a bedroom community for STL.
The central part of the county is typically Midwestern rural, the Festus/Crystal City area is solidly Midwestern, while the southern part of Jeffco blends right into Ste Gen county.
Perry county is even a bit more rural-feeling than Ste Gen, if that possible.
Like I said upthread, one has to live, or spend an extended period of time in the area in question to understand some of the very subtle nuances.
What I find hilarious is that some of the people in the 3 counties in question look down on one another as being hoosiers.

I agree mostly with what you say about Jeffco since I live right by there. SW part of the county thats rural I'd say is about close to 90 percent midwestern. Some slight hints of upper south in it though. The southern IL kind of way, but also that could be the ozark factor too.

Now when I go into St. Francios county, I can feel the Ozark, upper south influence start to be present further south you go and when you get past Frederick town the influence of the south is strong. I have a relative with a house in Bonne Terre, and when you are around there I don't feel it totally being midwestern but transition.

[GunnerTHB]

Originally Posted by Smtchll

Interesting, yeah that's what I mean. I think it's more about where certain groups settled rather than just drawing a line and saying "this side is the North, this side is the South. The further you get from the line, the more Northern/Southern it gets" I think maybe more Southerners settled in Jefferson County while more Germans/French settled in Ste. Genevieve & Perry Counties.

I'm not particularly familiar with Jefferson County. I've been through there several times and I feel like part of the county might as well be St. Louis while part of it might as well be a part of Ste. Genevieve County. I've never got a southern feeling from it, but I have gotten a bit of an Ozarks vibe. Certainly parts of Jefferson County look southern, but I wouldn't go much farther than that. I often cut over from I-55 to I-44 on Route M and it's almost as rural as where I'm from. If I ever live near St. Louis I think Jefferson County would be my choice.

[ConservativeMissouri]

Originally Posted by GunnerTHB

I'm not particularly familiar with Jefferson County. I've been through there several times and I feel like part of the county might as well be St. Louis while part of it might as well be a part of Ste. Genevieve County. I've never got a southern feeling from it, but I have gotten a bit of an Ozarks vibe. Certainly parts of Jefferson County look southern, but I wouldn't go much farther than that. I often cut over from I-55 to I-44 on Route M and it's almost as rural as where I'm from. If I ever live near St. Louis I think Jefferson County would be my choice.

Agree. The SW part of JEffco is more rural though and might be picking up on the Ozark culture with upper south influences in the southern parts of the county. Certainly not the midwest level that Perry County or Ste Gen is though.

For others in this thread who dont go over to the main MO forum, here is my most recent map to give you an idea of MO.

[Smtchll]

Originally Posted by GunnerTHB

I'm not particularly familiar with Jefferson County. I've been through there several times and I feel like part of the county might as well be St. Louis while part of it might as well be a part of Ste. Genevieve County. I've never got a southern feeling from it, but I have gotten a bit of an Ozarks vibe. Certainly parts of Jefferson County look southern, but I wouldn't go much farther than that. I often cut over from I-55 to I-44 on Route M and it's almost as rural as where I'm from. If I ever live near St. Louis I think Jefferson County would be my choice.

Yeah, it does have an Ozark look and vibe. It reminds me of Middle Tennessee around Nashville. It also feels more Bible Belt because I see a lot of little Evangelical churches and Evangelical billboards. That's pretty different from St. Louis County to the North & Ste. Genevieve County to the South.

[ConservativeMissouri]

Originally Posted by Smtchll

Yeah, it does have an Ozark look and vibe. It reminds me of Middle Tennessee around Nashville. It also feels more Bible Belt because I see a lot of little Evangelical churches and Evangelical billboards. That's pretty different from St. Louis County to the North & Ste. Genevieve County to the South.

That I agree on. Again Arnold, northern Jeffco is part of Stl co imo, but when you get outside the Arnold, Fenton city limits I see more Evengelicalish stuff though. Still JEffco is midwestern, but the SW portions that are very rural, I do see somewhat of that Ozark, upper southish hints a little bit.