Bernie predicts a new open air football stadium will be (St. Louis: how much, taxi)

[moving46]

they are going to build another new stadium. didnt they build one a few years back

[arch_genesis]

brickmama you are awesome. the only person in this thread and maybe all of St. Louis that has any vision and isn't blinded by Missouri vs Illinois and isn't afraid of East St. Louis.

Illinois may be broke but Stan and the NFL aren't. The NFL has a G4 loan program that lends up to $200 million dollars but the team has to put up at least $250 million of its own money. So we'd be dealing with a base of $450 million. At least $450 million private dollars are going into a new stadium. Consider:

Gillette Stadium - $420 Million in 2013 dollars
Heinz Field - $369 Million in 2013 dollars

A stadium on the east riverfront can be done, if Stan wanted the land, if Greater St. Louis wanted the land, if the NFL wanted the land it could easily be acquired.

We have a chance to do something cool with the eastside and we're gonna miss the boat and the only reason we'll be able to give is "because its in Illinois". People would rather put a stadium 20 miles outside of Downtown St. Louis, than put a stadium one mile outside of Downtown St. Louis.

Why? Because it's in Illinois.

[flynavyj]

I think an open air stadium east of the river would provide the best view of the St. Louis skyline, and the greatest impact for improving East St. Louis in DECADES! But what you'll be dealing with is a fight on a national level. Purchasing the land would be fairly cheap, but losing that "tax base" from St. Louis is what the STL local government would be up in arms about...even if they weren't supposed to reap the tax benefits for 20 years and the Rams were once again wanting a NEW Tier 1 stadium.

Unless some deal could be worked out to provide tax revenues to St. Louis, I don't think you'll see anyone float the East side idea...even though it's a great idea, might be the cheapest idea, and could really help benefit both communities.

[glamatomic]

I'm with flynavyj and brickmama on this one. Although I'm an advocate for keeping the stadium downtown- I think East St. Louis could really benefit from it.

[MUTGR]

Originally Posted by arch_genesis

brickmama you are awesome. the only person in this thread and maybe all of St. Louis that has any vision and isn't blinded by Missouri vs Illinois and isn't afraid of East St. Louis.

Illinois may be broke but Stan and the NFL aren't. The NFL has a G4 loan program that lends up to $200 million dollars but the team has to put up at least $250 million of its own money. So we'd be dealing with a base of $450 million. At least $450 million private dollars are going into a new stadium. Consider:

Gillette Stadium - $420 Million in 2013 dollars
Heinz Field - $369 Million in 2013 dollars

A stadium on the east riverfront can be done, if Stan wanted the land, if Greater St. Louis wanted the land, if the NFL wanted the land it could easily be acquired.

We have a chance to do something cool with the eastside and we're gonna miss the boat and the only reason we'll be able to give is "because its in Illinois". People would rather put a stadium 20 miles outside of Downtown St. Louis, than put a stadium one mile outside of Downtown St. Louis.

Why? Because it's in Illinois.

That's certainly how I feel. But perhaps I'm in the minority-I know I am on this forum.

And it has nothing to do with being scared of ESTL. It has everything to do with wanting Missouri to keep the tax dollars generated by a Missouri based business.

[arch_genesis]

correct me if I'm wrong but the Rams rent the dome for $250,000 a year and they don't pay a entertainment-ticket tax. Do we know if the players pay the 1% income tax?

I just think the revenue you guys are worried about losing is pretty small. And as brickmama pointed out could probably be easily made up with conventions to replace the 10 days the Rams use the dome.

Maybe Missouri can just buy the land. How much is 300 acres worth? $7000 per acre?

[BioMechanical]

Average income in Illinois: $53,966.
Average income in East St. Louis: $21,070

These people can't even afford to attend an NFL game. Why do they need a stadium? What would it do for them? It's not going to change the ghetto mentality over there that's for sure. If you want to spend money in East St. Louis do it on social reform, after school programs, gang education, job training etc. They don't need a football stadium.

And after spending 30 years in the St. Louis Metro I can guarantee a ton of people will NOT be going to East St. Louis for the Rams .... or for anything else. After decades of violence over there people are biased towards the area and simply would not go.

Just sayin'

[arch_genesis]

^what's a ton of people? 8 heavy set guys? 20 ballerinas? I think you're overreacting a bit. There's nothing scary about the east riverfront at 12 in the afternoon.

[BioMechanical]

Originally Posted by arch_genesis

^what's a ton of people? 8 heavy set guys? 20 ballerinas? I think you're overreacting a bit. There's nothing scary about the east riverfront at 12 in the afternoon.

I'm not overreacting about anything. If you don't know that most people from St. Louis avoid the East side like the plague then you must be new to town. When we were in our early 20's we would go over there to the bars or the strip clubs ... that's about it. You out grow it.

Anyway I am done with this discussion because it's moot like we established 2 or 3 pages ago. It's not going to happen.

[MUTGR]

Originally Posted by arch_genesis

I just think the revenue you guys are worried about losing is pretty small. And as brickmama pointed out could probably be easily made up with conventions to replace the 10 days the Rams use the dome.

Missouri and Illinois both have a state income tax. In 2012, the Rams had a payroll of approximately $116,000,000.00. (2012 NFL Salaries by Team | Online Sports Marketing Guy)

States tax professional athletes based on both where they are domiciled and where they earn their money. The link below and the quoted example describes how this works:

Hodgson Russ LLP - The Multistate Tax Quandary for Professional Athletes

"Let’s look at a fairly simple example. On December 26 the Patriots are scheduled to square off with the Bills in Buffalo. Even though, given the Bills’ record, this may be a meaningless game in the standings, it will nonetheless have some consequences — tax consequences, to be exact! The Patriots’ players, many of whom may be residents of Massachusetts, normally pay taxes to Massachusetts. When they travel to Buffalo, each player, along with the coaches and trainers, will be treated as having earned income in New York on December 26. And assuming they get into town a couple days before the game, those pre-game days will also count as New York duty days. Accordingly, Tom Brady and Bill Belichick will be coughing up a portion of their salaries to pay up to New York on that day no matter who wins the game (stop laughing — the Bills could win). But the next time Ryan Fitzpatrick, C.J. Spiller, and Jairus Byrd take the field in Foxboro, they’ll be returning the favor to Massachusetts’s tax coffers, paying taxes on the percentage of time spent in the state on duty days."

So by moving 10 home games to Illinois, Missouri would lose the opportunity to tax the portion of income of the Rams' players (payroll $110 million) attributable to those 10 games that will be played in Illinois. I think they would also lose the opportunity to tax the corporate entity of the Rams for those 10 games that would now be played in Missouri.

I don't think this number would be insignificant. Perhaps it doesn't matter to anyone, but I wouldn't say there are no financial consequences to such a move.