Contemplating a Move to STL

[AJohnston_STL]

Originally Posted by lholmes1

Ajohnston STL:

Have you ridden over the Poplar Street bridge lately? It feels like I'm at Six Flags the ride is so bumpy. That bridge is a hazard. Terrible roads? ....it's all over STL you just have to drive around STL to see, but make sure you have good shocks and suspension because these roads can tear up a nice car. As far as crime, all you have to do is look at the news daily and someone is getting killed every day. Did you see the report about the Chase Park Plaza manager shot and killed a few days ago coming home from work in south St. Louis, or what about the Bosnian and Laotian clerks killed in their stores in robbery attempts about a month ago, or the nine year old shot in the head traveling in the car? This crap is happening almost daily, so the crime is getting worse.

I'm sorry, but your perception by reading the St Louis Post Dispatch does not equate to factual data, my friend.

Since you like lists so much, here's a quote from CNN Money regarding St Louis being #2 on their most dangerous list;

Even though it still ranks second on the most dangerous cities list, St. Louis is a lot safer than it used to be. Murders have been cut in half over the past two decades -- as have the numbers for other violent crimes.

Still, at about 35 murders per 100,000 residents in 2011, St. Louis claims the third highest homicide rate of any major city.

One reason St. Louis's crime rate is so high is that the city has not grown beyond its very constricted borders, according to criminologist Richard Rosenfeld of the University of Missouri, St. Louis. Other cities have expanded outward by swallowing up safer nearby communities, which helps dilute the overall crime stats. Oklahoma City's reporting area, for example, is nearly 10 times the size of St. Louis'.

If the safer St. Louis suburbs were counted into its crime statistics, the overall crime rate for St. Louis would be much lower.

[Dawn10am]

^I love how CNN acknowledges how wildly skewed our crime stats are. Unfortunately, perception is reality for most people.

[AJohnston_STL]

Originally Posted by lholmes1

Ms. Dawn10am,

Since you are not a native then you can't compare what STL used to be 30 years ago, to what it is today. Of course this is not the same STL I grew up in, but unfortunately the changes or lack thereof that are occurring today, are not things that are in the favor of STL. It is a matter of personal preference, and I have the right to express my opinions. The problem that I have, is that anytime someone expresses a non-positive attitude about STL, some people come out with "guns blazing", it's really not that serious, as everyone is entitled to their own opinion. I'm just stating the facts about STL, as I see them. Poor weather, i.e...tornados, hot humid summers, cold grey winters, lack of beaches, mountains or other pleasant scenery, high crime, personal property taxes, poor job market, run-down old city with vacant bombed out looking buildings, ragged streets, etc.. are facts about what STL is. I did state some positives, but the negatives out weigh the positives in my opinion by a longshot. By the way, STL is not the only place I've ever lived, I've lived in Indianapolis, Minneapolis, and Kansas City and all of those cities were more pleasant in my opinion than STL.

The reason people come out "guns blazing" are because you have a problem with St Louis, and that attitude is generally unhelpful. People don't come here for some jaded native's opinions. They want the opinions of semi-subjective people. You know, the people who can say that St Louis has a crime problem, but if you live here, here, or here, there will be no problem. Not people who simply jump on any opportunity to tell them why it's so horrible here.

Compare your "personal property taxes" with taxes in Illinois (my parents pay almost $3k for 1700 sq ft in a small town 2 hours from the nearest metro area, which is STL), from the cost of renewing your license plate tags ($109/yr vs. $55 for 2 years in MO), to the cost of gas (usually .20 higher than Missouri per gallon) to the cost of a home somewhere else. Yes, I had to pay $300 for 2 cars in Missouri last year, but I paid half of the property tax I would've paid in Illinois in the middle of a cornfield, and saved hundreds of dollars in gas, and over $100 in tags alone.

I'm sure you spend a whole ton of time in the city, but perhaps you should get out more. I'm sure you haven't been east of Skinker in a while, but there are a lot of up and comers, and a lot of already gentrified areas. I bet you spend a lot of time in Old North St Louis, and downtown on Washington Ave where they've gained over 10k residents in the past 10 years. I'm sure you could be a tour guide for Lafayette Square, Tower Grove, and the Central West End.

Believe it or not, I've managed to last years upon years without living near a beach or mountains, and believe it or not, a lot of people don't factor in proximity to a mountain or ocean into their calculation of quality of life.

I don't know how the job market is for a janitor, but the technology job market is great - thats the field I work in. In fact, Dice named it as the fastest growing job market for technology, and that was before Boeing, Monsanto, and Express Scripts announced their major expansions.

I guess what I'm saying, in short, is people come out "guns blazing" because you don't know what you're talking about.

[lholmes1]

Originally Posted by AJohnston_STL

The reason people come out "guns blazing" are because you have a problem with St Louis, and that attitude is generally unhelpful. People don't come here for some jaded native's opinions. They want the opinions of semi-subjective people. You know, the people who can say that St Louis has a crime problem, but if you live here, here, or here, there will be no problem. Not people who simply jump on any opportunity to tell them why it's so horrible here.

Compare your "personal property taxes" with taxes in Illinois (my parents pay almost $3k for 1700 sq ft in a small town 2 hours from the nearest metro area, which is STL), from the cost of renewing your license plate tags ($109/yr vs. $55 for 2 years in MO), to the cost of gas (usually .20 higher than Missouri per gallon) to the cost of a home somewhere else. Yes, I had to pay $300 for 2 cars in Missouri last year, but I paid half of the property tax I would've paid in Illinois in the middle of a cornfield, and saved hundreds of dollars in gas, and over $100 in tags alone.

I'm sure you spend a whole ton of time in the city, but perhaps you should get out more. I'm sure you haven't been east of Skinker in a while, but there are a lot of up and comers, and a lot of already gentrified areas. I bet you spend a lot of time in Old North St Louis, and downtown on Washington Ave where they've gained over 10k residents in the past 10 years. I'm sure you could be a tour guide for Lafayette Square, Tower Grove, and the Central West End.

Believe it or not, I've managed to last years upon years without living near a beach or mountains, and believe it or not, a lot of people don't factor in proximity to a mountain or ocean into their calculation of quality of life.

I don't know how the job market is for a janitor, but the technology job market is great - thats the field I work in. In fact, Dice named it as the fastest growing job market for technology, and that was before Boeing, Monsanto, and Express Scripts announced their major expansions.

I guess what I'm saying, in short, is people come out "guns blazing" because you don't know what you're talking about.

Well guess I can see how you would form your opinion of STL, coming from the middle of a cornfield, that St. Louis is such an up and coming mecca of culture and opportunity. I am a Regulatory Compliance Specialist, not a Janitor and I was stating that the job opportunities here overall are not that great. I can't speak for any specific industry, but I'll leave you to your opinions and I would appreciate if you would allow me to have mine.

[NewStLouisan]

This crap is happening almost daily, so the crime is getting worse.

I'm surprised that a native doesn't realize that the crime was much worse previously, and that the crime stats are the lowest in St. Louis in a long time. You cite three high profile (albeit tragic) homicides, but seem to forget all the murders that occurred in previous years.

These are the number of homicides in the first 7 months in St. Louis:

2011: 79
2012: 70
2013 (so far as of 7/30): 58

Unless 12 murders occur in the next 24 hours, I think it's pretty clear the city's getting safer.

[NewStLouisan]

Originally Posted by lholmes1

Please check out this article, this about sums up St. Louis. It makes the most "miserable" or worst crime list every year for a reason. If people like it here that's fine, but please be honest with the poster about the cons of STL.

Forbes: St. Louis among most miserable cities in US | KMOV.com St. Louis

So St. Louis is less miserable than Chicago and NYC? I'll take it!