Suburban Sprawl in St.Louis Metro (Kansas City, St. Louis: condos, work, townhomes)

[anduarto]

On trips to my beloved hometown St. Louis in recent years I've been encouraged by the revitalization going on downtown. It's dream I've had since I was a kid and it's very gratifying to see it starting to come true.

At the same time, I've been increasingly disturbed by the horrendous suburban sprawl that seems to be gobbling up the surrounding country side. Mile after mile of what I remembered as farmlard and picturesque river bluffs has been eaten up by a kind of suburban sprawl I hoped had ended back in the 1980's.

When so much of the core city and older suburbs stand empty, why this push to bulldoze ever more country side and build, sprawling, suburbs with their attendant fuel guzzling, greenhouse gas spewing implications?

Do people generally discuss this in the St.Louis area? Is it even recognized as a problem? Can it be stopped?

Thanks in advance for any light you can shed on the topic.

[jojojohnson76]

It is typically discussed that St Louis is not even close to being one of the worst sprawling cities, even in the top 20.

BUT, yes, it is a conversation amongst urbanists. Myself? I am a suburbanite turning urbanite in January (thank goodness). I like the suburb I live in, but I can't wait to live where I can drive 10 minutes on a city street to get to a downtown restaurant, new bowling alley, etc, etc.

I hate that it continuously moves west. I don't think Illinois is seeing it as bad, but look at developments such as New Town at St. Charles. While it is regarded as a more "urban" subdivision in St. Charles, to me, it will always be another great testament to urban sprawl. Its disgusting.

People are scared of minorities, and the general perception overall is that cities are dangerous war zones. People like you and I know that isn't true. Thankfully, for every few suburbanites who are scared to death of the city, there are a few rurally-born and suburban-born people who can't wait to enjoy the amenities of living in the city.

I'll be in Maplewood in January (ok, so it's not TECHNICALLY the city, but close enough).

[anduarto]

Congrats on your move to Maplewood. I grew up in Dogtown just on the other side of McCausland and went to the Maplewood Public Pool a lot. We would occasionally even walk there (admittedly, it was a long walk).

Maplewood used to be even more urban in feel than it is now. Much of downtown Maplewood along Manchester fell prey to the wreaking ball in the 70's. Still there are some pretty cool places there. I hope you enjoy. (What's the greek place that has the great sandwiches..."Michael's" is it?).

We also went to the "Maplewood Show" as we called it. Mostly Christopher Lee Dracula movies. It was the place to see and be seen. Don't think it even exists now.

I'm very encouraged by the success of the Metrolink. It's another dream I had when I was a kid that I NEVER thought would come true. I know it just expanded west to Clayton. Is there a new leg that runs south too?

But don't get me wrong. I understand the appeal of suburban living and some of them are lovely. I just can't help thinking it alienates people from one and other. Every one sequestered away in their cars as they drive from driveway to parking lot and back again. Give me the human interaction of cities any day.

[jojojohnson76]

Yeah, I really think Maplewood is very urban, as well as the surrounding communities (U City, Clayton, Richmond Heights). I can't wait to be within driving/walking distance to city restaurants instead of chain restaurants and fast food. We are super excited!!

And I'm tired of seeing the disgusting westward sprawl here. It's ridiculous. The people I work with in Creve Coeur all live by the "further west you are the better" rule. I work with people who consider Maplewood and U City "dangerous." I work with a guy who lives in Florissant but his dream town (seriously) is Wentzville. People who hate urban living should live in the sticks and drive dirt roads every day, and make way for the people who love cities and what they offer.

[aragx6]

I hate how people always joke that in 100 years Columbia will be a suburb of St. Louis. That's like my worst nightmare. But, it gets worse every year. Warrenton is growing by leaps and bounds, so now we're more than halfway there.

But you know what? Let gas price hit $5 a gallon and we'll see who wants to live in those exurbs then.

And God... New Town is so awful. It's just a bunch of overpriced, poorly constructed condos and duplexes and townhomes shoved up next to each other under some sort of belief that that will make them urban.

[anduarto]

Yeah, I'm one of those obnoxious people who thinks higher gas prices aren't necessarily a bad thing (as long as people have warm homes). Seems like the sprawl has got to run itself out somehow.

While jojo pointed out St.Louis isn't as sprawling as a lot of cities, it concerns me more there because the unquestioned "further out is better" mentality seems to be so prominent. In the big eastern cities (and I think at it's heart, St. Louis was mostly an eastern city) the core cities have become the most desirable, sought after addresses around. Let's hope that eventually happens in St. Louis.

It was such a great, urban center at one time. Just hate to see it swamped by one ordinary suburb after another. It's great to see the revived interest in the city proper. I'm hopeful it's just the beginning.

Also hate to see the farmland and countryside torn up into one ordinary suburb after another.

I went to school in Lawrence, KS. which people tell me is now a suburb of Kansas City. Let's hope that doesn't happen to Columbia!

[aragx6]

I think it's this misconception that somehow new construction is superior to old established tree lined streets. Why? Because families of 4 or 5 think they need 2500-4000 sq/ft houses and you can't get that in the older 'burbs.