Chicago (or DC or NYC or Boston) vs. St. Louis (St. Charles: city hall, insurance)

[Bobster]

Aragx6....speaking of metro-link and stupid things....why didn't the powers that be at least leave a right of way for a future metro link line while they are redoing Hwy 40 (I-64)?

Regarding the percentage of the population that lives within the city limits...in this regard St. Louis is a victim of it's own success. That is, that St. Louis has a great interstate highway system compared to many other major metro areas. These highways (and their early implementation) contributed to the major population flights from the city and into the suburbs and beyond. White flight also played it's part.

As a real estate agent I've seen people who live in some of these more expensive cities starting to do the math. Especially when they see that they can sell their home in San Diego, LA or DC, move here, but a nicer home and still stash $100,000 or $200,000.

I've even seen this reverse migration going on in rural Missouri. It's getting to the point where it's not unusual to see somebody move to Missouri from California, buy 50 or 100 acres and build their dream house. Mark my words, this is a trend that you're going to start reading about...it might be a couple of years, but it's going to eventually get noticed.

Kshegirl: I understand your getting tired of the comparison between St. Louis and other major metro areas, but obviously a good number of people....a whole bunch who actually live here...have this idea that St. Louis is, as I've seen it referred to in the Riverfront Times on numerous occassions, a "cow town".

One of the reasons that I started this tread was to point out that this line of thinking is stupid. I don't care if you're talking about educational opportunities, employment opportunities, cultural opportunities, sexual opportunities, or whatever, St. Louis generally does a pretty good job of representing itself.

Also, in keeping with the forums focus on relocation issues, I thought it was important for people who were considering relocating here to see that St. Louis is a much more cosmopolitan area than many would believe. This isn't taking anything away from any other city, but the fact of the matter is that much of the country has no idea that St. Louis IS a major metropolitan area....not just part of the fly-over country.

[aragx6]

Good question about metrolink and the 40 redo!

In hanging out a bit in the Springfield/Branson forum I've seen this California to Missouri trend to. It's pretty interesting to see!

[MoNative34]

Originally Posted by STLCardsBlues1989

Why would St. Charles vote down MetroLink??

Answer: They're smart.

[aragx6]

I guess you like sitting in brain-numbing traffic, releasing thousands of tons of unnecessary carbon emissions into the world.

[MoNative34]

Originally Posted by aragx6

I guess you like sitting in brain-numbing traffic, releasing thousands of tons of unnecessary carbon emissions into the world.

LOL!!! Is that the best you can do??

[aragx6]

You're pathetic and I won't let you bait me.

[Bobster]

Mo, did you know that back in the day when railroads were first coming into their own St. Louis and Chicago were pretty much neck and neck as far as their size and prominence went. Chicago invested heavily in the "new" technology whereas St. Louis sat back on it's heals. 150 years or so later see where the two cities sit in relationship to one another???

Also, right now St. Charles is still developing and doesn't see where they need that connection to the "older" part of St. Louis. Eventually, the ground will fill up out there and they will wish that they hadn't isolated themselves! Kind of reminds me of the city of St. Louis not wanting to be part of St. Louis County??

[STLCardsBlues1989]

Yeah. I've heard that driving from St. Charles into the city is not fun.

I don't understand urbanites who dislike suburbanites and vise versa. I mean, I understand the reason for it, but it's not productive. The suburbs and the city need each other, the city for the suburbs population, and the suburbs for jobs and fun that the city offers.

[MoNative34]

Originally Posted by Bobster

Mo, did you know that back in the day when railroads were first coming into their own St. Louis and Chicago were pretty much neck and neck as far as their size and prominence went. Chicago invested heavily in the "new" technology whereas St. Louis sat back on it's heals. 150 years or so later see where the two cities sit in relationship to one another???

Also, right now St. Charles is still developing and doesn't see where they need that connection to the "older" part of St. Louis. Eventually, the ground will fill up out there and they will wish that they hadn't isolated themselves! Kind of reminds me of the city of St. Louis not wanting to be part of St. Louis County??

Bob, First off thank you for being tactful. In the end, we may have to agree to disagree, but that's okay.

I understand that in older areas of town, some population loss due to attrition is normal. But what about when St. Louis City loses almost half the population in a 50 year period? There's something very wrong with St. Louis City when they lose that many people. My parents left the city in 1966 and I don't blame them one bit. Look at the sorry state of the St. Louis Public Schools. Who in their right mind would want their kids in a school system where failure seems to be the status quo?? Who wants their hard-earned tax money to support that when there are better options outside the city?
Crime went up to in the city and you can say "crime is everywhere", but the rates are significantly higher in the city. My grandparents lived in South City when I was growing up so I've witnessed a change in a neighborhood over a 15 year period.

So what's the city to do? Are they going to continue to blame the suburbs for all of their problems and refer to them as "scared" and "racisits", etc.?
(Doesn't that make people want to move back.)

They can continue the status quo with "lets have a new tax to fix this problem" (The new tax ideas never seem to end) or they can act more efficient, cut the corruption, fix the schools and be true leaders.
How many more cost overruns will Bi-State have with Metro-Link? The taxpayers have not been winners on that.

That's where St. Charles County enters the picture. People my age are starting families and buying homes. And just like me, they've witnessed the blunders of St. Louis City (and still don't trust them), want their kids in good schools, want safe neighborhoods and don't want to pay high taxes and get nothing back.

That's why they voted the way they voted on Metro Link IMO.

I want the city to improve, but after 35 years, I'm at my wits end. That's a shame because I like St. Louis and have a personal connection to it because I grew up there. They're many things about the city/metro that I like and I've mentioned them on other posts/threads so the above comments aren't my only ones on St. Louie.

[WestCoDude]

Originally Posted by STLCardsBlues1989

Why would St. Charles vote down MetroLink? Wouldn't it make it easier for people to travel to and from the city?

Because I'm not sure it would be a whole lot easier, to be honest with you. Traffic in STL is remarkably light and I doubt you would get to your destination any quicker on MetroLink than you would simply taking 70.

And I think it's basic sense that you're providing a moving bridge from the city to St. Charles County....and can you really blame the people of St. Charles County for NOT wanting the city to come to them? Hell...we made the same choice here in West County. I mean...we came out here to escape the whacky ways of the city....why make it easier for the city to come to us?

I think there is a place for rail in a city like St. Louis. But with the great economic/geographic divide in the area....I don't know how that will work out.