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Old 06-03-2017, 12:55 PM
 
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They're actually all the same issue (racial discrimination).
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Old 06-03-2017, 03:02 PM
 
Location: St. Louis
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Originally Posted by FrankMiller View Post
They're actually all the same issue (racial discrimination).
No they're not. Crime is not caused by racial discrimination. Neither are poor schools. Neither is homelessness.

In fact, you've hit on the issue inadvertently: blaming these issues on racial discrimination is a diversion from dealing with the problems, similar to making a stink about the confederate memorial.

Personally, I've lived in the St. Louis area my entire life and I've determined I've never laid eyes on the damn thing. Take it down.

Then deal with the real issues.
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Old 06-03-2017, 05:34 PM
 
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Originally Posted by FrankMiller View Post
It's basically surrendering the argument to say, "we can't talk about this issue until we deal with all the other issues". If our government can't talk about a statue without shutting down the police force, we have much bigger problems than crime and so on!
Not exactly. There is a difference between talking about an issue and dedicating resources to it. Time, energy, and dollars wasted on removing the statue are resources that are not spent on fighting crime, improving schools, etc.
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Old 06-03-2017, 07:12 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MUTGR View Post
No they're not. Crime is not caused by racial discrimination. Neither are poor schools. Neither is homelessness.

In fact, you've hit on the issue inadvertently: blaming these issues on racial discrimination is a diversion from dealing with the problems, similar to making a stink about the confederate memorial.

Personally, I've lived in the St. Louis area my entire life and I've determined I've never laid eyes on the damn thing. Take it down.

Then deal with the real issues.
We're never going to fix any of these issues as long as people have their heads in the sand about racial discrimination. If you're not willing to address the root issues then the symptoms are going to persist indefinitely. Blow all the money you want on charter schools and extra police, you aren't going to get anywhere. Throwing out the confederate memorial will honestly do more to combat crime than anything else the city is actually willing to do.
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Old 06-03-2017, 09:40 PM
 
Location: St. Louis
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FrankMiller View Post
Throwing out the confederate memorial will honestly do more to combat crime than anything else the city is actually willing to do.
Do it. It won't do a damn thing about crime:

Family says 7-year-old victim in quadruple shooting Thursday has died | Law and order | stltoday.com
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Old 06-03-2017, 10:07 PM
 
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Originally Posted by MUTGR View Post
Thank you for reminding us all of the results of a couple hundred years of institutional racism. Maybe we should try something different, like a nation that recognizes the value of all people.
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Old 06-03-2017, 10:47 PM
 
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Originally Posted by FrankMiller View Post
Thank you for reminding us all of the results of a couple hundred years of institutional racism. Maybe we should try something different, like a nation that recognizes the value of all people.
Institutional racism? I'm sorry, but that sounds like a phrase from the 1950s. What exactly are you referring to? Are you admitting that the democratic party has failed the black community? Or are you saying that our laws are racist because blacks are more likely to end up in prison?
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Old 06-04-2017, 12:47 AM
 
Location: St. Louis
7,305 posts, read 5,983,035 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FrankMiller View Post
Thank you for reminding us all of the results of a couple hundred years of institutional racism. Maybe we should try something different, like a nation that recognizes the value of all people.
You actually need to try something different: stop blaming 200 years on 7 year olds getting shot today in North St. Louis.

What General Robert E. Lee or some 18 year old from Missouri who fought for the south thought in 1860 isn't relevant. Not in the least. Few even remember today.

Last edited by MUTGR; 06-04-2017 at 01:02 AM..
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Old 06-04-2017, 05:15 AM
 
3,713 posts, read 2,685,975 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1grin_g0 View Post
Institutional racism? I'm sorry, but that sounds like a phrase from the 1950s. What exactly are you referring to? Are you admitting that the democratic party has failed the black community? Or are you saying that our laws are racist because blacks are more likely to end up in prison?
Both parties have failed the black community, although Republicans are obviously 10x worse. And yes, blacks are more likely to end up in prison due to our racist laws.

I mean, arguing out this whole line of thought is probably beyond the scope of this forum, but here's some links for anyone who actually cares.

Police brutality and race article with lots of links to studies and the like
Death penalty - no deterrent effect
Study - black men face discrimination in hiring
Study - ligher skinned black people received lesser jail sentences
Innocents convicted: an empirically justified factual wrongful conviction rate | Journal of Criminal Law and Criminology
Black fathers are at least as involved with their children's lives as white fathers
Al Sharpton and other black leaders march to protest black-on-black crime.
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Old 06-04-2017, 09:09 AM
 
1,400 posts, read 691,515 times
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Quote:
Both parties have failed the black community, although Republicans are obviously 10x worse. And yes, blacks are more likely to end up in prison due to our racist laws.

I mean, arguing out this whole line of thought is probably beyond the scope of this forum, but here's some links for anyone who actually cares.
What specific laws are you claiming that are racist? How do you come to the conclusion that republicans are 10x more at fault when democrats have controlled Congress much more over the years? Wasn't it Clinton that was really tough on crime and drugs? Didn't the liberal state of California institute the 3 strikes and you're out law?
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