St. Louis to remove Confederate monument (St. Charles, Webster Groves: house, suburban, relocate to)

[jcx456]

Originally Posted by FrankMiller

This is exactly the sort of stuff I was saying didn't matter at all. Where's the data that blacks have higher incomes, get employed at disproportionately higher rates, get acquitted of crimes more often, etc.? This is like saying "the existence of a club for expats from Montenegro proves they're the most powerful country in the world".

They have lower incomes because they're lazier, less educated and less intelligent than their White, Asian and Middle Eastern counterparts that dominate economics. If this weren't true, then they would have risen to the top by now and refuted that sentiment. We live under a capitalistic system. The cream rises to the top. If you're the best at what you do, you are rewarded.

Are Lebron James and Kevin Durant underpaid or are they the best in the world at what they do and paid handsomely for it? Every black person can't be a basketball player. So, guess what? That's where the laziness, less education and less intelligence comes into play.

A Black man or woman has just as much right to apply to any major university they want to as any other race. Often times, they are even more accommodated than other races. Some colleges have specific scholarships and grants that can only be awarded to Black people. It doesn't matter if someone from another race has better grades, a higher SAT/ACT score or participated in more extracurricular activities, only a Black person can receive the scholarship. This coupled with other state and federal aid that is available even if you are flat broke. Pell grants and the like.

As if that's not already enough, there are still other paths to attain education. The school district that I went to high school in had a program where as long as you got a C average or better in high school and didn't miss more than X number of days of school(truancy) and didn't get into any trouble(fights, drugs, suspensions) you got free tuition to any state community college to get your associates degree.

I happen to know of several people of all races that used that program. One of them was a male Black friend of mine that was dirt poor. He lived in state funded housing, got food stamps, free school lunch, had like literally two outfits. Sometimes he would wear the same shirt to school the entire week. He used that college program I mentioned and got a job in finance. Now he makes like $70K a year and lives in a nice suburb.

Another Indian girl I know of used that program and went on to get a PhD. Now she is a psychologist with her own practice and makes six figures. So my point is the program works. If those two examples that I personally know can make it, why can't your average Black person? This is where some speculation comes into play, but there are only three reasons. Not meeting the school attendance requirement(laziness). Not meeting the grade requirement of at least a C average(less intelligent). Finally, not meeting the good conduct requirement, meaning they got into a fight, got caught with drugs or did something else that caused them to get suspended or expelled from school.

About Blacks being less likely to be acquitted for crimes, very true. I'm sure it doesn't have anything to do with the fact that Blacks commit violent crimes(murder, assault, armed robbery) at disproportionately higher rates than any other race per FBI crime data, right? I mean people that are on trial for murder or robbing a bank are usually more likely to get off than say someone that did a petty crime, right? I'm sure that doesn't have anything to do with it.

The opportunities are there and have been for at bare minimum two generations now, one could argue longer. Some chose to take them, the likes of Dr. Cornel West, Lester Holt, Oprah, Lebron James, President Obama etc. Some choose not to take them, the likes of your typical inner city Black that skips school, doesn't care about grades or doing homework, gets into trouble either getting suspended/expelled from school or worse, jail/prison and then ends up broke, destitute and vile with no options, wondering why they can't get anywhere in life. You only get out what you put in. The world isn't rigged against Blacks, despite what their lobbies would have you believe, NAACP and the like. It's rigged against lazy, unintelligent, criminally minded Blacks. If it were rigged against all black, Oprah and Obama wouldn't be successful. End of story.

Now this is the trillion dollar question. How do you get Black youths to be responsible, not lazy, more well read, more intelligent in general, less criminally minded and less violent in general? Analyze the culture and see what the correlations are. There's your answer. Now to all the Blacks out there or any race for that matter, whom are successful, that have degrees, well paying jobs or work long hours at lesser jobs to make it work out, that stay out of trouble and are generally responsible in life, pat yourselves on the back.

[FrankMiller]

Originally Posted by jcx456

They have lower incomes because they're lazier, less educated and less intelligent than their White, Asian and Middle Eastern counterparts that dominate economics. If this weren't true, then they would have risen to the top by now and refuted that sentiment. We live under a capitalistic system. The cream rises to the top. If you're the best at what you do, you are rewarded.

Correlation does not equal causation. There's no credible research which supports the conclusion that some inherent fault of blacks impacts their societal outcomes, and substantial research showing that institutions are racially biased against them. You're winning a footrace against a one-legged man and claiming the race was rigged against you because the other guy was the only one provided with crutches.

[1grin_g0]

Give a man a foodstamps and you feed him for a day; teach a man to apply for foodstamps and you feed him for a lifetime. But if the man does not want to learn or put in the effort to get foodstamps, then that's on him.

[FrankMiller]

Originally Posted by 1grin_g0

Give a man a foodstamps and you feed him for a day; teach a man to apply for foodstamps and you feed him for a lifetime. But if the man does not want to learn or put in the effort to get foodstamps, then that's on him.

Food stamps benefit recipients:

• Children: 45%
• Working adults: 31%
• Disabled non-elderly: 10%
• Elderly: 9%
• Unemployed able-bodied adults: 3-5%
• Length of time unemployed able-bodied adults spend on food stamps: usually just a few months

The situation in your parable is basically a right-wing myth with no basis in the real world.

[SouthCitySam]

Originally Posted by FrankMiller

This is exactly the sort of stuff I was saying didn't matter at all.

Yes, I'm sure. Quite predictably.

[FrankMiller]

Originally Posted by SouthCitySam

Yes, I'm sure. Quite predictably.

In the mid-19th century there were various groups dedicated to the liberation of black people, and few formed for the cause of white liberation. Clearly, blacks were the most coddled demographic of the antebellum south.

[1grin_g0]

Originally Posted by FrankMiller

Food stamps benefit recipients:

• Children: 45%
• Working adults: 31%
• Disabled non-elderly: 10%
• Elderly: 9%
• Unemployed able-bodied adults: 3-5%
• Length of time unemployed able-bodied adults spend on food stamps: usually just a few months

The situation in your parable is basically a right-wing myth with no basis in the real world.

You managed to miss the entire point, which to be honest is not surprising. I like how you dismissed it with the whole right wing conspiracy thing though, that was cute.

Let me help you. There are plenty of social welfare programs available (free food, healthcare, education, and housing), but if you don't put in the effort to pursue the freebies, then it is nobody's fault but your own.

[FrankMiller]

Originally Posted by 1grin_g0

You managed to miss the entire point, which to be honest is not surprising. I like how you dismissed it with the whole right wing conspiracy thing though, that was cute.

Let me help you. There are plenty of social welfare programs available (free food, healthcare, education, and housing), but if you don't put in the effort to pursue the freebies, then it is nobody's fault but your own.

I guess I just don't understand what point you were trying to make. Regardless, there are various time limits for SNAP benefits so you usually can't feed yourself for a lifetime regardless of your application proficiency.

[green_mariner]

Originally Posted by FrankMiller

In the mid-19th century there were various groups dedicated to the liberation of black people, and few formed for the cause of white liberation. Clearly, blacks were the most coddled demographic of the antebellum south.

Because Black people weren't free. White people had freedom. That is not coddling, that is understanding that freedom is a basic human right. If Blacks were so coddled in the South, why were they not permitted to learn how to read? Why were Blacks slaves? Why were Blacks the most looked down on people in the South? Why were Blacks trying to run away and go north?

[FrankMiller]

Originally Posted by green_mariner

Because Black people weren't free. White people had freedom.

Yes, that's exactly my point. Black focused institutions, scholarships, etc. exist because they're necessary to address the disadvantages blacks have in our society, they're not evidence that blacks are especially catered to.