Cleveland vs. St. Louis: suburban edition (Independence, Chesterfield: crime, neighborhoods, university)

[yofie]

The Cleveland and St. Louis metro areas are amazingly similar on many counts, whether it be the population size or Rust Belt status. Comparable, but of course not quite identical, as they also differ on many counts, with Cleveland being more of a Great Lakes city originally of New England heritage and St. Louis being more of a river city reminiscent of Baltimore or Philadelphia as well. I think also that the suburbs in those areas could be compared in many ways. Having been many, many more times to some of Cleveland's East Side suburbs - particularly to the heavily-Jewish ones like Univ. Heights and Beachwood, as I'm Jewish myself - than to its West Side suburbs (and to anywhere in St. Louis, for that matter), I may be biased. But between being often in eastern Cleveland and reading up about all these topics, here are some possible analogies between Cleveland suburbs and St. Louis suburbs:



Cleveland Heights/Univ. Heights/S. Euclid ~= University City

Shaker Heights ~= Clayton (minus the skyscrapers and the county seat status)

Beachwood ~= Olivette/Ladue

Pepper Pike/Moreland Hills ~= Creve Coeur

Solon ~= Chesterfield

Lyndhurst ~= Overland

Mayfield Heights ~= Maryland Heights

Independence ~= Fenton

East Cleveland ~= East St. Louis (in terms of crime and urban decline)

Lorain/Elyria ~= East St. Louis (in terms of being the core of a smaller, down-on-the-heels metro area next to the main metro area)



This is what I've thoroughly thought of. Please correct me where necessary, and please feel free to add to this list (e.g. what the St. Louis equivalent of Richmond Hgts. or Euclid or Garfield Hgts. or Parma or Rocky River or Bay Village would be); you're more than welcome to do so.

[Angus215]

I think you could find comparable suburban areas in just about any major city. Has more to do with the decade in which they were built, than the city they are outside of. What is more interesting, in my opinion, is comparing neighborhoods in the city itself. I'm not familiar with Cleveland, but I find that St Louis compares with Baltimore in many ways, though STL probably has more good areas (and doesn't have a waterfront to speak of). Philly is several steps above, however, in terms of the vibrancy of its downtown and the quantity and variety of its walkable neighborhoods.

[MUTGR]

Originally Posted by yofie

The Cleveland and St. Louis metro areas are amazingly similar on many counts, whether it be the population size or Rust Belt status. Comparable, but of course not quite identical, as they also differ on many counts, with Cleveland being more of a Great Lakes city originally of New England heritage and St. Louis being more of a river city reminiscent of Baltimore or Philadelphia as well. I think also that the suburbs in those areas could be compared in many ways. Having been many, many more times to some of Cleveland's East Side suburbs - particularly to the heavily-Jewish ones like Univ. Heights and Beachwood, as I'm Jewish myself - than to its West Side suburbs (and to anywhere in St. Louis, for that matter), I may be biased. But between being often in eastern Cleveland and reading up about all these topics, here are some possible analogies between Cleveland suburbs and St. Louis suburbs:



Cleveland Heights/Univ. Heights/S. Euclid ~= University City

Shaker Heights ~= Clayton (minus the skyscrapers and the county seat status)

Beachwood ~= Olivette/Ladue

Pepper Pike/Moreland Hills ~= Creve Coeur

Solon ~= Chesterfield

Lyndhurst ~= Overland

Mayfield Heights ~= Maryland Heights

Independence ~= Fenton

East Cleveland ~= East St. Louis (in terms of crime and urban decline)

Lorain/Elyria ~= East St. Louis (in terms of being the core of a smaller, down-on-the-heels metro area next to the main metro area)



This is what I've thoroughly thought of. Please correct me where necessary, and please feel free to add to this list (e.g. what the St. Louis equivalent of Richmond Hgts. or Euclid or Garfield Hgts. or Parma or Rocky River or Bay Village would be); you're more than welcome to do so.

I can't really comment with this level of detail, but I will simply say I spent a week in Cleveland a few years ago and had some opportunities to drive around and meet some locals and I very much came away with the impression that Cleveland metro and St. Louis metro have a lot in common.

[zach_33]

I have often believed St. Louis and Cleveland are kindred cities. The differences you pointed out are the same as I perceive. I don't know the burbs of Cleveland at all, but the Clayton/U City parallel to Cleveland/University/Shaker Heights really does pop, on paper at least. I think I would like it there


What about Rocky River? Does it have a twin the St. Louis burbs?