Another one moving to St. Louis! (Washington, Laclede: rental homes, lofts, crime rate)

[joe stixpuck]

Do Soulard. We'll meet you there for the pizza and beer at Joannie's.

Check into Lafayette Square also. I think Benton Park is good too, but it does have more issues with crime that the other two. The lofts on Washington are nice, but coming from another former south Chicagoan I think you'll find the Soulard area is a heavenly lil' slice a' city.

Dogtown and the Hill are fine, but further away and certainly less fun for a single person. You might have better luck finding a dedicated house rather than an apartment though. It all depends on the budget for any one the areas. Don't do the burbs either way...they have crime there also, just like anywhere, most notably the boredom and lack of things to do which are most heinous.

Good luck on the search and let us know how is going. Some of us are expecting that free pizza and beer for the excellent advice, ha ha.

And of course we all take enough pride in StL to hope help ya find the most suitable place that you'll enjoy the living! Good luck and fire away with any futher questions. Oh yeah, check into the Tower Grove area too.

[EyesInTheSky]

More great information and I thank all of you very much. In response to your replies:

Joe Stixpuck: Thanks, I will also check out Lafayette Square just to the northwest of Soulard. As for Tower Grove, my neighborhood map lists a Tower Grove East and a Tower Grove South; which one would you recommend (or are they equally desirable)? Also, although I'm not yet seriously considering the suburbs, someone else mentioned the small town of St. George, which *IF* I were going to rely upon driving to work seems like it would be a reasonable commute -- essentially a 7-mile drive up I-55 to get to work. And yes, I'm completely serious about the pizza and beer! I'll be glad to treat the folks that are helping me out on here. That's the least I can do, plus it would be a good way for me to break the ice and start making friends in my new home city.

Brickmama: Thanks for the clarification on the street names and their relationship to criminal activity. As I recall the person who told me that lives in Chesterfield and is not native to St. Louis, so that might explain the inaccuracy. I initially considered Chesterfield when I learned how nice it is, but quickly changed my mind when I learned how far it is from work.

Zach_33: Thanks for reinforcing my opinion on Soulard and the great description of nearby neighborhoods that are worth considering (and avoiding). Your excellent comments helped bring this in to better focus.

Oscottscotto: Thanks to you as well for affirming the growing consensus for Soulard. It's looking likely that it's going to be Soulard, but I do want to check the Loft District, and also see what I can get in terms of a house rental for the same money in The Hill (and possibly a couple other of the western neighborhoods).

Aragx6: Yes, I understand and agree that most urban crime tends to be localized and mostly occur in relatively small areas of the city. Even San Francisco, which is perhaps the most expensive major city in the country, has a couple rough spots. I like your comparison of Chicago's south side to St. Louis' north side; as a native Chicagoan I definitely can relate! As for my rent, I don't have any specific dollar amount in mind, but I tend to be on the frugal side and will sacrifice having a nicer place for having something more modest, in order to save money. I'd rather invest my money for the future than hand it over in rent. Plus, my job is going to require overseas trips a couple times a year (for a few months at a time), so often times I won't even be home to enjoy the place I'm paying rent on!

Thanks again everybody! Please feel free to keep posting any of your thoughts, experiences, and opinions. I read everything you're posting and I'm putting the information to good use. I may take a trip to St. Louis early next week to start looking at places.

[oscottscotto]

As for the two Tower Groves you listed, you would want "Tower Grove South".

[aragx6]

Tower Grove South is the more desirable -- parts of Tower Grove East are fine, but it can be block by block.

If you do a search of the forum you can find more information on the two neighborhoods including info on the best streets.

Your best bet for finding a house in that area would be farther west of Grand -- west of Morganford are smaller homes that would be available for rent -- the closer to Grand, the bigger and nicer the houses -- multi-families are more common near that area.

As for St. George? I'm a little surprised someone would recommend it to you, but then again, I don't know you. It's teeny tiny, very suburban, the opposite of diverse (almost 100% white), working class and not particularly convenient to anything.

My vote still goes to Soulard for ease of commute, though you probably won't find a SFH in that area that doesn't cost a fortune -- a townhouse should be very possible in the $750 - 1100/month range though.

[joe stixpuck]

Yeah...I'd pass on St. George...didn't realize many people were even aware the place exists, ha ha.

Soulard townhouse rents listed directly above are pretty accurate, and that can get ya a nice size 2br at that. I recently checked out a VERY nice and huge (like 1500ft/sq, rooftop deck, newly remodeled, w/d, etc.) place in Benton Park East that was only like $875 right by the Venice Cafe but unsure if still available...it was sweet but more space than I needed alone. Looked at (tiny!) 1br great location in Soulard and it was only $425. There are some great bargains around for sure!

Can't speak for anyone else obviously, but I can likely meet up with ya for a brew or two up that way sometime. I'm not living up there at the moment, but work up that way and looking to move into one of several the same neighborhoods you're checking out also. I'm always up for making a new acquaintance or friend, and can also likely help ya connect with some of the other folks I know up there.

I've been away for a few years (SF Bay mostly, but Seattle and Philly too) but know most of the areas you're searching out pretty well so no problem to help out. I'm reaquainting myself with them(as well as friends) and it's a nice process, but makes it a little easier for me having already been establisted in the area before. Send me a message through city-data and can also email ya any properties while searching CL myself to give ya an idea on costs or options.

[Brickmama]

Check out the lofts on Wash ave and check ouy Soulard. Both are great areas and whatever choice you make you will not be disappointed.

[EyesInTheSky]

More great info; thanks everybody!

I'll synthesize my responses:

- If I search the Tower Grove neighborhoods, then "South" is preferred over "East"; so noted.

- The person who recommended St. George to me was also on one of my interview/escort teams at my new job. I was taking notes and jotting down the suburbs and St. Louis neighborhoods they mentioned, so that's how I learned of it. It's apparent that nearly all the folks I met during my interviews and the open house visit are suburbanites (with the exception of one, who lives in The Hill). Further, all of them are transplants from somewhere else, which probably is why they were giving me this sort of one-dimensional view on where-to-live.

- The consensus on Soulard seems to be overwhelming, and that's the neighborhood I'm going to target when I come down to hunt for a place (which hopefully will be next week). Assuming I find a good housing situation and the crime issue appears manageable, I agree with others on the forum that have said Soulard is a "no brainer" for me. However, I'm also going to consider the Loft District and perhaps a couple of the western neighborhoods (The Hill, Dogtown, St. Louis Hills), because I may need to move further out in order to rent an entire house at a reasonable rent. Also, given that I'll sometimes be overseas for a few months at a time, I like the idea of the home security that presumably the Loft District can provide (security entrances, etc.).

- To those of you that offered to let me contact you by direct message if necessary, thank you! I'll definitely take you up on that!

Thanks again everybody, and feel free to keep the information flowing! This forum is great!

[joe stixpuck]

Lofts (on Washington) will definitely be secure. Most are very nice also. Make sure that underground parking is included (or at least available) for your vehicle. Those will likely be your best bet where security is concerned and you don't have someone to check on your stuff. Prepare to part ways with most all notions of frugality though--that goes beyond just rent.

Although Soulard is likely the best 'bang for you buck' in many ways, it'll be pretty difficult to find a place that isn't a multi-family or at least 2 apartments. You may have better luck searching areas like StL Hills or Dogtown, but I haven't seen many options there lately. Single-family homes for rent are just kinda rare, but Are out there...certainly available if you're in the market to buy, but rentals are just scarce right now I guess. If you're set on a rental house it'll likely place ya a ways'a'way from anyplace that is an interesting place to live. Search! You may have to take something temporary and then just drive around and look for a 'for rent' sign placed in some random yard.

I've come across a few options that may suit ya that will email after you've narrowed down preference a little if ya need. I've been looking the past couple months so have a fair idea of what you seem to be seeking also since it's fairly aligned with my search parameters.

I may be 'pulling the trigger' on a Soulard apt tomorrow actually, and have a friend will be meeting with over the weekend who I'll be getting some specific info about his WashAve loft experience.

No worries in StL regarding housing...the available inventory far exceeds the demand. Great options are abundant assuming you make even so low as 25K around these parts.....

[OA 5599]

I was looking on Craigslist at places in Soulard the other day (I may also move to St. Louis) and found quite a few town homes for less than $1000 a month, like this one for $850: 2 bath townhouse! Exposed brick + skylights and offstreet parking

It even has off-street parking. Not a single family home like you'd find in a newer neighborhood (with a garage and stuff), but you'd have the entire place to yourself.

[EyesInTheSky]

Joe & OA, thanks for the info.

Joe, did you pull the trigger on a place in Soulard? Yes, it does seem rental homes are much more scarce in Soulard compared to The Hill. But as you said, St. Louis is an affordable city. For example, I was seriously considering accepting a job in Arlington, VA, but even a tiny 1-bedroom apartment in a nice complex close to work would have cost at least $1,500 (and often more) per month. And renting a whole house in the good neighborhoods of Arlington often runs $3,000 to $3,500 a month! So compared to most of the other cities I received offers from, St. Louis looks like a bargain. If you run across any interesting deals, feel free to send them to me. :-) I might just live in temporary housing like an Extended Stay America or something like that, until I can find the housing situation I'm looking for.

OA_5599, thanks for the lead on the Soulard townhouse. This looks like a very intriguing possibility and I'll definitely check it out when I come down, if it's still available.