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Old 01-30-2013, 10:20 AM
 
60 posts, read 111,787 times
Reputation: 104

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We're moving to Winston-Salem, a similarly sized town to Syracuse that is also rebuilding its economy. Some "apples to apples" things I've noted so far:
  • Property/school taxes seem to be far less than CNY
  • Gasoline is about $.35 less/gallon
  • Property values seem roughly comparable
  • We'll be paying about 1% more in state income taxes in NC.

Note that this isn't deeply researched but is based upon my personal experience. Overall, I think our money will go a bit further in NC but only time will tell.
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Old 01-30-2013, 10:33 AM
 
56,338 posts, read 80,579,507 times
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Consider commute distance possibly in NC, personal property tax and toll tax in NC. Boone actually has roughly the same overall COL as Ithaca, another college town that is bigger.Moderator cut: link removed, linking to competitor sites is not allowed

Last edited by Yac; 02-13-2013 at 06:29 AM..
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Old 01-30-2013, 10:53 AM
 
56,338 posts, read 80,579,507 times
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Here's another and more similar comparison:Moderator cut: link removed, linking to competitor sites is not allowed

Plattsburgh has a free city beach, proximity to mountains and Lake Champlain, an hour from Montreal and Burlington VT and has a 2 and 4 year college. It has its own municipal fitness building which was a former Air Base facility with good rates too.

Last edited by Yac; 02-13-2013 at 06:29 AM..
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Old 01-30-2013, 11:00 AM
 
57 posts, read 131,218 times
Reputation: 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by Walkerstudios View Post
""Did I see wood paneling in the bedrooms of the NC house? haha

Anyways, if you are looking to buy a house in the middle of nowhere in CNY you will not be paying $9,000 in property taxes for a $150,000 house. My house in liverpool is assessed at roughly $150,000 and my taxes are under $5,000.""

Wood paneling can be easily replaced - punitive taxes not so easily.
I picked these two places because they are about as close to the job opportunities as I could find.
Under $5000 in taxes, well if your house was in western nc it would be about $600/yr - wouldnt you like to have $4,400 more in your pocket? I would.
Again, it wouldn't be $4,400, can't just take the difference...property taxes can be deducted from your federal taxes.

Yes, I would like my taxes to be lower, much lower. I get the point you are making it just wasn't and apples to apples comparison and doesn't paint a realistic picture.

ALso, my cousin lives in the suburbs of Winston-Salem and with a house assessed at $200,000 he pays $2500 in taxes a year (NOt sure if that includes School taxes) and while it's less than here it's not as little as you make it seem. Also, not sure what the public school system is compared to here but he also pays for private school. Not sure if he would do the same if living here or not but something to consider.

Again, I am not disagreeing with the point you are trying to make...taxes in NY (income and property) are out of control and will be less in most places, especially down South. It's just not as simple of a comparison as you made it seem.
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Old 01-30-2013, 11:09 AM
 
56,338 posts, read 80,579,507 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cusetownusa View Post
Again, it wouldn't be $4,400, can't just take the difference...property taxes can be deducted from your federal taxes.

Yes, I would like my taxes to be lower, much lower. I get the point you are making it just wasn't and apples to apples comparison and doesn't paint a realistic picture.

ALso, my cousin lives in the suburbs of Winston-Salem and with a house assessed at $200,000 he pays $2500 in taxes a year (NOt sure if that includes School taxes) and while it's less than here it's not as little as you make it seem. Also, not sure what the public school system is compared to here but he also pays for private school. Not sure if he would do the same if living here or not but something to consider.

Again, I am not disagreeing with the point you are trying to make...taxes in NY (income and property) are out of control and will be less in most places, especially down South. It's just not as simple of a comparison as you made it seem.
Exactly and I think that is the point others have been trying to make. Overall COL would make more sense to compare and in terms of similar communities in relation to those states/metros, etc.
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Old 01-30-2013, 11:40 AM
 
69 posts, read 111,980 times
Reputation: 50
Ok here is COL:
Clinton costs more in every regard compared with Boone. From BestPlaces.net:

COSTLIV Boone Clinton United States
Overall 106 129 100
Grocery 105 113 100
Health 105 111 100
Housing 120 167 100
Utilities 95 127 100
Transportation 96 106 100
Miscellaneous 100 114 100
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Old 01-30-2013, 12:04 PM
 
56,338 posts, read 80,579,507 times
Reputation: 12439
Quote:
Originally Posted by Walkerstudios View Post
Ok here is COL:
Clinton costs more in every regard compared with Boone. From BestPlaces.net:

COSTLIV Boone Clinton United States
Overall 106 129 100
Grocery 105 113 100
Health 105 111 100
Housing 120 167 100
Utilities 95 127 100
Transportation 96 106 100
Miscellaneous 100 114 100
I know, as it is arguably the most affluent community in the Utica-Rome metro area(New Hartford is up there too). Keep in mind that it is for the village and doesn't include the town of Kirkland. For those that don't know, Clinton is in line with villages like Skaneateles, Cazenovia, Lewiston and Pittsford. Boone is a college town of about 15-20,000 in Western NC(Appalachian State). So, the Plattsburgh comparison is more in line due to community size, having a college presence, proximity to mountains and even location in relation to their respective states.
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Old 01-30-2013, 01:11 PM
 
Location: Deep in the Woods
2,549 posts, read 2,667,397 times
Reputation: 2855
Don't even bother getting into this argument with these folks. Anyone trying to make an accurate comparison for the purpose of relocation has to understand that most people here are fiercely protective of the area, which isn't a bad thing, but it will make using this forum to make an accurate comparison impossible. Trust me, I've tried. I know that cost of living calculators are completely inaccurate and even when you find one that shows NC costing less, it will be questioned as to its validity. For example:

Cost of Living comparison calculator

Doesn't have Syracuse so I used Rochester. 12% cheaper in Raleigh than Rochester on 50k.

Or this one for Syracuse:

PayScale

Showing everything cheaper in Raleigh, except groceries, which were equal. This includes housing, 21% cheaper in Raleigh over Syracuse. I've been arguing that point for weeks, but like I said, it doesn't matter. Your calculator will be inaccurate compared to theirs.

The reality is most cost of living calculators do not include property taxes, or they include a flat rate common to most of the country, like $10 per $1000. That's how NY comes out on top in many of them, its rate can be as much as $40 per $1000. Property taxes are very local, and therefore, hard to assess accurately. Like proulxfamily said, one house could be $5k and another $9k on the same house cost. Taxes in the Triangle, for example, did double in some areas. They went from $500 a year to $1000. Like I said, very hard to quantify in relation to states in the Northeast that property taxes could be as much as 1/4 of your salary.

My advice: don't bother arguing. Do your own research and look at the "intangibles" of each area- the attributes that cannot be measured (i.e. feel, the people, your life situation, your bank account, your spouses feelings, your personal preference for weather, etc). In some way, CNY will come out on top, but in other ways, including costs, NC will come out on top.

Last edited by VintageSunlight; 01-30-2013 at 01:24 PM.. Reason: mistyped
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Old 01-30-2013, 01:31 PM
 
2,440 posts, read 4,967,089 times
Reputation: 1973
Our taxes are $3000/year and have stayed the same. Their takes went from nine hundred something to almost $2000. Our home's value has gone up. Their home's value has stayed the same. Their homeowner's has gone from $800 to $1300/year. They pay much more for water and their trash/recycling isn't included in their taxes. Their central air needs to be kept running, year-round, because of the humidity... otherwise, they get mold and crumbling paint.

I'd say that it's, at most, breaking even. At least, our expenses come out less.
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Old 01-30-2013, 01:59 PM
 
56,338 posts, read 80,579,507 times
Reputation: 12439
Quote:
Originally Posted by VintageSunlight View Post
Don't even bother getting into this argument with these folks. Anyone trying to make an accurate comparison for the purpose of relocation has to understand that most people here are fiercely protective of the area, which isn't a bad thing, but it will make using this forum to make an accurate comparison impossible. Trust me, I've tried. I know that cost of living calculators are completely inaccurate and even when you find one that shows NC costing less, it will be questioned as to its validity. For example:

Cost of Living comparison calculator

Doesn't have Syracuse so I used Rochester. 12% cheaper in Raleigh than Rochester on 50k.

Or this one for Syracuse:

PayScale

Showing everything cheaper in Raleigh, except groceries, which were equal. This includes housing, 21% cheaper in Raleigh over Syracuse. I've been arguing that point for weeks, but like I said, it doesn't matter. Your calculator will be inaccurate compared to theirs.

The reality is most cost of living calculators do not include property taxes, or they include a flat rate common to most of the country, like $10 per $1000. That's how NY comes out on top in many of them, its rate can be as much as $40 per $1000. Property taxes are very local, and therefore, hard to assess accurately. Like proulxfamily said, one house could be $5k and another $9k on the same house cost. Taxes in the Triangle, for example, did double in some areas. They went from $500 a year to $1000. Like I said, very hard to quantify in relation to states in the Northeast that property taxes could be as much as 1/4 of your salary.

My advice: don't bother arguing. Do your own research and look at the "intangibles" of each area- the attributes that cannot be measured (i.e. feel, the people, your life situation, your bank account, your spouses feelings, your personal preference for weather, etc). In some way, CNY will come out on top, but in other ways, including costs, NC will come out on top.
My only problem with those calculators is that it is for the metro, where as the one I use(bestplaces) is based on the specific community. I think people understand that metro areas vary greatly by community.

I agree about the intangibles, as I don't think anyone has said that moving either way was wrong or not to do it.
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