What is Destiny USA? (Buffalo, Syracuse: 2009, credit, hotels)

[cpiseco]

Hey all,

I've been living up in the Syracuse area for a couple months now and I still don't quite understand what "Destiny USA" is. I walk around the Carousel Center and I see these renderings of these grand ideas...Tuscan Villages, nice hotels, etc...and it all looks very nice.

What, if anything, is actually being built? It still looks pretty stagnant down there.

[JiminCT]

A fantasy that is being used by a developer for cheap tax breaks......

[bellafinzi]

Originally Posted by JiminCT

A fantasy that is being used by a developer for cheap tax breaks......

Could very well be, but that makes no logical sense. Here's why:

The PILOT tax agreement only stands if each phase of the expansion takes place within a set timeframe. For example, if phase 2 of the expansion does not begin before a certain month in 2009 "(forgot the exact date) then the Mall goes back on the tax rolls.

If the developer didn't intend to build the whole project, why did he make an agreement that only allows tax breaks as long as the project moves ahead?

[bellafinzi]

Originally Posted by cpiseco

Hey all,

I've been living up in the Syracuse area for a couple months now and I still don't quite understand what "Destiny USA" is. I walk around the Carousel Center and I see these renderings of these grand ideas...Tuscan Villages, nice hotels, etc...and it all looks very nice.

What, if anything, is actually being built? It still looks pretty stagnant down there.

The first phase, what is under construction, is just retail....more stores and restaurants. If my memory is correct, after the first phase is complete, Carousel Mall will become the fourth largest mall in the US.

The second phase is the hotel. The developer is having trouble finding financing with the current credit crunch.

[JiminCT]

He may want to expand the mall....but he may be committing economic suicide if he's not careful. That mall is a SHADOW of what it was when it opened...even adding stores he'd be wise to differentiate the store selection given the competition for shopping with ROchester, Albany and Buffalo (like a Cabellas...). If gas were 2.00 a gallon (lol..) things may be more optimistic for the Syracuse mall...but I think he's going to have a tough time drawing people there with the economy and gas issues coming down the pike/thruway unless he creates something highly different...

My hunch is that the creditors will want to see what he does with the expansion. I'm not a pessimist...but I think that mall draws a consumer that will be more effected by this coming recesssion than a lot of areas. Of course I hope I'm wrong....

I still think Syracuse is getting used big time by Congel....

[bellafinzi]

Originally Posted by cpiseco

Hey all,

I've been living up in the Syracuse area for a couple months now and I still don't quite understand what "Destiny USA" is. I walk around the Carousel Center and I see these renderings of these grand ideas...Tuscan Villages, nice hotels, etc...and it all looks very nice.

What, if anything, is actually being built? It still looks pretty stagnant down there.

Sorry, I never really answered your question. Basically Destiny USA is another Mall of America but this time built using green technology....

[jrice]

It is Syracuse's big economic hope for the future. They feel they will attract shoppers from around the northeast and Canada.

Syracuse would be better off providing tax breaks and incentives for manufact./other industry based businesses to move in the area. As it stands now most major industry has moved out, and if Verizon starts going the way of other telecoms/IT businesses you will see alot of support/help desk jobs leave the area as well.

Retail is not the solution Syracuse needs.

[Texan Guy]

Originally Posted by JiminCT

He may want to expand the mall....but he may be committing economic suicide if he's not careful. That mall is a SHADOW of what it was when it opened...

How so? The mall did lose a few anchors (Lechmere, Chappell's, Hills) but were filled in with new juniors. Granted, there's a few vacancies (Circuit City, Macy's Furniture, CompUSA, Steve & Barry's) and there's a recession going on, but I'm sure Pyramid has it all figured out.

...or do they?

[Jeromeville]

LOL, I doubt very much they have it figured out.

[jzcrandall]

Carousel Mall seems to have pretty much all the same stores that the average mall here in Richmond has, with the exception of some high-end retailers like Crate and Barrel or Nordstrom. Would there even be a sizable market for those kinds of stores in the Syracuse area? Personally, the main mall needs to be remodeled so that it doesn't look the mall from Fast Times at Ridgemont High before they can even think about expanding. I think they need to benchmark Tyson's Corner mall in suburban Washington, DC.