An interesting site about Syracuse's past (Boston, Clinton: low income, best city, apartment)

[ckhthankgod]

Yestercuse: The Rise and Fall of Syracuse

[PineHallGirl]

Originally Posted by ckhthankgod

Yestercuse: The Rise and Fall of Syracuse

LOVE IT Ckh...I just read it and bookmarked it.

Thanks for all that you do Ckh!

[RollsRoyce]

While the content of the site is informative, its premise that Syracuse is doomed and is on the path to oblivion is counterproductive and damaging to many who have not formed opinions of the city. In fact, a few of the buildings profiled have since been redeveloped, something the operator I believe purposely omits.

[ckhthankgod]

Originally Posted by RollsRoyce

While the content of the site is informative, its premise that Syracuse is doomed and is on the path to oblivion is counterproductive and damaging to many who have not formed opinions of the city. In fact, a few of the buildings profiled have since been redeveloped, something the operator I believe purposely omits.

I agree. I think the site does exaggerate the state of affairs in the area. I actually like it due to the pictures and the history, more than anything else. Here's another site that is pretty good too:Syracuse Then and Now This one is more positive and also has great historical and recent pictures of the area.

[RollsRoyce]

Syracuse Then and Now is a good site. Although it can be depressing to see how vibrant many neighborhoods such as the W. Onondaga Street corridor and lower James Street once were compared to their current state. The site has excellent pictures of the Berkeley Park and Strathmore areas. It would be nice if they better showcased Sedgwick which is one of the best city neighborhoods in my opinion along with Bradford Hills, Winkworth, and Berkeley. The Sedgwick Farm website (the http escapes me) contains pictures mostly from 1970s. Interestingly enough, many of those houses are in a lot better shape today than those pictures depicted 30+ years ago.

[ckhthankgod]

Originally Posted by RollsRoyce

Syracuse Then and Now is a good site. Although it can be depressing to see how vibrant many neighborhoods such as the W. Onondaga Street corridor and lower James Street once were compared to their current state. The site has excellent pictures of the Berkeley Park and Strathmore areas. It would be nice if they better showcased Sedgwick which is one of the best city neighborhoods in my opinion along with Bradford Hills, Winkworth, and Berkeley. The Sedgwick Farm website (the http escapes me) contains pictures mostly from 1970s. Interestingly enough, many of those houses are in a lot better shape today than those pictures depicted 30+ years ago.

What you said about the W. Onondaga area is another reason why those sites interest me. To see how things have changed, but should we be surprised? Many of those pictures were taken before the suburban boom and the continual White/Economic flight that went along with it. While there is still some slight hope that such areas can come back with persistance and good leadership, it might be a long time before we see that with such neighborhoods. At least there are some steps being made for such neighborhoods like the Near Westside initiative and Prospect hill by St. Joe's Hospital though.

[justflow1983]

I spent a lot of time in the Onondaga Historical Society when I was researching my B. Arch thesis, and that's when I fell in love with the urban possibilities of Syracuse. There are some amazing photographs of the city, and whats even more amazing are the maps of downtown before they tore it down to build parking. That city really had density! A big part of what makes it so hard to revamp the city has to do with the fact that it has lost much of its urban structure, so it doesn't really provide much contrast between city and suburb other than an unfavorable economic one.

[RollsRoyce]

Originally Posted by justflow1983

I spent a lot of time in the Onondaga Historical Society when I was researching my B. Arch thesis, and that's when I fell in love with the urban possibilities of Syracuse. There are some amazing photographs of the city, and whats even more amazing are the maps of downtown before they tore it down to build parking. That city really had density! A big part of what makes it so hard to revamp the city has to do with the fact that it has lost much of its urban structure, so it doesn't really provide much contrast between city and suburb other than an unfavorable economic one.

I too have visited the OHA and read several books on Syracuse history by Dick Case and several other authors. The reduction of density is a major problem that is about to get worse when two buildings: the former WFBL building on S. Warren and a vacant convenience store at Warren and Fayette are demolished by the city. While both buildings in my opinion are eyesores (especially the seedy convenience store) and have no historical value since they were constructed in the 1940s and 1950s, the city should have solicited proposals to fill the soon-to-be vacant lots with new mixed-use structures with retail and office space on the ground floor and market rate residential units on the upper floors. All vibrant cities have density, particularly in their downtown areas. Syracuse still has several swaths of good density in its Central Business District that reminds me of Lower Manhattan, Cleveland, Boston, and Philadelphia. My biggest worry is that the condition of the Mizpah tower will continue to decline and will ultimately lead to demolition. This underutilized structure is one of the most iconic buildings in Syracuse and could be a cornerstone for the revitalization of Columbus Circle.

On a more positive side, the development of Jefferson Clinton Commons (www.jccommons.com) will add significant density to the Armory Square district and result in the first in-fill construction activity downtown in over a decade. My only gripe is that the building is just 4 stories. According to the Post-Standard, another vacant lot across from the Atrium garage will house a 5 story office building that will be anchored by O'Brien & Gere, an engineering firm that will relocate 300 of its employees from DeWitt. I am not fond of the building's design as it looks like a 1980s replica from a suburban office park in Norwalk, CT.

I long dream of 3 to 4, sleek 25 to 34 story mixed use skyscrapers with full glass facades housing a mix of hotel, office, apartment, and condo units. Such structures could still be built without the demolition of any historical buildings as there are numerous surface parking lots and low rise non conforming 1950s buildings that could be demolished. Given the economy and the small town mentality of local leadership that hates anything that is tall, upscale, and modern, I doubt this will ever happen. I'm sure the city would require that 3/4 of the units be low income housing which would ultimately kill the project.

Syracuse's skyline is unattractive with its short and boxy 1970s office towers. Several taller buildings could better balance the skyline and give Syracuse a look consistent with its medium-sized city counterparts in Hartford, Little Rock, Louisville, Des Moines, and Grand Rapids.

[Jeromeville]

Originally Posted by justflow1983

I spent a lot of time in the Onondaga Historical Society when I was researching my B. Arch thesis, and that's when I fell in love with the urban possibilities of Syracuse. There are some amazing photographs of the city, and whats even more amazing are the maps of downtown before they tore it down to build parking. That city really had density! A big part of what makes it so hard to revamp the city has to do with the fact that it has lost much of its urban structure, so it doesn't really provide much contrast between city and suburb other than an unfavorable economic one.

What was your thesis about?

[justflow1983]

Originally Posted by RollsRoyce

, sleek 25 to 34 story mixed use skyscrapers with full glass facades housing a mix of hotel, office, apartment, and condo units. Such structures could still be built without the demolition of any historical buildings as there are numerous surface parking lots and low rise non conforming 1950s buildings that could be demolished.

While I totally agree that those would be beautiful in syracuse, they'd be totally outsized to the current building scale. Its funny, I moved to Dublin and couldn't believe how short it is, but in some ways the scales are perfect for the infill of a city like syracuse, since lots of 4 and 5 story new builds can fill out a city faster than a couple of high-rises. Here's a redevelopment plan that my old office worked on for Dublin's docklands redevelopment: Dublin Docklands

My thesis was a convention center for downtown. Its a design thesis, so the choice of building type was basically so that i could make it into anything I wanted. I decided to clear up the I-81 and I-690 intersection so all onramps and offramps were in the same location. I then laid out a convention center crosswise with the large spaces underground to not break up the city; the roof was at ground level and was a park. Towers on either side gave a visual continuity across the highway to start re-stitching the city together.

I'll post a couple of pics when I get home from the office.