Moving to Syracuse (New York, Buffalo, White Plains: how much, landscaping, to buy)

[alicia37]

It seems like we should...or shouldn't?...My longtime boyfriend is most likely relocating to Liverpool from where we live in southeastern Pennsylvania. I grew up on Long Island and he is from New Jersey. The distance seems to be about 3 1/2 hours drive and if the move is not permanent, I will stay in PA. He loves to hike. Snow is alright with him. How is skiing? Are there resorts close? Do you think he will cheat on me? That last question was a joke...There is a chance we could actually start our life together and I am wondering if I should go up with him?.?.?...

[YankeeTom]

Originally Posted by who

Kinda hard to be the guy from Sacramento when I was living in Syracuse two years ago. Keep trying, though, if that floats your boat. (I've never seen this forum until three days ago.)

I respond to all of the glowing reports of Syracuse, because I think people want to hear the other side of the story as well. Maybe you find your opinions correct, but I don't. I'm certainly not alone, either. When I pulled into Syracuse, dropped off the U-Haul, the first thing the first Syracuse native (the U-Haul clerk) said to me was, "Why the hell did you move here for?" Not to mention the heavy exodus from Syracuse to better jobs in the South. Syracuse's population plummeted in the late 80s and continues to do so.

As for the bad relationship...actually, the same woman I was with then in Syracuse, is here with me as well. We're getting married in two months. Amazing!, ain't it?

Have fun in the 100 inches.

Have fun with 100+ degrees , unbreathable air and water wars also; 500sq foot homes for half a million on postage stamp land that you might OR might NOT own

[bellafinzi]

Are there any members of City Data that were also asked "Why the hell did you move here for?" after they moved to CNY?

Is this still on going or did all those Debbie Downers finally move away?

Just curious if CNY is changing....

[justflow1983]

I just had a "moment of clarity" after reading these posts. I think I understand bella's "Yay! Suburbs!" posts a bit better. I think that it has to to with "suburban minded" people and the city of Syracuse. People who are "suburban minded" are those who spend a lot of time in their car, like subdivisions, usually have kids, like to shop at malls and such, maybe like to run or ski. Soccer-mom types. Syracuse is paradise for that, because it is exactly like the suburbs everywhere else in the US except for without the traffic and its cheaper. its just so ridiculously easy to live a consumerist lifestyle in, which is how most people like to live really. Its also a lot easier to get to the countryside, and take a monthly trip downtown for dinner or going to the bar.

In terms of "urban minded" people (and I am definitely one, I hate being car dependant with every fibre in my body) it is either great or terrible. For people who are urban pioneers, who like have a bit of a rundown downtown to fix up however they like, and a blank canvas for them to dream about, its a wonderful opportunity. And its true that things are picking up. For other people who like a city already functioning, where everything to do is out in the open and you have a lot of choice, its probably not so great. You can live downtown and walk everywhere, but its got the veneer of a city, with a few really urbanized neighborhoods, without the depth and complexity of a real metropolis. Those people, depending on where they live, can probably like it for a while and then get sick of it.

For people in the middle ground, who like a bit more urbanisation but aren't City people, then they probably all land in city neighborhoods and it probably completely sucks for them. For those who complain about there being nothing to do, then you haven't looked. My girlfriend, who's Irish and lives in Dublin with me, was actually pretty impressed with going to Syracuse Stage and going to Armory Square... it was pretty horrifying though that all my friends thought I was insane for bringing her to 'cuse and kep asking her if she hated it yet. These are the same people who are well travelled yet say they'd never leave Syracuse as long as they had work there.

[RollsRoyce]

Many urbanites have a flagrant inability to comprehend why some enjoy living in the suburbs. My aunt lives in the Carnegie Hill neighborhood on Manhattan's Upper East Side, and couldn't fathom why my father, a native Brooklynite would settle and raise a family in suburban Westchester County. There is a perception, often advanced by the national media that suburbanites are corpulent, uneducated, drive big American-made SUVs, and live in cheap plastic homes. While there is certainly truth to this caricature, especially in less affluent parts of the country, neither I nor my parents, or friends, fall under this stereotype. I like cities and enjoy the ease of transportation, density, and architecture. However, there are many cities that are blighted, blue collar, impoverished, crime ridden and have few job opportunities that would attract and retain a young professional demographic. I will not make the assertion that Syracuse is or isn't one of these cities. Since virtually all of my friends and co-workers have flocked to Manhattan, I will also be following suit within the next few months. I am no urban pioneer and while I respect the significant risk that these individuals make in regards to personal safety and financial commitment, I will be residing in an established, desirable, low crime neighborhood in Manhattan (most likely the Upper East Side, Murray Hill, Gramercy Park, or Sutton Place). If I was in the unfortunate financial position that limited my housing options to lower income and/or gentrifying neighborhoods, I would remain in the suburbs. Along those lines, if I were relocating to a smaller, more economically depressed city that offered some dynamic urban neighborhoods yet many of these nabes were surrounded by a sea of slums, I would opt for a suburb.

[kmbell]

Well put, Justflow. I am one of those people that has returned to Syracuse after life elsewhere. For me, it's grad school for the next few years. I enjoy city life, but I also like tranquility when I can find it. Syracuse has both, and if you enjoy the diversity and liveliness of a more "mixed" student, professional, and family neighborhood, you can find it here.

The suburbs are nice as well, but they're not my bag. I like the mobility of living within city limits, and the proximity of home, work, and play. I was raised there and loved it enough to come back.

[justflow1983]

I tried hard to not be too much of a city snob even though I know I cam across that way. I won't lie and say I'm not, suburbia just has no attraction for me, I grew up there and know that its nice but it feels numb to me when I go back to it (personal opinion only!!). I do fully understand what is nice about it, and unfortunately I've so disconnected to that lifestyle I couldn't describe it well. I was just trying to illustrate that I have come to realize why there's so much support for Syracuse's suburbs.

I re-read my post and it comes across as even more negative about suburbs simply because I was trying so hard to avoid being that way. I also specifically do not think people in suburbs are uneducated. Sorry sorry for being the offensively urban guy.

I was also kind of trying to sidestep calling Syracuse "blighted, blue collar, etc" because it is that in a lot of ways. It won't ever appeal to those who flock to manhattan for the city lights unless it undergoes some miraculous transformation. It does however, have something for other types of city-ish people, and theres truth to it. I was trying to sort out that people who like Syracuse are those who enjoy its suburban paradise, or are those who love the quirky charm of neighborhoods that sustain themselves in run-down places (like East Berlin, its great cause it kind of lost in time). Anyone in between would most likely not enjoy themselves there, and the point I was making is that people who find Syracuse to be miserable are probably the people who are neither "suburban minded" (as in enjoying the burb lifestyle) nor able to be charmed by places like Strathmore.

[RollsRoyce]

Originally Posted by justflow1983

I tried hard to not be too much of a city snob even though I know I cam across that way. I won't lie and say I'm not, suburbia just has no attraction for me, I grew up there and know that its nice but it feels numb to me when I go back to it (personal opinion only!!). I do fully understand what is nice about it, and unfortunately I've so disconnected to that lifestyle I couldn't describe it well. I was just trying to illustrate that I have come to realize why there's so much support for Syracuse's suburbs.

I re-read my post and it comes across as even more negative about suburbs simply because I was trying so hard to avoid being that way. I also specifically do not think people in suburbs are uneducated. Sorry sorry for being the offensively urban guy.

I was also kind of trying to sidestep calling Syracuse "blighted, blue collar, etc" because it is that in a lot of ways. It won't ever appeal to those who flock to manhattan for the city lights unless it undergoes some miraculous transformation. It does however, have something for other types of city-ish people, and theres truth to it. I was trying to sort out that people who like Syracuse are those who enjoy its suburban paradise, or are those who love the quirky charm of neighborhoods that sustain themselves in run-down places (like East Berlin, its great cause it kind of lost in time). Anyone in between would most likely not enjoy themselves there, and the point I was making is that people who find Syracuse to be miserable are probably the people who are neither "suburban minded" (as in enjoying the burb lifestyle) nor able to be charmed by places like Strathmore.

No offense taken. There are many suburbs that I don't like, particuarly some of the northern and western ones. I don't like cheap, cookie cutter homes or Wal-Mart either. I am one of the middle of the road people that enjoy city living as long as its in a vibrant, desirable area with young professionals. If I were to move back to Syracuse, it would be a toss up between Franklin Square, Armory Square and Fayetteville (strange combination, I know!). Strathmore has some amazing architecture and what appears to be a cohesive group of neighbors. What disturbs me is the proliferation of lower income housing, crime, and blight in the surrounding area. Many of the larger homes in the outlying areas were carved up into apartments that are now mostly owned by out-of-town investors that rent to unsavory individuals. I wish Syracuse could be gentrified so it could attract urban professionals like Providence, Portland, and Austin. This city has tremendous potential, however its moribund economy and the outflow of middle to high income families has stymied revitalization efforts. Hopefully this will change someday. I am rooting for the City of Syracuse!!!!!!!!!

[justflow1983]

All of those kinds of cities gentrified because there was some sort of attraction due to a unique lifestyle or amenity. Whether it be food, art,music, or just a sense of coolness. I don't know how those things kickstart, but it takes a while for it to turn into gentrification. Syracuse needs to find a way to make itself unique enough to start the process.

Check out Brooklyn right now, it still looks like crap but its a real center of creative and cultural activity. There are still rough neighborhoods mixed in, but its such a "place to be" that young people flock there. Gentrification has finally started and its cleaning up fast. Soon, the type of people that got it going will find somewhere else to be cool and different, and the process will start again.

[RollsRoyce]

There is no question that Brooklyn has some momentum going for it, particuarly in areas like Williamsburg, Carroll Gardens, and most recently Bushwick in addition to already established neighborhoods like Park Slope, Brooklyn Heights, and Prospect Park. That being said, I would never live there. It still has that gritty look which I know attracts a lot of urban pioneers and creative types like artists, aspiring actor/actresses, and those in multimedia production related occupations. As someone in the business world who is more conventional, places like Brooklyn don't impress me. I have nothing against creative types and believe Syracuse would be well served to embrace the creative class.

The faltering economy is already putting some of these unfinished spec condo developments on the brink of foreclosure. During the height of the real estate bubble many people who would have preferred living in Manhattan were priced out and were attracted to the comparatively lower housing costs in places in Brooklyn (though Williamsburg is still among the more expensive places in Brooklyn and higher than some parts of Manhattan below 96th street). With rents on the decline, some will undoubtedly move back/ or to Manhattan. I know I would.

Luckily Syracuse didn't have a large construction boom, though if given the right conditions I hope a massive wave of redevelopment occurs someday. The Hotel Syracuse condo/apartment conversion I believe is the only major city project that has been halted midway through construction. Syracuse could definitely use some urban pioneers. In an ideal world the Connective Corridor and the Near West Side Initiative would leverage the city's urban assets with sustainability as the central theme.