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03-18-2009, 02:34 PM
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Since we're apparently being unproductive by being anti-sprawl, lets be productive instead. Everyone list 1 to 5 things that they would like to see happen that would instigate urban growth or make the city more attractive to live in. Ideas should be positive & somewhat specific. No responses to them until a few people have posted so we can postpone the pissing contest. I'll post mine, they are culled from some that I sent to Sean Kirst and he posted on his blog:
1) Public transit is an essential part of reducing the need for parking and improving access to entertainment venues. It also will improve city vitality by reducing parking demand for city residents going between home and work. Areas with large concentrations of bars, galleries, and music venues should be identified for improved transit links with residential neighborhood in the city and adjacent towns and the central business district. Bus signage and stops must be improved. Dedicated North-South and East-West transit routes should be identified on major thoroughfares. These links should be using one of the following high-visibility transit methods, be
open 24 hours/day, and well policed:
– Electric tram
– Electric trolley/streetcar system
– Dedicated busway or Bus Rapid Transit route (see Curitiba, Brazil)
2) In order to provoke a music scene that highlights local talent and attracts acts from other parts of the county, incentives should be given for
local venues to host live acts. I would propose that the current end time for the serving of alcohol (2am) be extended to 3am or 4am for bars and venues on nights that they provide live entertainment.
3) High tech jobs often require a prolonged start-up period of little or no profits. One of the tax-delinquent buildings in the central business district should be repossessed by the city and run as a business incubator. I propose a rental structure for space that is based on a percentage of the business' profits, so that in periods when the business makes no money it pays no rent and that overheads remain at a manageable level even when business begins to make money. This should be done in conjunction with free access to very high-speed broadband.
4) Through public-private partnership, specific zones along the proposed transit links should be slated for new development. The regeneration incentives should also allow for demolition and replacement by a developer-led process that encourages market-oriented strategies. Open, brownfield sites can be sold cheaply in areas with an over-abundance of older housing stock. Without an abundant supply of newer, upmarket housing, the population of the city will continue to shrink in numbers and wealth. Not all Syracuse neighborhoods are historic and some don't need to be retained. One of these proposed redevelopments of new housing stock should be built as a test-site for high end ecological housing. I would propose a development of 40 homes, built to the highest LEED or Passiv-Haus standards, to be sold to area residents at market rate (as per Emerald City motto). These homes should be built along one of the new transit routes.
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03-18-2009, 02:35 PM
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Location: Syracuse
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proulx and justflow, that is exactly what needs to happen and the rest will fall into place. I also want to add that we need to also reinforce that the city of Syracuse still has stable, nice neighborhoods that still has a strong sense of community. That will in turn could attract people back to the city or even to the area. Syracuse's percentage of people in poverty is 31%. That is unacceptable and needs to be addressed. That's why I applaud things like the Near Westside initiative, because it at least is something in which people are making an effort to revitalize that area. In many cases, people in this area don't even try to do something outside of the box like that and I hope such innovative and unique thinking continues in the area.
Quote:
Originally Posted by justflow1983
Since we're apparently being unproductive by being anti-sprawl, lets be productive instead. Everyone list 1 to 5 things that they would like to see happen that would instigate urban growth or make the city more attractive to live in. Ideas should be positive & somewhat specific. No responses to them until a few people have posted so we can postpone the pissing contest. I'll post mine, they are culled from some that I sent to Sean Kirst and he posted on his blog:
1) Public transit is an essential part of reducing the need for parking and improving access to entertainment venues. It also will improve city vitality by reducing parking demand for city residents going between home and work. Areas with large concentrations of bars, galleries, and music venues should be identified for improved transit links with residential neighborhood in the city and adjacent towns and the central business district. Bus signage and stops must be improved. Dedicated North-South and East-West transit routes should be identified on major thoroughfares. These links should be using one of the following high-visibility transit methods, be
open 24 hours/day, and well policed:
– Electric tram
– Electric trolley/streetcar system
– Dedicated busway or Bus Rapid Transit route (see Curitiba, Brazil)
2) In order to provoke a music scene that highlights local talent and attracts acts from other parts of the county, incentives should be given for
local venues to host live acts. I would propose that the current end time for the serving of alcohol (2am) be extended to 3am or 4am for bars and venues on nights that they provide live entertainment.
3) High tech jobs often require a prolonged start-up period of little or no profits. One of the tax-delinquent buildings in the central business district should be repossessed by the city and run as a business incubator. I propose a rental structure for space that is based on a percentage of the business' profits, so that in periods when the business makes no money it pays no rent and that overheads remain at a manageable level even when business begins to make money. This should be done in conjunction with free access to very high-speed broadband.
4) Through public-private partnership, specific zones along the proposed transit links should be slated for new development. The regeneration incentives should also allow for demolition and replacement by a developer-led process that encourages market-oriented strategies. Open, brownfield sites can be sold cheaply in areas with an over-abundance of older housing stock. Without an abundant supply of newer, upmarket housing, the population of the city will continue to shrink in numbers and wealth. Not all Syracuse neighborhoods are historic and some don't need to be retained. One of these proposed redevelopments of new housing stock should be built as a test-site for high end ecological housing. I would propose a development of 40 homes, built to the highest LEED or Passiv-Haus standards, to be sold to area residents at market rate (as per Emerald City motto). These homes should be built along one of the new transit routes.
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Very good ideas! I've also thought about having a heritage museum with an Underground Railroad or cultural theme. For instance, this is an area with not only strong ethnic history from say the Irish, Italians and Polish, but from Native Americans, African Americans and recently Asian and Hispanic groups, among others too.
I would even say not only would I think about using old buildings downtown as a business incubator, but to do that in some of the urban neighborhoods. here's an example of this in the area already: South Side Entrepreneurial Connect Project (SSECP) - Entrepreneurship and Emerging Enterprises (EEE) - Syracuse University
South Side Innovation Center (SSIC) - Entrepreneurship and Emerging Enterprises - An Entrepreneurial Initiative of Syracuse University
This should be expanded to other parts of the city. So, in turn this can help revitalize the business districts in neighborhoods like Eastwood, Elmwood, along Butternut and in Hawley-Green on the Near Northside, the Near Westside, the Westside neighborhood, the Near Eastside and Warren and South Salina Streets in Downtown.
What about using some buildings to be used for other forms of housing, like what's been done Downtown. There are many warehouses on the Westside that aren't used and be used for such.
As for schools, having more options like a school of the arts or bringing back Central Tech to it former self, like they were planning on doing. You can also have a magnet school or system for each quadrant of the city starting right away that focuses on the strengths of the students in those areas and keep students interested early. It wouldn't hurt to start up more charter school options as well. For instance, Sacramento High in California had some of the worst test scores in the state, but when they decided to go to a charter form of schooling, the test scores increased greatly in this very diverse high school.
Precincts would be nice too, instead of just trailors in some parts of the city. This is so the officers and neighborhoods can get to know each other and the trust factor for good community policing can occur.
Last edited by bellafinzi; 03-18-2009 at 05:38 PM..
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03-18-2009, 03:34 PM
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: NYC area
359 posts, read 192,838 times
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Thoughts for Urban Growth
Quote:
Originally Posted by justflow1983
Since we're apparently being unproductive by being anti-sprawl, lets be productive instead. Everyone list 1 to 5 things that they would like to see happen that would instigate urban growth or make the city more attractive to live in. Ideas should be positive & somewhat specific. No responses to them until a few people have posted so we can postpone the pissing contest. I'll post mine, they are culled from some that I sent to Sean Kirst and he posted on his blog:
1) Public transit is an essential part of reducing the need for parking and improving access to entertainment venues. It also will improve city vitality by reducing parking demand for city residents going between home and work. Areas with large concentrations of bars, galleries, and music venues should be identified for improved transit links with residential neighborhood in the city and adjacent towns and the central business district. Bus signage and stops must be improved. Dedicated North-South and East-West transit routes should be identified on major thoroughfares. These links should be using one of the following high-visibility transit methods, be
open 24 hours/day, and well policed:
– Electric tram
– Electric trolley/streetcar system
– Dedicated busway or Bus Rapid Transit route (see Curitiba, Brazil)
2) In order to provoke a music scene that highlights local talent and attracts acts from other parts of the county, incentives should be given for
local venues to host live acts. I would propose that the current end time for the serving of alcohol (2am) be extended to 3am or 4am for bars and venues on nights that they provide live entertainment.
3) High tech jobs often require a prolonged start-up period of little or no profits. One of the tax-delinquent buildings in the central business district should be repossessed by the city and run as a business incubator. I propose a rental structure for space that is based on a percentage of the business' profits, so that in periods when the business makes no money it pays no rent and that overheads remain at a manageable level even when business begins to make money. This should be done in conjunction with free access to very high-speed broadband.
4) Through public-private partnership, specific zones along the proposed transit links should be slated for new development. The regeneration incentives should also allow for demolition and replacement by a developer-led process that encourages market-oriented strategies. Open, brownfield sites can be sold cheaply in areas with an over-abundance of older housing stock. Without an abundant supply of newer, upmarket housing, the population of the city will continue to shrink in numbers and wealth. Not all Syracuse neighborhoods are historic and some don't need to be retained. One of these proposed redevelopments of new housing stock should be built as a test-site for high end ecological housing. I would propose a development of 40 homes, built to the highest LEED or Passiv-Haus standards, to be sold to area residents at market rate (as per Emerald City motto). These homes should be built along one of the new transit routes.
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1.) Light Rail - Restore and expand the OnTrack system that will link into the Amtrak station by the Regional Market. By resuming construction of the Park Street bridge, a full functioning OnTrack would allow someone to catch the train in Jamesville, stop at the SU hill, eat lunch downtown, do shopping at Carousel, see a game at Alliance Bank Stadium, and then board an Amtrak high speed rail train to NYC. As someone who rides a train daily, I believe a fully funded light rail system could make Syracuse more marketable to young professionals used to living in big cities with transportation options. The ability and ease to move from one venue to the other would greatly enhance the city and region's perception among SU students, especially those that lack a car or geographic knowledge of CNY. Improving town and gown relationships will be essential in revsersing the brain drain.
2.) Connective Corridor - If done effectively, this can help bridge the divide between local residents and college students as well as enable downtown businesses to attract a new stream of customers. Developing mixed use buildings along the corridor is essential in addressing the separation of downtown and University Hill. New mixed use development will also add greater density and facilitate linkage between important arts, entertainment, employment, and cultural venues.
3.) High Tech / White Collar Jobs - This area needs to accept that manufacturing and the 1950s smokestack economies that enabled the region to prosper will not be coming back. New York's high utility rates, onerous property taxes, unionization rates, and oppressive regulatory environment cannot sustain new mfg operations. If Syracuse doesn't adapt and embrace its sizable cluster of green tech firms, entice further cultivation of tech companies, and attract some back office data or disaster recovery centers this city will become the next Flint, Toledo, Youngstown, Gary, Camden, Springfield (MA), et al. Central Upstate New York has the third largest concentration of college students, however at this point there are few ENTRY level high paying jobs to keep them here. Public - private partnerships between academia and business will allow for the commercialization of products and new technology. This is already occuring on the SU hill with Skaneateles-based Welch Allyn and its "Blue Highway" subsidiary. Development needs to be expedited on the CNY Biotechnology Research Center and the Spinal Cord Bank. Venture capital must be accessable to locally-based business. Several efforts were made regionally including the development of an angel network, however most venture firms are based in Boston, the Silicon Valley, and NYC. Recently an Ithaca-based startup relocated its headquarters to Boston at the request of its venture capital firm.
4.) Embrace the Arts - I will be the first to admit, I am not into the Arts as perhaps I should be. That being said, I'm in agreement with Richard Florida and his Creative Class movement. From an economic development perspective, the presence of a viable and thriving arts community is essential in retaining and attracting a highly educated population and skilled workforce. Programs like th3 are innovative at the grassroots level and hopefully willl continue their momentum. The Gear Factory would also hold promise in gentrifying Syracuse's long neglected Near West Side, similar to Williamsburg in Brooklyn. The long promised glass facade expansion of the I.M Pei designed Everson Museum of Art needs to occur.
Last edited by RollsRoyce; 03-18-2009 at 04:17 PM..
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03-18-2009, 04:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ckhthankgod
proulx and justflow, that is exactly what needs to happen and the rest will fall into place. I also want to add that we need to also reinforce that the city of Syracuse still has stable, nice neighborhoods that still has a strong sense of community. That will in turn could attract people back to the city or even to the area. Syracuse's percentage of people in poverty is 31%. That is unacceptable and needs to be addressed. That's why I applaud things like the Near Westside initiative, because it at least is something in which people are making an effort to revitalize that area. In many cases, people in this area don't even try to do something outside of the box like that and I hope such innovative and unique thinking continues in the area.
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Just so my position is clear. I'm not against the Near Westside initiative.
Rebuilding the city and building new suburbs are not mutually exclusive. Keep this in mind, every US city with a thriving downtown and central city also sprawls.
And I'm not against poor people. The only way to help people get out of poverty is job growth and population growth in the Syracuse area. The only way to create job growth and population growth is to build "shinny" new skyscrapers and provide attractive new suburbs in order to attract companies and retain highly skilled employees. It may be shallow, but Syracuse is not going to attract jobs unless it's respected by outsiders and most people have a positive perception of it.
Last edited by bellafinzi; 03-24-2009 at 09:12 PM..
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03-18-2009, 04:46 PM
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Remember, if you truly want to help the poor, you need the Syracuse area to grow.
If you want Syracuse to grow, you need Syracuse to be respected and perceived as a nice city.
If you want Syracuse to be perceived as a nice city, you need new construction and beautification.
New construction means..... in downtown, in city neighborhoods and yes, even in the suburbs.
Beautification can be as simple as projects like lining the highways with plants or cleaning up overgrown lots. Or even cleaning up litter.
It might sound shallow to want tall beautiful buildings and new attractive suburbs, but it is the only thing that will convince people that Syracuse is truly a nice place to invest, live and work. Which in the end will create jobs and help the poor.
Get it now?
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03-18-2009, 04:55 PM
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Well in terms of skyscrapers, its expensive. I'm working on a 4-storey apartment block right now, 37 units. We had to struggle to keep it under €8 million. Its not that have a problem with them, hell I'd love to design one, but its just a massive undertaking to do without steady tenants.
It is a real double edged sword, but if you look at cities that tried to build a city readymade, and then wait for the occupants to come, they tend to fail. Look at Dubai, its collapsing as we speak. On the other hand, cities that a grown organically tend to get booms going and a lot happens. Syracuse is better off encouraging an up-and-coming culture through infrastructure, job, and cultural investments. Places like Brooklyn, Seattle, etc are first settled by urban pioneers who see a place as a hidden opportunity. If you kick start a settlement movement, in a few years you get a lot of followers who want to be where the "cool kids" play. Get some wierd unusual industry going, instigate a music or art movement, find some hidden resource and exploit it; make it so that its easy for people to live that lifestyle, and 5-10 years later you have Brooklyn or Portland. The "cool" places to be usually start out as rough and grimy and clean up as they fill up.
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03-18-2009, 04:56 PM
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I agree
Quote:
Originally Posted by bellafinzi
Remember, if you truly want to help the poor, you need the Syracuse area to grow.
If you want Syracuse to grow, you need Syracuse to be respected and perceived as a nice city.
If you want Syracuse to be perceived as a nice city, you need new construction and beautification.
New construction means..... in downtown, in city neighborhoods and yes, even in the suburbs.
Beautification can be as simple as projects like lining the highways with plants or cleaning up overgrown lots. Or even cleaning up litter.
It might sound shallow to want tall beautiful buildings and new attractive suburbs, but it is the only thing that will convince people that Syracuse is truly a nice place to invest, live and work. Which in the end will create jobs and help the poor.
Get it now?
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I definitely agree, especially on the beautification part. The appearance of graffiti and trash along the highways is gives a lousy impression. |
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03-18-2009, 04:57 PM
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Location: Syracuse
6,257 posts, read 3,389,663 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bellafinzi
Just so my position is clear. I'm not against the Near Westside initiative.
Rebuilding the city and building new suburbs are not mutually exclusive. Keep this in mind, every US city with a thriving downtown and central city also sprawls.
And I'm not against poor people. The only way to help people get out of poverty is job growth and population growth in the Syracuse area. The only way to create job growth and population growth is to build "shinny" new skyscrapers and provide attractive new suburbs in order to attract companies and retain highly skilled employees. It may be shallow, but Syracuse is not going to attract jobs unless it's respected by outsiders and most people have a positive perception of it.
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Actually, I was talking about something else. People know what you are talking about and you'll be surprised about how many people actually see Syracuse in a positive way too.
As much as having new shiny buildings would be nice, to create jobs, the people of that community need to be innovative and think outside of the box. There's actually construction going up within the city with new hotels going up and the Center of Excellence going up in the old Midtown Plaza location. There are also some other plans in the works like O'Brien and Gere moving into the city across from Armory Square and building a new building there. Hopefully, that will come to fruition. There has been some construction on the SU campus too with Newhouse 3, the Carmelo Anthony Center and the expansion of the SciTech building, among other things that the University is getting involved in. Can't forget the Golisano Children's Hospital too.
New Armory Square Project | WTVH-TV CBS 5 Syracuse, NY | Local News
Syracuse Center of Excellence - Syracuse Center of Excellence
Pediatric Services:Pediatric Services:University Hopsital
Syracuse University Athletics - Anthony Visits with Orange, Breaks Ground for Carmelo K. Anthony Basketball Center
Newhouse III
O'Brien & Gere sells DeWitt building, path clear for Armory Square move
Last edited by bellafinzi; 03-24-2009 at 09:14 PM..
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03-18-2009, 04:58 PM
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The Center of Excellence is a great one. Its a Toshiko Mori project, not one of her best but it should be a real architectural show piece that the city hasn't had since the Everson was built.
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03-18-2009, 05:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by justflow1983
The Center of Excellence is a great one. Its a Toshiko Mori project, not one of her best but it should be a real architectural show piece that the city hasn't had since the Everson was built.
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It's nice IMO. Just wish it was a little taller.
Newhouse III is probably the only building constructed in Syracuse in the last 20 years I am impressed with.... |
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