Onondaga Creek Communities and the Amos @ City Harbor...... (Syracuse, Franklin Square: apartments, rentals)

[ckhthankgod]

I found this site that has these two ideas as possibilities for the area. Inteeresting...Just click on the 3rd and 5th X along the projects line: munly brown studio | architecture and design

[RollsRoyce]

Originally Posted by ckhthankgod

I found this site that has these two ideas as possibilities for the area. Inteeresting...Just click on the 3rd and 5th X along the projects line: munly brown studio | architecture and design

I've seen this as well. Unfortunately Queri, the original developer who engaged this architect has sold the project to Cosimo Zavaglia, one of the largest landlords in Syracuse who owns many lower priced rentals. Earlier articles in the paper stated Queri was unable to secure financing for the project. Instead of more upscale residences, Zavaglia plans to convert the building into 80 to 90 smaller apartments with rents more in line with Franklin Square. Definitely a big let down. Zavaglia's other properties including several rehabs in Little Italy and in Clinton Square are okay, but nothing special in terms of furnishings and appointments. At least the building is being rehabbed, but definitely not impressive as initially proposed.

[phaelon56]

Not that Franklin Square is cheap by Syracuse standards. If I recall correctly the 1 BR units in the OM Edwards building are about $110o to $1200 per month - correct? That makes them appealing to many 20 something and some 30 something professionals but 2 BR units and condos that are more in the Plum Court price range and less in the Mi$$ion Landing price would IMHO be a better choice.

I'm curious about how well the new apartment units are renting out on North Salina in the building that used to be St. Vincent de Paul thrift store. It's near Catawba and Assumption Church. When I see a neighborhood that has an increase in pawn shops, "rent to own" furniture stores, cheap cell phone shops, tattoo parlors and independently owned hip-hop clothing stores... it's a red flag for a trend for falling commercial rents and reverse gentrification. If there was still a middle class residential area to serveas a buffer between the North Salina business corridor and the economically depressed/struggling areas of the north side then I'd see greater potential in the Little Italy redevelopment.

As it stands I'd be hesitant to invest in a building there despite the improvements. That is unfortunate. I hope the steps St. Joe's and others are taking along Catherine Street and Townsend are just the beginning of a long term improvement initiative for that entire area.

[RollsRoyce]

Originally Posted by phaelon56

Not that Franklin Square is cheap by Syracuse standards. If I recall correctly the 1 BR units in the OM Edwards building are about $110o to $1200 per month - correct? That makes them appealing to many 20 something and some 30 something professionals but 2 BR units and condos that are more in the Plum Court price range and less in the Mi$$ion Landing price would IMHO be a better choice.

I'm curious about how well the new apartment units are renting out on North Salina in the building that used to be St. Vincent de Paul thrift store. It's near Catawba and Assumption Church. When I see a neighborhood that has an increase in pawn shops, "rent to own" furniture stores, cheap cell phone shops, tattoo parlors and independently owned hip-hop clothing stores... it's a red flag for a trend for falling commercial rents and reverse gentrification. If there was still a middle class residential area to serveas a buffer between the North Salina business corridor and the economically depressed/struggling areas of the north side then I'd see greater potential in the Little Italy redevelopment.

As it stands I'd be hesitant to invest in a building there despite the improvements. That is unfortunate. I hope the steps St. Joe's and others are taking along Catherine Street and Townsend are just the beginning of a long term improvement initiative for that entire area.

Those price points for Franklin Square are correct but are much cheaper than the Amos at City Harbor units were projected to rent for. I agree the rents in Franklin Square are upscale for this area and are of excellent quality. When the project was first proposed some units, however were slated to be as large as 3,000 square feet and rent in upwards of $1 per square foot ($3,000 per mo rentals). This may have been too ambitious and therefore explains why the project couldn't obtain financing (in a good economy). I agree with your sentiments on North Salina Street it seems that area is getting worse even though there has been some redevelopment. The pawn shops, rental centers and ghetto clothing stores signal this area is probably too far gone and now devoid of any middle class. It's a shame. Although St. Joseph's planned redevelopment of the area is commendable, if I'm not mistaken all of the housing will be subsidized in some form. This will do nothing to gentrify or diversify an already impovershed neighborhood. Let's hope I'm wrong!

[phaelon56]

Indeed - much as I do tend to agree with you on so many issues of local importance I really hope you're wrong on this one!

$3,000 per month? Ouch. That won't fly in this area for the people who can afford it and need that much space.

The folks ion this area who want or believe they need that much space (or maybe actually do) are typically either well heeled enough to live at Mission Landing (and quite likely have a second home elsewhere also) or they'll be in places like Mallards Landing and other upscale cluster home developments.

Like it or not - the vast majority local folks who are looking for that kind of square footage and can afford it will have many options and there aren't enough of them - at present - to make certain types of urban development viable. My monthly nut at present for 3 BR / 1.5 BTH and 1725 square feet - in total PITI is about $1300 with utilities. I could be quite content with 2 BR / 2 BTH and 1100 or so well designed square feet but ONLY if the total monthly outlay was about the same or less. I think a smart developer with the right development tax breaks and incentives such as energy efficiency grants etc. should be able to to pull off a development that meets such criteria.

Or have building costs risen to the point where I am just being naive?

Then again.... at this point I'm dis-inclined to rent. If purchase of the unit was not an option I'd be hesitant. But I'm probably one of many, many people my age in this area who has more house than they need to but couldn't find anything meeting our criteria in small houses or condos.