Pinellas Light Rail event tonight...have your say (Tampa, Orlando: how much, neighborhoods)

[Maggi07]

The bus system as it stands now is not user friendly. I have no idea how people use it at all, to tell you the truth.

My dh's car was in the shop for a couple days, and since it's a 45 minute drive one way for him to get to work, I thought he could just take the bus. Nope. It would have taken him 3 hours each way!

The city I lived in before tried to vastly improve the busing system, and it was an utter failure. They never enticed more people to ride and it was just a money drain. That city also fought against a light rail system, and I have no idea why. I really believe it would have been a wonderful thing.

I would like to see it here. First of all because I saw the failure of the effort to improve the bus system, and I think that would happen here as well. Second, because I think it would draw business to the area, which is always a good thing, and especially in a recession.

[kyle19125]

The problem with light rail is it's designed to operate efficiently between two points and financially relies on many people travelling between the two points. The chief problem with this area is that it wasn't built that way. There may be centers of employment but the residential sprawl would make it far too costly to operate. Having one light rail line (or two) will only hit a fraction of the population/commuters. Express Buses and Fixed Route Buses (BRT) are more economical and can be far more comprehensive than light rail could ever allow logistically or financially. In terms of demographics that's a weak argument, and can one assume "undesirable types" won't use light rail? The scales will tip only when transit routes are quick/efficient...i.e. express buses, park and ride, etc.

[xbillyx]

Originally Posted by Sunny-Days90

Rail would NOT be cost effective in this area at all.

Check out the cost of the rail and the cost to even ride it.

Then if you miss the rail you would be in deep trouble.

There are only a few cities that across America that could even use it with most of them being a total waste of money and not a good idea.

I do not believe this area needs a rail system at this point in time.

Not cost effective for both the city/state and the people.

Because everyone driving is working so well there? The fact that areas rely so heavily on automobiles has shaped our landscape (for the worse). The areas with the best public transit are built (or rebuilt) wisely.

[DarkWolf]

Originally Posted by Sunny-Days90

Rail would NOT be cost effective in this area at all.

Check out the cost of the rail and the cost to even ride it.

Then if you miss the rail you would be in deep trouble.

There are only a few cities that across America that could even use it with most of them being a total waste of money and not a good idea.

I do not believe this area needs a rail system at this point in time.

Not cost effective for both the city/state and the people.

LOL what now? The whole Northeastern US is restoring its Railway network , with no problems .... sprawly suburbs , Rural areas , and Urban metropolis's are all getting joined together by 5,000+ miles of Railway (By 2050) if they can do it in this region then it can work anywhere. Regional Rail and other Fixed Rail Transit systems spur developments and are used by more people then buses. The Stigma attached to any format of bus hurts ridership and the fact there not fixed systems even for BRT turns off Developers.

[Pragmaticus]

Originally Posted by craigm1841

i would take buses if the bus rider demographic changes. People riding the bus now appear to be (and i know i am going to get beat up by you all for this) overweight, unhappy, and poor. Dont believe me, just look at any bus stop in H or P County.

.

Didn't know that you could tell people are unhappy by just looking at them in a bus stop.

These kind of people are part of the population, they aren't going anywhere because you demanded.

But the larger problem is not having these people ride with me, rather the system is inefficient and not cost effective to attract people like you

[xbillyx]

Originally Posted by kyle19125

The problem with light rail is it's designed to operate efficiently between two points and financially relies on many people travelling between the two points. The chief problem with this area is that it wasn't built that way. There may be centers of employment but the residential sprawl would make it far too costly to operate. Having one light rail line (or two) will only hit a fraction of the population/commuters. Express Buses and Fixed Route Buses (BRT) are more economical and can be far more comprehensive than light rail could ever allow logistically or financially. In terms of demographics that's a weak argument, and can one assume "undesirable types" won't use light rail? The scales will tip only when transit routes are quick/efficient...i.e. express buses, park and ride, etc.

Some intelligent planning would lead to stations being built around large hubs of people. The areas immediately surrounding those areas would then become more urbanized (more walkable, smart dense growth, etc.). Those who choose to live out in the far suburbs/exurbs will have to deal with traffic still but others would be able to utilize the stations. That's kind of the way it goes though. If you want to live farther out, you deal with more traffic.

[craigm1841]

Originally Posted by MeInDenudinFL

Didn't know that you could tell people are unhappy by just looking at them in a bus stop.

These kind of people are part of the population, they aren't going anywhere because you demanded.

But the larger problem is not having these people ride with me, rather the system is inefficient and not cost effective to attract people like you

you cant tell that someone is unhappy by looking at them? Really? You really cant tell by someones facial expressions and body language how they feel? I am glad I am not lacking those social skills. My dog can tell when someone is unhappy or happy... You really cant?

Cost is not an issue for me. Id pay three times the price of a ticket if we didnt have to stop every quarter mile and pick up the bottom feeders of society- That is why specific lines like I mentioned would make a lot of sense.

[ferret111]

Originally Posted by craigm1841

Cost is not an issue for me. Id pay three times the price of a ticket if we didnt have to stop every quarter mile and pick up the bottom feeders of society- That is why specific lines like I mentioned would make a lot of sense.

Sounds pretty elitist. These bottom feeders are the minimum-wage workers that we need to do jobs that we don't want to do. They need to get to work as well.

[BBI]

Intra-county mass transit would be a mistake. There are hundreds of homes on the market in already existing population/business centers. The county's top priority should be rescuing, rebuilding and gentrifying existing population/business centers, not enabling or building new ones through mass transit. If you want a better commute, the answer is easy: move near work. If you don't want to live near work for whatever reason, that's fine. But the right long-term plan for the county is to make 'near work' a place you want to live, not to encourage you to live farther away.

As a P resident, I'd seriously consider supporting light rail between downtown St. Pete and downtown Tampa, because I think that would cause a net gain of working people for P. I don't see why H would support that, though.

[Pragmaticus]

Originally Posted by craigm1841

you cant tell that someone is unhappy by looking at them? Really? You really cant tell by someones facial expressions and body language how they feel? I am glad I am not lacking those social skills. My dog can tell when someone is unhappy or happy... You really cant?

Cost is not an issue for me. Id pay three times the price of a ticket if we didnt have to stop every quarter mile and pick up the bottom feeders of society- That is why specific lines like I mentioned would make a lot of sense.

You missing the point. Cost effectiveness is measured as comparison to what it would cost you to run your own car. If you spend more money operating your car than riding a mass transport, you would, at least, most people would consider mass transit (apart from environmental benefits). Having able to pay three times the ticket is not the point, whatever that means.

Now to my second point. Even if it is cheaper to get where I want to be, I don't want to be on bus for hours as opposed to minutes by my car. Above somebody mentioned that a 45minute car end up being taking 3 hours or so. That's not efficient for me to take the bus. Or you could say my time is money also.

That's why I said cost effectiveness as well as efficiency will bring more people.

BTW, I like your dog's skill