Pinellas Light Rail event tonight...have your say (Miami, Tampa: apartment, renting)

[FloridaKash]

Originally Posted by xbillyx

It truly is a shame what the automobile industry did to America, isn't it? Sometimes, I think about how nice it would be to have most everywhere be walkable, friendly, open communities. Instead, we're all separated from each other by glass windows, roads, and highways.

If only we were still in the days where each family only had 1 car instead of every licensed driver having one. People would have to plan their trips more effectively, mass transit and walkable cities would be much more popular yet we would still have the freedom to travel the open road.

[ferret111]

Originally Posted by gypsychic

Tampa had a WONDERFUL electric streetcar system, I think maybe even went to St. Pete. It was all demolished in the 40s or 50s when cars were becoming so popular.

Tampa's system went all over what constituted the city limits at the time. It went all over Tampa Heights, Seminole Heights, and Ybor City, with routes going up to Sulphur Springs, West Tampa, Palmetto Beach, Jackson Heights, Ballast Point, and Hyde Park. It was replaced by buses in 1949. I'd imagine some of the tracks are still under the asphalt.


Tampa's Street Car System 1940's map (http://www.flickr.com/photos/js_design/3493703777/ - broken link) by JSDesign (http://www.flickr.com/people/js_design/ - broken link), on Flickr

St. Pete's system had many east-west routes from Downtown to the old country club, now Admiral Farragut. You could go down to Bayboro and Gulfport or up to Old Northeast. There was even a spur to Pass-a-Grille in the works at one point, but it never came around. I think the St. Pete system was replaced by buses a few years before Tampa's.

[kyle19125]

Originally Posted by xbillyx

That's really a shame and a huge bummer. It's too bad Florida wasn't built a little more strategically. It appears to me that developers just went hog wild and were given the freedom to do so. It's a shame because there the weather is conducive to being outdoors, yet people are spending all this time behind the wheel.

That's exactly why I'm spending a lot of time and effort finding the very few areas that are somewhat walkable. I wouldn't want to get stuck somewhere that I'd need a car every time I left my house.

Remember a previous thread about where you looking for an "Arlington lifestyle" in Florida? It doesn't exist.

Which is why a Light Rail system for people won't work here. Multi-modal transportation (walk to light rail, bike to light rail, bus to light rail) is not something a vast majority of the residents of this area would utilize or support.

An overwhelming majority of those that have relocated here, and those that have grown up here are not mass transit users/supporters. Otherwise, a system would have been in place long ago.

The only real hope for getting people out of their cars and reducing congestion is through Express Buses, BRT and HOV/Carpool lanes.

All of the blah-blah that Light Rail planning entails will take 20-30 years before the first line opens. The Tampa Bay area needs immediate planning/action for a mass transit system appropriate for this area, not decades more of hand-wringing, studies and hearings for a system that doesn't solve any problems through lack of use.

[gypsychic]

Originally Posted by kyle19125

Remember a previous thread about where you looking for an "Arlington lifestyle" in Florida? It doesn't exist.

Which is why a Light Rail system for people won't work here. Multi-modal transportation (walk to light rail, bike to light rail, bus to light rail) is not something a vast majority of the residents of this area would utilize or support.

An overwhelming majority of those that have relocated here, and those that have grown up here are not mass transit users/supporters. Otherwise, a system would have been in place long ago.

The only real hope for getting people out of their cars and reducing congestion is through Express Buses, BRT and HOV/Carpool lanes.

All of the blah-blah that Light Rail planning entails will take 20-30 years before the first line opens. The Tampa Bay area needs immediate planning/action for a mass transit system appropriate for this area, not decades more of hand-wringing, studies and hearings for a system that doesn't solve any problems through lack of use.

Exactly, Kyle. That's why, as much as I love the IDEA of light rail in the area, I think the answer is just to make the buses more user friendly - more express buses, better/faster routes etc. with more trolleys and shuttles to attractions, etc. And MARKET IT! Get people to start riding it more. I'd like to see something in my lifetime. By the time they got around to light rail, that will be outdated (and I'll be six feet under) and there will be some other means of transit. People once thought horses were forever, then cars - it's time for something else but let's at least start with the ding-dang buses!

[DarkWolf]

Originally Posted by Sunny-Days90

Like I said it will work in certain areas but in most areas that it is proposed is not cost effective and will hurt the state.

Ex: Columbus, Cleveland, Cincinnati - A total waste of money. Billions of dollars spent and most people wont use it for various reasons.

You are assuming it will work everywhere, it wont.

This area in Pinellas I do not believe it will work either. The layout is already a mess and adding rail will only make things worse. Remember most people have to drive a car to the rail, leave the car and then have to deal with time restraints.

I never said I was for buses either. I would not ride a bus myself unless it was a last second decision if I could not find a cab or some other way.

Well if there restoring Rural Corridors here , theres no reason it can't work down there?

[Angler]

Originally Posted by FloridaKash

the airprt).

Last but not least, I do not think the citizens of Tampa Bay are willing to pay the taxes to have a sufficient and expansive light rail to relieve traffic since the traffic is really not too bad here.
.

You're joking, right? Tampa had the worst commute in the nation , per Forbes study, earlier this year. I know it to be true, because I sit in it every single day.

And during the transportation tax talk, the Chamber of Commerce did a poll of all the business members in Tampa, and the number one reason that businesses are not expanding or considering leaving the area is lack of mass transit and commute times.

The fact is, without a mass transit plan (whatever that may be- buses, rail, etc) companies will not relocate here and the ones here will either leave or not expand. Keeping your human capital in traffic for up to 3 hours a day is not practical.

[craigm1841]

Originally Posted by Angler

You're joking, right? Tampa had the worst commute in the nation , per Forbes study, earlier this year.

You are joking, right?

Please provide a link to that article. We are waiting....

And dont say you cant find it. Every Forbes article from the past 8 years is online.

Have you ever commuted in NY, DC, or Atlanta??? You, my friend, clearly have not, and therefore have absolutely NO CLUE what you are talking about.

My guess is we wont be seeing that article, or a response to this post from you any time soon.

[kyle19125]

Actually he was kind of right. We're not the worst in terms of travel time (as we knew) but overall when factoring in alternatives to driving...

Best And Worst Cities For Commuters - Forbes.com

[BBI]

Originally Posted by xbillyx

I agree that "near work" should be an area people want to live; however, a rail system to take people around the cities and suburbs outside the cities is essential. It works wonderfully in the DC area. Hundreds of thousands of people use it daily.

It is impossible for everyone to live walking/biking distance to work; therefore, we need eco-friendly transit options. Rail is far superior to bus, though short and direct bus trips to the rail station would compliment the service.

Three big issues with this post. First, why compare Pinellas county to metro DC? The two are very dissimilar. That a mass transit system is essential in DC does not make it essential in Pinellas. Second, it is unreasonable for any county planner to make it a goal that its population "live walking/biking distance to work." Maybe we just have a different political point of view, and that's fine, but, if you think that's a reasonable goal, you're in a very small political minority in Pinellas. Third, right now in Pinellas it is possible for anyone who wants to live within a 5 minute commute to work to do so. Surf over to zillow and do a search near your office. Maybe living near your office isn't an attractive option for you -- it's not for me. And that is the problem Pinellas needs to fix.

[craigm1841]

Originally Posted by kyle19125

Actually he was kind of right. We're not the worst in terms of travel time (as we knew) but overall when factoring in alternatives to driving...

Best And Worst Cities For Commuters - Forbes.com

alright. we are the worst of the 60 largest metro areas polled (when combining the three scores, but not the worst in any one category), but clearly his reference was to travel delay. I am basing that on his "I sit in it every morning" reference. Where Tampa placed 41 out of 60.

I can tell you from personal experience that commuting in NY, DC, and Atlanta, are far worse and significantly scarier then commuting in Tampa.

We have horrible public transportation. that is agreed, and I would NEVER argue that. The majority of residents travel via automobile, and that is NOT bad at all, comparitively speaking.

For those of you complaining that Tampa has urban sprawl, and that is the biggest downfall, and how badly tampa is laid out with all the suburbs... Guess what? If you live in a suburb, you are part of the problem.

The biggest problem with urban sprawl are the suburb sissys who trade in their soul for a minivan and move as far away from culture as possible, purpetuating the problem because they increase demand for development of cheap, cookie cutter homes with vinyl siding and a tiny tree in the front yard.