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Old 08-16-2012, 01:38 PM
 
34,374 posts, read 41,463,803 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MAniacTHW View Post
To be completely honest, I'd like to see Tampa build up. It's time it LOOKED like a city. And to all the "families looking for a good place to raise their children" there's a suburb within an hour in any given direction. Build up. Give tax incentives to up and coming businesses (Metro PCS, Verizon FIOS, etc). Put some museums and art galleries downtown. Take a block of downtown and put a good six theaters there. Offer up the best mix of ballet, opera, and plays to bring in that crowd. Have the city put up some walls for legalized graffiti. This will not only bring in the artsy crowd, but it will cut down (wont eliminate, obviously) on illegal graffiti. Put in a HUGE park. Put it along the Hillsborough river. Then, give the city a theme. We can go to our Cuban roots, build in that fashion, and offer something up that, outside of Miami, you wont find anywhere else in the U.S.
Problem with downtown Tampa although it has a nice skyline nobody lives there leaving it a rather cold sterile kinda place outside of office hours or any given venue/event.

 
Old 08-16-2012, 01:49 PM
 
420 posts, read 750,662 times
Reputation: 275
Quote:
Originally Posted by jambo101 View Post
Problem with downtown Tampa although it has a nice skyline nobody lives there leaving it a rather cold sterile kinda place outside of office hours or any given venue/event.
That's exactly what needs to change...
 
Old 08-16-2012, 02:18 PM
 
5,453 posts, read 7,780,161 times
Reputation: 2141
& THAT is precisely why I said earlier that the mayor's office should survey the entire Tampa bay area (because the city of Tampa by itself is not representative of those who live here permanently: think burbs) and find out exactly how many residents are permanent for one, and second what their wants are. Then we can make a correct assessment of what the residents want, and then concentrate on finding ways to BRING IT...we all say: "downtown is dead" but that's because we don't ask the right people what would attract them there...what's a 20 year old to know? they want the bar scene and that's pretty much it!

For example, why should all concerts go to St Pete Forum? and not come to the convention center in downtown Tampa? is it just the acoustics? that can be addressed....The drive to downtown Tampa from Lutz, Carrollwood, Odessa, Northdale, Trinity, Westchase, South Tampa,...etc is shorter than the one to St Pete....if the "burb" people would be allowed to join some entertainment in down town Tampa they'd be there more often cause they won't be spending all their money on gas to go to St Pete etc!!!!! ($3.71? are we having a hurricane? WTH!?)


You cannot make a decision that is affecting millions of people around the bay area by asking 5 people's opinions, and go with that. If you just judge by the main relocation question on this forum "where are the best burbs to raise kids", you must know that there are a lot more families here than retirees! One of the highest rated elementary schools up here has well over 900 students...if they all had two parents that's 1800 ppl in one school...time that to all the elementary schools around Tampa and you'll have a considerable number of ppl looking for some sort of entertainment that are NOT in their early 20's. And that is just elementary schools. So far downtown is empty because it only caters to 2 things: business, and the 20 year old crowd, and everyone else is non existent.



Quote:
Originally Posted by jambo101 View Post
Problem with downtown Tampa although it has a nice skyline nobody lives there leaving it a rather cold sterile kinda place outside of office hours or any given venue/event.
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No Love for the Bay-region-capture-3.png  
 
Old 08-16-2012, 02:50 PM
 
4,823 posts, read 3,479,685 times
Reputation: 2861
Quote:
Originally Posted by algia View Post
& THAT is precisely why I said earlier that the mayor's office should survey the entire Tampa bay area (because the city of Tampa by itself is not representative of those who live here permanently: think burbs) and find out exactly how many residents are permanent for one, and second what their wants are. Then we can make a correct assessment of what the residents want, and then concentrate on finding ways to BRING IT...we all say: "downtown is dead" but that's because we don't ask the right people what would attract them there...what's a 20 year old to know? they want the bar scene and that's pretty much it!

For example, why should all concerts go to St Pete Forum? and not come to the convention center in downtown Tampa? is it just the acoustics? that can be addressed....The drive to downtown Tampa from Lutz, Carrollwood, Odessa, Northdale, Trinity, Westchase, South Tampa,...etc is shorter than the one to St Pete....if the "burb" people would be allowed to join some entertainment in down town Tampa they'd be there more often cause they won't be spending all their money on gas to go to St Pete etc!!!!! ($3.71? are we having a hurricane? WTH!?)


You cannot make a decision that is affecting millions of people around the bay area by asking 5 people's opinions, and go with that. If you just judge by the main relocation question on this forum "where are the best burbs to raise kids", you must know that there are a lot more families here than retirees! One of the highest rated elementary schools up here has well over 900 students...if they all had two parents that's 1800 ppl in one school...time that to all the elementary schools around Tampa and you'll have a considerable number of ppl looking for some sort of entertainment that are NOT in their early 20's. And that is just elementary schools. So far downtown is empty because it only caters to 2 things: business, and the 20 year old crowd, and everyone else is non existent.
I understand Arts and such are partly subsidized by endowment funds, donations and such, but at some point economics plays into this, if whatever play, dance group, performer had a successful/profitable run at the Straz then they will book it more often, if the straz was overbooked and there was demand then an investor will open another venue. The economics of our capitalistic society dictate that if there is demand then supply will follow. It seems to me that there just isn't enough people willing to pay for this sort of thing, its a theory anyway.
 
Old 08-16-2012, 03:09 PM
 
5,453 posts, read 7,780,161 times
Reputation: 2141
Well right now it seems like no one is willing to pay for anything period; considering the "dead" downtown!

I was also referring to some more fancier shops, cafe's etc...if you've been to Las Olas Blvd in Fort Lauderdale you'll know what I am referring too. Non chain entertainment. But I think the Bay area has been sooo overrun with chains that it is really hard to "break" that chain now!


And again, in order to supply something, don't you need to know what to supply it with? there is no demand because the shows are stereotyped to pieces...there is nothing original to wake up interest.

How come Daughtry only went to the forum in St Pete? Where's Beyonce? Metallica? Bon Jovi? "I" and not all about dance! How come they don't come to TAMPA. NOT ST PETE?

Quote:
Originally Posted by DUNNDFRNT View Post
I understand Arts and such are partly subsidized by endowment funds, donations and such, but at some point economics plays into this, if whatever play, dance group, performer had a successful/profitable run at the Straz then they will book it more often, if the straz was overbooked and there was demand then an investor will open another venue. The economics of our capitalistic society dictate that if there is demand then supply will follow. It seems to me that there just isn't enough people willing to pay for this sort of thing, its a theory anyway.
 
Old 08-16-2012, 03:36 PM
 
5,453 posts, read 7,780,161 times
Reputation: 2141
Plus this whole thing with "supply & demand"...I'm not buying it; you know why? because generally this stuff is picked by certain PEOPLE, except that they use their own personal preferences (or popular culture industry standards) in what to pick, and what to promote...This is about promotion, if more promotion would be given to ballet (just using it as an example) more people would be inclined to see it, do it, promote it....if the news wouldn't be so infested with "who killed who in crack town", and some ART would be introduced, explained by qualified people, and promoted, people's minds would open a LOT more! (actually people would have the option/opportunity to have a much more open mind). Not saying that everyone will like everything...art is subjective, but by trying to completely erase it from the entertainment genre is also stupid and unprofessional.

You cannot expect that everyone will like a Van Gogh, but you cannot deny his existence.

Take a school for example...they do school trips...RATHER that ALWAYS go to the Zoo for example, they could go to a ballet/theater play matinee, or a museum; mandatory! because seeing ANY form of ART doesn't HURT anyone. On the contrary, is contributes to a child' overall education, and appreciation. That is how you give them the opportunity to make an educated decision on what they like later...and form a correct opinion about something, and not go: "ohh ballet sucks", but they've never seen one!!!!!!!!!! how can you have an opinion on something if you have no familiarity to it what so ever? Of course you have a society based on football because that is the ONLY thing promoted to pieces at every corner, and everything else has been marginalized. It is not a matter of "supply & demand" at all, it is a matter of BALANCING all kinds of entertainment without favoritism's.

Obviously this is a "celebrity inclined", (more like obsessed) society, and the MEDIA is feeding the masses whatever they(the media) want, not whatever has any cultural/educational VALUE; Of course you're going to have "demand" regarding Jennifer Aniston if she is continuously followed by photographers and that is ALL is published in print or web! Which in reality is pure trash with no value, and an insult to journalism as a whole. What she had for dinner is not a story worthy of INK. And so on...

Media is supposed to be unbiased...
 
Old 08-16-2012, 03:43 PM
 
Location: Places you dream of
20,207 posts, read 12,115,777 times
Reputation: 8769
I read all the posts and those who want to "GROW' were smaked down and actually some wrote folks should leave if they wants something else for Tampa... I have freinds in NY who barely make ends meet yet they save and go to see the arts and talk about big venues- join dance school classes, and go to different community classes at night. I went to more plays with these folks that I ever imagined... Being from S Beach, always ate and participated in another cultures n food etc. futbol, baseball, art galleris in Coral Gables, boat shows, Hollywood Fri nite antique car parades, always something -always- and was NOT over the top expensive. The older crowd will dance your a... off with Salsa, in Miami & NY as well,,, old, middle, young, doesn matter, go to Bayside any weekend and see, In Miami, I had latin freinds from all different countries, Brazilians, Hatians, Jamaicans, Italians, Jewish, and some I dont have a clue. Being invited was weekly event to something... here.. they wont even give you their number to call- its sad. The mentality is NOT there, Not even close-Maybe Tampa is a college town, they all return home and the military also leave and they few that stayed don't want to grow up... I do not know if it's a big retirement community? Maybe? but When the Jewish folks came for winter to S. beach in the 60's it was PARTEEEE. So I do not blame all the old folks- which I am now one. I miss the METROPOLITAN air... sigh.. and with the economy?/
 
Old 08-16-2012, 04:44 PM
 
205 posts, read 248,965 times
Reputation: 176
Haha wow. Tampa's not a party city...nowhere close...it is not teeming with young people either, that's for sure. And I can't really name a good, functional downtown anywhere that doesn't have a bar scene and a sports arena.

Sports and drinking has been what everyone has wanted throughout eons of history, of all ages too. Do you think Rome would be the same size of city without the Coliseum? Or Barcelona without the bullfighting rings?

Besides, if there aren't bars, where would people go after attending a musical or a concert? Improving theater options doesn't help downtown if people are just going to show up at one place for a show and then leave and drive back to the suburbs. People will still complain about how it's a "ghost town" and complain all the same! People anywhere from their 20s-40s visit Nashville's downtown because there are good BBQ restaurants, bars, clubs, and sports/entertainment venues all on one strip of street, in addition to the museums.

Also, without bars, there wouldn't be anywhere for aspiring local musicians to play. Without the foot traffic that bars provide, there wouldn't be street performers in many cities today. I actually hate clubs, and I don't love bars all that much either. I would much rather attend the symphony. But I appreciate the foot traffic and social atmosphere a bar or club provides.

And actually, when you go downtown these days, you can attend a show at the Straz Center, you can catch a film at the historic Tampa Theatre, or you can visit the Tampa Bay History Center, or the Aquarium, or the Art Museum, or Curtis Hixon Park, just off the top of my head. There's only one sports arena that's used only for hockey for 40-some nights out of the year. In addition there are only like four bars and one club open downtown nightly. In a lot of ways, sports/bar/"20-something" options are significantly limited there compared to art/museum/family options. So I don't really know what everyone means when they say Tampa is just catering towards the young people!
 
Old 08-16-2012, 04:48 PM
 
Location: St. Petersburg, FL
114 posts, read 215,564 times
Reputation: 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by algia View Post
& THAT is precisely why I said earlier that the mayor's office should survey the entire Tampa bay area (because the city of Tampa by itself is not representative of those who live here permanently: think burbs) and find out exactly how many residents are permanent for one, and second what their wants are. Then we can make a correct assessment of what the residents want, and then concentrate on finding ways to BRING IT...we all say: "downtown is dead" but that's because we don't ask the right people what would attract them there...what's a 20 year old to know? they want the bar scene and that's pretty much it!

For example, why should all concerts go to St Pete Forum? and not come to the convention center in downtown Tampa? is it just the acoustics? that can be addressed....The drive to downtown Tampa from Lutz, Carrollwood, Odessa, Northdale, Trinity, Westchase, South Tampa,...etc is shorter than the one to St Pete....if the "burb" people would be allowed to join some entertainment in down town Tampa they'd be there more often cause they won't be spending all their money on gas to go to St Pete etc!!!!! ($3.71? are we having a hurricane? WTH!?)


You cannot make a decision that is affecting millions of people around the bay area by asking 5 people's opinions, and go with that. If you just judge by the main relocation question on this forum "where are the best burbs to raise kids", you must know that there are a lot more families here than retirees! One of the highest rated elementary schools up here has well over 900 students...if they all had two parents that's 1800 ppl in one school...time that to all the elementary schools around Tampa and you'll have a considerable number of ppl looking for some sort of entertainment that are NOT in their early 20's. And that is just elementary schools. So far downtown is empty because it only caters to 2 things: business, and the 20 year old crowd, and everyone else is non existent.
You do realize the Tampa Bay Times Forum (formerly St. Pete Times Forum) is actually in downtown Tampa right? Not in St. Pete. And no, the target demographic for economic growth is people in their mid 20s-mid 30s. Young, single, professionals with more disposable income and more potential for entrepreneurship than college kids or parents. And cater to the burbs??? You do realize that Pinellas county is more densely populated than any other county in FL, why cater to those in east Pasco when a bulk of the population lives within 20min of either downtown Tampa (Brandon, Temple Terrace, New Tampa, Oldsmar) or downtown St. Pete (Clearwater, Bradenton, Largo, Seminole, Tarpon Springs).
 
Old 08-16-2012, 05:02 PM
 
Location: St. Petersburg, FL
114 posts, read 215,564 times
Reputation: 181
You cannot expect that everyone will like a Van Gogh, but you cannot deny his existence.

Take a school for example...they do school trips...RATHER that ALWAYS go to the Zoo for example, they could go to a ballet/theater play matinee, or a museum; mandatory! because seeing ANY form of ART doesn't HURT anyone. On the contrary, is contributes to a child' overall education, and appreciation. That is how you give them the opportunity to make an educated decision on what they like later...and form a correct opinion about something, and not go: "ohh ballet sucks", but they've never seen one!!!!!!!!!! how can you have an opinion on something if you have no familiarity to it what so ever? Of course you have a society based on football because that is the ONLY thing promoted to pieces at every corner, and everything else has been marginalized. It is not a matter of "supply & demand" at all, it is a matter of BALANCING all kinds of entertainment without favoritism's.

Obviously this is a "celebrity inclined", (more like obsessed) society, and the MEDIA is feeding the masses whatever they(the media) want, not whatever has any cultural/educational VALUE; Of course you're going to have "demand" regarding Jennifer Aniston if she is continuously followed by photographers and that is ALL is published in print or web! Which in reality is pure trash with no value, and an insult to journalism as a whole. What she had for dinner is not a story worthy of INK. And so on...

Media is supposed to be unbiased...[/quote]

Alright, ballet will NEVER be as popular as football. It's not even because the population is stupid, like you suggest. It's ALL economics. I dated a ballet dancer for two years. Very few parents can afford to pay for the classes, pointe shoes, medical bills, conventions, costumes, etc for ballet. Much like how soccer is now gaining popularity in the US, there needs to be YOUTH interest to develop into adult interest, and honestly its much cheaper to sign your kid up for youth league sports at $80 a year than hundreds-thousands a month for ballet. Accessibility is key too - any kid can pick up a basketball and go to any run down city park and pretend to be Michael Jordan. The same can't be said for ballet.

Last edited by Sunscape; 08-20-2012 at 09:47 AM..
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