Dad finally needs a nursing home (Spring Hill, Homestead: apartment, renters, tenants)

[bobandsherry]

Originally Posted by EngGirl

So, its better to sell the house, spend these money within a year or two on nursing home and then ask for gov. assistance?
The person in question, for a minute, is someone who worked hard all his life and paid taxes too...

Yes, at least you paid what you could, not give it to your family instead. Government assistance is supposed to be there after you have exhausted your available means. Strangely you seem to take it as an entitlement.

Also.... Do you really know that he worked hard and paid taxes to the US? Are you personal friends with the OP and his family? According to the OP, his father is a British citizen so not sure what his dad paid or didn't pay in US taxes.

Originally Posted by jambo101

i doubt Dad would be eligible to immigrate to Canada with his age and medical condition.Dad is still a British citizen who has been a landed immigrant in the USA since 1957.He was a vet but in the British Navy WW2

The term "landed immigrant' really is only a Canadian term, so not sure what his fathers classification was in the US.

I feel for the OP, I hope he finds quality care for this father. He appears to have means (though we really don't know what the value of the home is) to start him with good care and then spend time to get him a good solution for longer term care.

[Spring Hillian]

Originally Posted by dothetwist

So your answer is to turn everyone into a cheat??

I don't like the foreign policy of the US....can I stop paying IRS taxes?? I don't think Pinellas schools are run well and I don't have kids....can I stop paying my real estate taxes??

Stop pretending that a welfare cheat is somehow worse than a family who cheats on paying what they can for nursing home care, whether it's from savings or equity in a house.

Do you think only people who planned in advance by buying long-term care insurance (and by paying those premiums, probably gave up something else in their budget), or saved money their whole lives (rather than peed it away), are the only people who should pay their nursing home bills?? Equity in a house is no different than a bank account, brokerage accounts, 401K's, etc.

Yes the homestead should be protected for the other spouse (and it is), but NOT for greedy grown kids who think they are entitled to an inheritance...THAT's the problem!!

You can complain to the legislators who can change the law to a "no spouse, no break" situation.

The people who dont sell their homes to cover nursing home or other Medicaid services are not cheating the system. They are taking advantage of an opportunity to protect their homestead.

What if someone gets released from a nursing home because their condition no long warrants such care? Do they go live in a homeless shelter until they die?

Would you say that people who take steps to give away their assets 5 years before the Medicaid need arises are cheating the system? It's a concept called estate planning and is used by many a wealthy person to protect that wealth.

[dothetwist]

Originally Posted by Spring Hillian

You can complain to the legislators who can change the law to a "no spouse, no break" situation.

The people who dont sell their homes to cover nursing home or other Medicaid services are not cheating the system. They are taking advantage of an opportunity to protect their homestead.

What if someone gets released from a nursing home because their condition no long warrants such care? Do they go live in a homeless shelter until they die?

Would you say that people who take steps to give away their assets 5 years before the Medicaid need arises are cheating the system? It's a concept called estate planning and is used by many a wealthy person to protect that wealth.

They are not required to sell their home, however, Medicaid can put a lien against the home so that after the last spouse has died, it can be sold and monies recovered for what the government paid the nursing home. Sounds fair to me.

[Spring Hillian]

Originally Posted by dothetwist

They are not required to sell their home, however, Medicaid can put a lien against the home so that after the last spouse has died, it can be sold and monies recovered for what the government paid the nursing home. Sounds fair to me.

The placement of a lien against the homestead differs from state to state. Florida neither requires the sale of the personal residence nor will Florida enforce a lien for Medicaid against the homestead provided the homestead goes to either a spouse, or a relative after the death of the person in the nursing home.

[EngGirl]

Originally Posted by bobandsherry

Yes, at least you paid what you could, not give it to your family instead. Government assistance is supposed to be there after you have exhausted your available means. Strangely you seem to take it as an entitlement.

Also.... Do you really know that he worked hard and paid taxes to the US? Are you personal friends with the OP and his family? According to the OP, his father is a British citizen so not sure what his dad paid or didn't pay in US taxes.

I disagree with your opinion simply because we are talking about primary residence of the elderly person, not $$ in the bank or other assets.
I am not a personal friend with OP, but I am sure his father was a working man, after all he has a house. And in this county hard working people usually find themselves in situations like that when they are not too poor and not rich enough... Hard working middle class people affected more than anybody else. Rest assure his father paid taxes and also US citizen. He spent last 60 years in this county! So he is in title of some assistance.

[dothetwist]

Originally Posted by EngGirl

I disagree with your opinion simply because we are talking about primary residence of the elderly person, not $$ in the bank or other assets.
I am not a personal friend with OP, but I am sure his father was a working man, after all he has a house. And in this county hard working people usually find themselves in situations like that when they are not too poor and not rich enough... Hard working middle class people affected more than anybody else. Rest assure his father paid taxes and also US citizen. He spent last 60 years in this county! So he is in title of some assistance.

What if he didn't own a house....instead, he lived frugally and managed to save $500,000 over the years and it's in the bank. Do you think he should pay his nursing home bills out of his savings?

[jambo101]

Originally Posted by bobandsherry

Also.... Do you really know that he worked hard and paid taxes to the US? Are you personal friends with the OP and his family? According to the OP, his father is a British citizen so not sure what his dad paid or didn't pay in US taxes.



The term "landed immigrant' really is only a Canadian term, so not sure what his fathers classification was in the US.

I feel for the OP, I hope he finds quality care for this father. He appears to have means (though we really don't know what the value of the home is) to start him with good care and then spend time to get him a good solution for longer term care.

To fill in, Mom and Dad immigrated to Florida in 1957 and both remained green card carrying legal residents ever since (Mom passed last year) , he never saw the need to go through the paperwork required to become an American citizen. there was never a time Dad wasnt working throughout that time. he retired at 65 and has had government healthcare since then, he is an honest man who has no problems paying his bills but is finding the potential cost of nursing home care to be overwhelming and is wondering what was the point of saving money in life if in the end the nursing home gets it all in $8000 per month increments.
I'm just trying to find a way to tactfully tell him that everything he's worked for in life will now be going to the nursing home and not to the kids,not that we need it but parents like to leave something to their kids.

[bobandsherry]

Originally Posted by jambo101

To fill in, Mom and Dad immigrated to Florida in 1957 and both remained green card carrying legal residents ever since (Mom passed last year) , he never saw the need to go through the paperwork required to become an American citizen. there was never a time Dad wasnt working throughout that time. he retired at 65 and has had government healthcare since then, he is an honest man who has no problems paying his bills but is finding the potential cost of nursing home care to be overwhelming and is wondering what was the point of saving money in life if in the end the nursing home gets it all in $8000 per month increments.
I'm just trying to find a way to tactfully tell him that everything he's worked for in life will now be going to the nursing home and not to the kids,not that we need it but parents like to leave something to their kids.

Thanks OP. My parents are up there in age so I can appreciate the whole "leaving something for their kids". However they've done their job raising us. I've told them they should plan to spend everything they've earned and saved on THEMSELVES (right now on decent housing, travel and otherwise enjoying life) and not be concerned with leaving me and my brother and sisters with anything. I'd rather them to enjoy their twilight years.

Specific to you father, I understand the thought of paying $8K a month for nursing home is unsettling to your father. But honestly, your father worked hard and saved responsibly so he could ensure he had the means to pay for the costs in his life which previously has been to support his family (housing, food, clothing, education and health care). He's therefore already "left something for the kids", nothing more is due or should be expected. Having the resources to pay for good quality nursing care should be viewed as just another cost of his life.

Good luck on your resolution on this matter.

[dothetwist]

My MIL had a severe stroke and was in a nursing home for 2+ years. Cost was apprx. $250K, out of pocket.

My FIL lived to 91; the last few years we arranged for in-home care for him so he could stay in his home; cost was apprx. 30K for 2+ years. He ended up in a nursing home for his last 4 months...cost of 35K.

Care costs money. Yes, it comes out of 'what they wanted to leave their kids,' but that's life. You don't always get what you want; it isn't always fair.

But when you read the posts of those who don't think they (the grown kids) should suffer financially (not get an inheritance), it really is more about their greed than anything else. The parents we are talking about are from the Greatest Generation; they pay their bills and are not the ones in the family against having to pay for their health care...it is their selfish kids, mostly from a Me Generation.

When my FIL saw his savings dwindle while paying for his wife's nursing home bills (to the tune of $250K), he never ever talked about the financial aspect of this family tragedy. Not like the cry babies posting in this thread.

[Spring Hillian]

Originally Posted by dothetwist

My MIL had a severe stroke and was in a nursing home for 2+ years. Cost was apprx. $250K, out of pocket.

My FIL lived to 91; the last few years we arranged for in-home care for him so he could stay in his home; cost was apprx. 30K for 2+ years. He ended up in a nursing home for his last 4 months...cost of 35K.

Care costs money. Yes, it comes out of 'what they wanted to leave their kids,' but that's life. You don't always get what you want; it isn't always fair.

But when you read the posts of those who don't think they (the grown kids) should suffer financially (not get an inheritance), it really is more about their greed than anything else. The parents we are talking about are from the Greatest Generation; they pay their bills and are not the ones in the family against having to pay for their health care...it is their selfish kids, mostly from a Me Generation.

When my FIL saw his savings dwindle while paying for his wife's nursing home bills (to the tune of $250K), he never ever talked about the financial aspect of this family tragedy. Not like the cry babies posting in this thread.

If he had the assets to pay the bills that is all well and good. When a person does not have the means to pay those bills then Medicaid is an option. In FL Medicaid will take everything you have except your homestead property. What would your FIL have done if he didnt have the means to pay the $250k?