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Old 03-23-2015, 04:07 PM
 
4,384 posts, read 4,236,654 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coney View Post
Like it or not, that is being phased out too, not just with teachers, but all physical contact between students because of health scares, some unrealistically because the disease is not communicable from physical contact and some more realistically because they are communicable through contact, even if the odds are small from contracting it.

I don't see why this is such a big deal to you. Handshakes and high fives and hugs aren't necessary for the transmission of knowledge and critical thinking skills. It's just emotional stuff. And it's cultural. Some cultures don't communicate with physical contact. Perhaps, some of the problem here is not that you are defensive but have a rigid way of thinking. One of the changes that you may try to work on before starting your practicum again, is becoming more flexible. Being adaptable is a very important people skill. If you hate people, don't like the social aspect of life, then maybe this occupation is not the best fit for you.

It's possible that having autism causes you to have this black and white mindset. "Take me as I am or don't take me at all." Your observations about parents' relationships with children are very one dimensional, almost like an outworlder watching through the window without hearing any sound. You are missing all the multiple levels of grey. If you can't see grey because you are color-blind to grey, then an occupation that requires a great deal of interpersonal skills, intrapersonal skills, and superb perceptive abilities are not going to be an ideal professin for you. This is often why so many bright people with Aspergers or autistic spectrum disorders focus on occupations that require good calculation skills and mathematical reasoning, not to mention genetics, and diagnoticians.
The local culture is critical. At my school, an inner-city high school in Mississippi, there are lots of hugs all around. Students hug each other and their teachers. Teachers hug students and other teachers. I understand that in other parts of the country, that is way out of line, but here hugging is the norm. Some teachers and students refrain from personal contact, but not most.

Our school has apparently quit enforcing the no-PDAs, so students walk down the halls holding hands--girls and boys, girls and girls, and infrequently boys and boys. We are apparently a very gay-friendly school, to the point that a talent show act a few years ago featured a boy who regularly cross-dressed in what appeared to be a drag show. You would have to have seen it to believe it took place in a school-sponsored event.
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Old 03-23-2015, 04:17 PM
 
395 posts, read 374,626 times
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I like summer camp being affection friendly and being able to goof off.
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Old 03-23-2015, 07:54 PM
 
Location: Middle America
37,409 posts, read 53,576,256 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Enrico_Fermi View Post

Part of my problem, and a reason for this post, was that I simply found it very difficult to gear my lessons to an appropriate learning context for middle school students. I was even told by some people they think I might be way too smart to be a teacher and don't understand how others don't learn as easily, no exaggeration. Student teaching was very hard, and I wasn't prepared. I went home many days feeling bad about myself, and this was probably the only time in my life where I felt I had a bit of an alcohol problem which went away after I was pulled from my assignment, and no, I wasn't under the influence around kids ever.
It's nonsense that one is "too smart" to be a teacher. Teachers SHOULD be very bright. Not all are. What's being noted isn't being "too smart," it's probably a poor ability to appropriately match your instruction methods, style, depth of focus, etc. to your particular group of learners. This may well prove difficult for you, if reading people is not something that comes naturally. It is difficult for many people with limited experience to effectively grasp just how differently diverse learners learn. It can take years.

I HATED student teaching. I chose not to teach for a number of years after it, because I hated it so much. I felt I didn't do well, I felt horrible about myself, felt (justifiably, agreed my advisor, who investigated on my behalf) that I was not being given good mentoring or a fair shake. One of my biggest challenges was adjusting my expectations to what was realistic for the students I was teaching. I had predominantly worked with gifted/talented groups at that point. When I student taught, I had very mixed ability classes, and was good at reaching the very accelerated learners, but left those who struggled more in the dust. When I eventually found my way back to teaching, and specifically went to work with struggling learners, I approached it very differently. As an adult in my 30s, I had a very different approach than I had when I was 21-22 and newly out of my own high school experience, and teaching a classroom of high schoolers in a way I would have loved to have been taught, but which didn't work for them.

Quote:
Part of the reasons for a lot of the political related posts and disability is I'm trying to find out where I can bend and where I can't. One thing I learned I'm capable of doing is leaving any kind of talk about my sexual or romantic issues outside of school, but learning how to dodge those questions without hurting the students feelings or getting them to badger the questions harder is something I'm still learning.
I found that I got MUCH more comfortable being direct about boundaries as the age gap widened, personally. I taught high school much of the time, and being a student teacher who is just a couple of years older than your students can make boundary setting akward,though necessary.

Quote:
However, another frequent suggestion I'm getting is being willing to tip toe around society's expectations of male teachers and how they should behave different than women do to be more careful. To that I say, I appreciate the concern, but I'll pass. I'm not doing anything illegal or that is grounds for a lawsuit, and people's accusations would only be based on emotional fear and not on evidence, so they can bark all they want that I'm not acting enough man like as a teacher.
This is your call. There are a million cautionary tales, and many of us know people who've been victimized and had teaching careers derailed due to double standards that exist. Careers have ended over emotion v. evidence, and it it's a bell that can't be unrung, in many cases, once allegations and accusations of improper conduct are out there, legitimate or not. While it's completely your choice to say, "I reject being viewed differently as a male teacher/gay teacher/gay male teacher," it also doesn't necessarily matter whether or not you reject it, if people view you a particular way, they'll view you a particular way, and there's nothing you will be able to do to stop them from doing so. As a male, you will automatically be viewed as more potentially predatory than your female colleagues by some people, unfortunately. Not liking that and not agreeing with that doesn't make it any less true. It sucks, but saying, "I reject this," doesn't make it not the case.

Quote:
Also, I don't really see myself as ever being able to become more of a people person. I hate people with a passion, and all I can do is fake it. What I try to read when dealing with parents is are they really wanting their kid to succeed because it is what is best for their kid, are they out to get teachers and think their kid is perfect and does no wrong, but unfortunately, what I read from most parents is mostly they want their kids to carry on their family genes and path they set for them such as following things like their religion and motives and will quickly disown their children for being themselves.
Honestly, if this is truly the case, that you "hate other people with a passion," it would be hard to imagine a more inappropriate line of work for you to pursue than teaching. Students deserve better than to be taught by people who hate them, hate their parents, hate their colleagues, etc.
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Old 03-23-2015, 08:13 PM
 
395 posts, read 374,626 times
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What's more unfortunate is that there are female predators out there. They slip under everyone's radar, and they often use their gender to their advantage when grooming children and people consider it mothering or caring and ignore the warning signs.

I'm personally just more affectionate with kids I guess and people can make nasty claims all they want, but I'm not going to change what kind of person I am just because other people are prejudiced and perceive men as being predators. So like I said, I'll pass at trying to go along with society's prejudice, because eliminating prejudice does not happen by people accepting and going along with it.

As far as hating people is concerned, I don't hate individuals, but I find that most people are irrational hypocrites. What I worry about all the time is the kids I work with being raised by hateful parents that are taking them away from their potential as human beings. I worry about what kind of home life they have and what kind of detriment their parents are doing to them.
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Old 03-23-2015, 08:35 PM
 
17,183 posts, read 22,916,488 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Enrico_Fermi View Post
What's more unfortunate is that there are female predators out there. They slip under everyone's radar, and they often use their gender to their advantage when grooming children and people consider it mothering or caring and ignore the warning signs.

I'm personally just more affectionate with kids I guess and people can make nasty claims all they want, but I'm not going to change what kind of person I am just because other people are prejudiced and perceive men as being predators. So like I said, I'll pass at trying to go along with society's prejudice, because eliminating prejudice does not happen by people accepting and going along with it.

As far as hating people is concerned, I don't hate individuals, but I find that most people are irrational hypocrites. What I worry about all the time is the kids I work with being raised by hateful parents that are taking them away from their potential as human beings. I worry about what kind of home life they have and what kind of detriment their parents are doing to them.
I agree about the female predators.

Seriously, though, you need to work *with* the parents. They want the best for their child and so should you as a teacher. Change your perspective because if you don't you will never stay in teaching. You must respect both the parents and the children.

Now, there are certainly bad parents, but they are not in the majority regardless of what you think. If you think that *most* people are irrational hypocrites, you need a job where you do not work with people. As for worrying about the kid's home life, it is true that some kids have really rough lives, but you cannot change that unless you are a councilor or social worker or work for child protective services.
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Old 03-23-2015, 09:05 PM
 
395 posts, read 374,626 times
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Well, what I worry about parents is what I usually find is not reality always when I meet them, but fear. I've met some parents who really loved and cared for their kids deeply, and I generally find those are the parents who are very warm and accepting of the kind of compassion I have with their kids.

What I want to be able to do is if I don't get into teaching, I want to still have a career that allows me some time to be a volunteer in schools as a mentor as I have done before as I have helped some teachers with autistic students and students who struggle with anger management.

I really would like to consider going into Juvenile law. What I worry about with teaching is that it is going to become too much paper pushing and not enough making a difference and having the ability to get a child to learn and grow. I hated grading papers. It took a lot of time that I could be doing other passionate tasks. I didn't get the sense in student teaching that there was much intellectually stimulating, or there wasn't some kind of expertise that a teacher has that is really needed such as an attorney or a psychologist. I'm not slamming teachers saying their job is to basically read from the script, but it seems as that is what it is being turned into.
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Old 03-23-2015, 09:40 PM
 
Location: My beloved Bluegrass
20,126 posts, read 16,159,824 times
Reputation: 28335
Quote:
Originally Posted by Enrico_Fermi View Post
Well, what I worry about parents is what I usually find is not reality always when I meet them, but fear. I've met some parents who really loved and cared for their kids deeply, and I generally find those are the parents who are very warm and accepting of the kind of compassion I have with their kids.

What I want to be able to do is if I don't get into teaching, I want to still have a career that allows me some time to be a volunteer in schools as a mentor as I have done before as I have helped some teachers with autistic students and students who struggle with anger management.

I really would like to consider going into Juvenile law. What I worry about with teaching is that it is going to become too much paper pushing and not enough making a difference and having the ability to get a child to learn and grow. I hated grading papers. It took a lot of time that I could be doing other passionate tasks. I didn't get the sense in student teaching that there was much intellectually stimulating, or there wasn't some kind of expertise that a teacher has that is really needed such as an attorney or a psychologist. I'm not slamming teachers saying their job is to basically read from the script, but it seems as that is what it is being turned into.
You really, really, really need to explore career options other than teaching. EVERYTHING you write indicates it is not a good fit for you, in pretty much anyway you look at it. Based on what you keep writing, if you become a teacher you will experience issues with proper student/teacher boundaries, treating all students equally, collaborating with fellow teachers, understanding your obligation to the community, adjusting to changes, establishing a cooperative relationship with parents, following administrator policies, communicating with about everyone, and the list goes on, and on, and on. I am not trying to be cruel, but you have limitations that are serious enough that it would come as no surprise if you got in actual legal trouble as a teacher. There is a true disconnect between your perception and the reality of a teacher's legitimate role and obligations.

And nobody is "too smart to be a teacher." Sheesh.
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When I post in bold red that is moderator action and, per the TOS, can only be discussed through Direct Message.Moderator - Diabetes and Kentucky (including Lexington & Louisville)
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Old 03-23-2015, 09:48 PM
 
395 posts, read 374,626 times
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Obligation to the community? What is that supposed to mean?

I also don't see anything I said that would indicate I wouldn't treat students equally. Because in the last thread I said I would have trouble empathizing with a student who got teased for bashing gay people? Yeah, that's not unequal treatment.
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Old 03-24-2015, 07:36 AM
 
Location: My beloved Bluegrass
20,126 posts, read 16,159,824 times
Reputation: 28335
Quote:
Originally Posted by Enrico_Fermi View Post
I also don't see anything I said that would indicate I wouldn't treat students equally. Because in the last thread I said I would have trouble empathizing with a student who got teased for bashing gay people? Yeah, that's not unequal treatment.
That you don't understand why your attitude is a problem, and immediately dismiss other people's observations or even lash out when they don't suit your script, is the real problem. There are many, many choices and rights that teachers don't have when it comes to students, and that does not seem to be something you can accept. Whether that is an inherent personality trait or part of your disability, I don't know. What I do know, and what infuriates me, is that your program has not properly done its job and stopped this charade. While I don't like the possible damage you might do if employed, it is at least going to be limited to a year or less because your problems will become obvious quickly and you won't have a contract renewed. Who they are doing a huge disservice to, in truth, is you. We have another poster on this board who shares some of your traits and who this was also done to, she is still struggling to find employment while sitting on degrees she is finding she can't utilize and, like too many in your generation, massive student loans. It wasn't a fair thing to do to her, nor ultimately will it be to you.

I can not repeat this enough - not everyone can be a teacher and wanting/deciding to do something is not enough. Rehashing the same points over and over, or picking slightly different points to rant about, is not going to change the big picture and is just frustrating to everyone involved in the exchange.
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When I post in bold red that is moderator action and, per the TOS, can only be discussed through Direct Message.Moderator - Diabetes and Kentucky (including Lexington & Louisville)
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Old 03-24-2015, 08:41 AM
 
3,070 posts, read 5,232,614 times
Reputation: 6578
I think you really need to have an honest sit down with your supervisor. If this is truly how you feel, you aren't suited to this profession in this capacity. Some of us have tried offering guidance in ethics, but you just counter it with a complete lack of understanding.

I do see a lot of autism traits in you (I work in both ESL and SPED), and yeah, as the parent of a son with autism, I know you "are who you are", but there are certain professions that just don't work with the mindset like this. Just like us teachers can't handle professions that may suit you. Your math intelligence is a gift but it is no more intelligent than the ability to deal with a gay-bashing bully in an appropriate matter.

I for see you have the same future as kmb: all the certificates but you won't get called for work. And I think your supervisors and school have let you down by not making ethics VERY clear.

With ESL as a subject, we dealt with ethics daily, much more so than other content areas. It really is more important than any other subject IMO. Lesson plans can be bought, ethics is a SKILL unlike any other that must use empathy and people skills.
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