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Old 04-26-2015, 08:02 AM
 
11,642 posts, read 23,857,289 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CA4Now View Post
From the math 6-12 page on your link, I can see that some of these requirements may challenge people who don't feel particularly competent in math.

4. Determine the slope, intercepts, or equation of a line, given appropriate information.
5. Formulate and solve systems of linear equations or inequalities, including models of real world situations.
9. Solve quadratic equations using factoring, graphing, completing the square, or applying the quadratic formula, including complex solutions.
This is all basic algebra. A refresher course should be sufficient for any college graduate to pass the test.
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Old 04-26-2015, 08:25 AM
 
Location: Finally in NC
1,337 posts, read 2,204,078 times
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Germaine: I too was a Milwaukee teacher for 13 years: UWM grad.
When I went back for my MA, there were several other current teachers who were also adding sped certification. Many were not able to pass the PRAXIS2 math component. One actually lost her current job because of it. She was moved into a special ed position based on the fact that she was completing her coursework in SPED. She failed the test 3 times, could not get her sped license, (was working on an emergency license) and then was out of a placement. She ended up going to teach at a private school.
WI has high expectations for their teachers, BUT some teachers were somehow able to get certified with horrible grammar spelling, and basic English. When I was an undergrad at UWM, you couldnt get into the teaching program until you passed a test. Well, they waived failing scores if you were male or minority because they wanted to diversify the teacher pool. BAD IDEA. If you do not meet the requirements to become a teacher, you shouldnt be moved along and given a degree you didnt earn.
How can any state not require at least a basic math assessment to certify a teacher? Wow!
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Old 04-26-2015, 08:30 AM
 
Location: So Ca
26,655 posts, read 26,627,701 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Momma_bear View Post
This is all basic algebra. A refresher course should be sufficient for any college graduate to pass the test.
Possibly....but I can think of many people--including long time (non math) teachers--who would be intimidated by a quadratic equation and solving f(x)...much less graphing it. Their eyes would probably glaze over after one minute of observing this clip:
https://www.khanacademy.org/math/alg...ratic-equation
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Old 04-26-2015, 02:08 PM
 
Location: Chicago
6,160 posts, read 5,675,842 times
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The US is one of the few countries requiring science and math for non science and math degrees.

I was required to take one math class, and two science classes for my Bachelor's degree in French.

A friend in France who is majoring in art was not required to take any math or science classes. Why should she? Same goes for teaching. If a French teacher is required to have knowledge of math, shouldn't we require math teachers to have knowledge of Spanish, art history, etc.?

I've been out of school for a few years and have NEVER needed to calculate logarithms or use any math beyond an 8th grade level.
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Old 04-26-2015, 04:12 PM
 
Location: My beloved Bluegrass
20,110 posts, read 16,086,069 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lepoisson View Post
The US is one of the few countries requiring science and math for non science and math degrees.

I was required to take one math class, and two science classes for my Bachelor's degree in French.

A friend in France who is majoring in art was not required to take any math or science classes. Why should she? Same goes for teaching. If a French teacher is required to have knowledge of math, shouldn't we require math teachers to have knowledge of Spanish, art history, etc.?

I've been out of school for a few years and have NEVER needed to calculate logarithms or use any math beyond an 8th grade level.
I majored in Geoscience. My university required me to take and pass classes in art history, sociology, two semesters of the foreign language of my choice, communications, literature, writing, American history, two semesters of non-American history, and I forget some of the others. If I couldn't pass them I didn't graduate. Math and science teachers are tested on teaching literacy, English, and reading comphension in order to be certified in most states. So that is already required.

And...... Math and proportions plays a part in determining good art. I remember that from my art history classes.
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Old 04-20-2017, 08:40 PM
 
18,527 posts, read 15,506,793 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SPAteacherNYC View Post
I know, I know...we all use math one way or another whether we realize it or not.

But do we really use high-level math? I can certainly understand the reading and writing parts of the Basic Skills Tests...we all [English speakers] talk and write in English all the time; we communicate through the English language, not through statistical data or algebraic equations. I know that some of you will give me snarky examples of how we do use those in real life, but I really need some sympathy now.

The truth is that I feel that I have a lot of good qualities to become a teacher. I am compassionate, patient, knowledgeable, empathetic, hard-working, socially and culturally aware, and very much into social justice and educational improvement, and I love children and adolescents, but I probably won't be able to teach ever because I am unable to pass these stupid tests.


How does knowing how to get the unknown X in a two variable algebraic equation make me a better Spanish teacher?
And those are the kinds of things that you don't master in a 4 month crash course. You have to scaffold those skills from day one of your life-long education.
Most states will not let you teach Spanish, art, or theatre if you don't pass a fricking math component of a Basic Skills test that includes not just simple arithmetic, but probability, stats, and algebra. I don't know whether this was my fault or my teachers' fault, but at some point I became extremely bad at math. Anyone who says that there's no such thing as being bad at math, please come here and teach me how to pass those tests. I will pay them whatever they want.

This is a rant-y post because I am incredibly frustrated. I am not kidding...I'm this close to crying.

IAnyone know if any state in the USA doesn't require a math component in their Basic Skills Tests for non-math/non-science teachers?
Being compassionate, patient, empathetic, hard-working and socially/culturally aware is very important, and I'm glad you have those qualities. You have to know Algebra and Geometry. You don't need high-level math like Calculus or Differential Equations. But part of being a good teacher is teaching students how to get through what is difficult for them. And if you can't do that yourself, then how can you teach?

Also, Algebra (especially the not-high-level stuff) is primarily a thinking exercise. We must teach students to think! Those who just work super hard and strictly follow directions without thinking will never be rich, and will probably fall out of the Middle Class thanks to economic change!!

I'm sorry to say, but at this time you are not qualified to be a school teacher. But if you learn Algebra and other things, maybe go back to school, then you might get those qualifications and could potentially become a great teacher.

Oh and another thing, if you need sympathy now, just wait til you have to work with a bunch of kids who don't want to listen, don't want to be there, and drive you crazy!
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Old 04-21-2017, 07:47 PM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
50,450 posts, read 24,044,107 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Everdeen View Post
I was going to try to help you find a solution because according to you:



The mathematics in the Pre Praxis/Basic Skills is written at an eighth grade level. Anyone who cannot pass the math portion of the Pre Praxis should not be allowed to teach.

Anyone who cannot pass the other portions of the Pre Praxis should not be in the teaching profession either.

Please, by all means, stay in New York.
I agree with you. These rather basic tests are just that...rather basic. If someone is really committed to being a teacher, they will do what they need to do to make it happen. In grad school I was drowning in the second stat class. So I hired a tutor and got through what I needed to get through.

And it's very easy (and very wrong) to say that math isn't that important, but there are lots of people out there who feel exactly the same way about foreign language.

The kinds of minimal standards required in these tests ought to be recognized for what they are -- minimal. "Oh, I just can't pass a basic math test." How is that different than a high school student saying, "Oh, I just can't pass French (or Spanish)"?
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Old 04-21-2017, 07:57 PM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
50,450 posts, read 24,044,107 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SPAteacherNYC View Post
Lucky for me and many other awesome non-math teachers, not all administrators and school districts share that rigid opinion of what makes a great teacher.


I cannot wait to start teaching in NYC!!!!!
How much time have you spent in a teaching position -- not subbbing -- to make such a statement?
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Old 04-23-2017, 05:06 PM
 
Location: Hamilton, Ohio
24 posts, read 27,734 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Everdeen View Post
I'm sorry you feel like you should be a teacher, but the fact of the matter is that you are not qualified.

What if I didn't understand the rules for capitalization and punctuation? Should the basic minimum be set aside for me?

In this day and age, you will be required to understand a variety of mathematical concepts in order to function on your job as a public school teacher.

If you would like to teach Spanish, my suggestion would be to get a degree in Spanish and teach at a private school. You could also open and run a day care service that augments school readiness.
The problem is, these standardized tests are purposely tricky. Just because someone fails the math component of a test doesn't mean that person doesn't know math. The same way I could fail a Reading, or Writing portion of a test, doesn't mean I'm not competent in those areas either.

Many of these standardized tests want you to pick the best answer. This means there can be three correct answers, and one clear wrong answer per question. I've also noticed many of them are opinionated.

If you ask me, just because someone aces a standardized test, doesn't automatically qualify them as as "competent."
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Old 04-23-2017, 05:15 PM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
50,450 posts, read 24,044,107 times
Reputation: 32773
Quote:
Originally Posted by RedsBengalsFan View Post
The problem is, these standardized tests are purposely tricky. Just because someone fails the math component of a test doesn't mean that person doesn't know math. The same way I could fail a Reading, or Writing portion of a test, doesn't mean I'm not competent in those areas either.

Many of these standardized tests want you to pick the best answer. This means there can be three correct answers, and one clear wrong answer per question. I've also noticed many of them are opinionated.

If you ask me, just because someone aces a standardized test, doesn't automatically qualify them as as "competent."
There have to be some standards, otherwise some wahoo can just claim they're a competent teacher. These tests are a basic standard. Further qualifications come from other sources.

It's either that or no standards at all.
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