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Well, today the kids got mad at me for what appeared to be no reason; they disobeyed the classroom rules and started shouting loudly and talking about nonsense. I attempted to listen and reason with them, but that seemed to make it worse. I was a bit upset by it and gave one a time-out and took away their art time as punishment. I'm willing to accept that it was just a one-off day, but it's happened a few times with my students since I've had them.
Well, today the kids got mad at me for what appeared to be no reason; they disobeyed the classroom rules and started shouting loudly and talking about nonsense. I attempted to listen and reason with them, but that seemed to make it worse. I was a bit upset by it and gave one a time-out and took away their art time as punishment. I'm willing to accept that it was just a one-off day, but it's happened a few times with my students since I've had them.
1. I cannot provide any actionable advice based on what you wrote. If they got mad at you for no reason, started disobeying classroom rules, shouting loudly and talking about nonsense, I don't know what I can suggest on how to fix that.
2. I think there probably was a reason, but you either don't want to admit it or don't know what it was.
3. Are these high school kids? Offhand, I'm not sure that giving someone in high school a "time out" is appropriate, as that brings up images of little kids. I don't think these are elementary school kids since you are in a detention facility?
4. Take away art time? Again, sounds like little kids here...not sure that high school age would mind missing art class.
1. I cannot provide any actionable advice based on what you wrote. If they got mad at you for no reason, started disobeying classroom rules, shouting loudly and talking about nonsense, I don't know what I can suggest on how to fix that.
2. I think there probably was a reason, but you either don't want to admit it or don't know what it was.
3. Are these high school kids? Offhand, I'm not sure that giving someone in high school a "time out" is appropriate, as that brings up images of little kids. I don't think these are elementary school kids since you are in a detention facility?
4. Take away art time? Again, sounds like little kids here...not sure that high school age would mind missing art class.
She works at a detention center, I believe the kids are both middle and high school. Some of the rules and nuances of a regular classroom won't apply in her setting. That said, figuring out why they were mad, even if the teacher doesn't think they should be mad about it, is the first step in figuring out how to fix it.
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Finding the function of the behavior is key in predicting and potentially addressing future episodes. Most behavior of this nature is either for the purpose of getting a reaction/attention (positive or negative), or for the purpose of task avoidance (or both).
You can combat the first, the attentionseeking behavior, by not providing the desired reaction. This will only work, though, if it's actually safe and possible to commit to not reacting in the expected way. Often, in classrooms with a majority of students with behavioral issues, it's not possible to put all behavior on total extinction, because it's either too disruptive to ignore totally, it's dangerous, or it will escalate to dangerous if ignored. So if you don't have a system set up to avoid reacting in a way that pays the behavior off, it's difficult to combat. Sometimes you don't have any choice but to react in a manner that pays off the behavior, and that's a problem of ineffective policy (which the individual instructor often doesn't have any control over, anyway).
The second, task avoidance, you can only combat if you have the ability to enact consequences for avoiding the task, or to reinforce being on-task meaningfully. Again, if you're in a setting where you are given no tools nor the autonomy to address students who are chronically off-task, good luck addressing task-avoidant behavior. It's not possible to manage behavior in a situation where there is no effective way to reinforce and/or enact some type of consequence.
FTR, in teaching behaviorally disordered students, I've had plenty of instances where a student or students was "mad at me."
Why? Because it's my job to assign and carry out consequences their behavior earns, both positive and negative. The buck stops with me. Countercontrol kids have a hard time with that, and the reaction is that they get "mad at me," because they're not in control. Tough, 'tis life.
The difference in your situation, OP, I suspect, is that the students actually ARE in control, to some degree. This might be due to you and your acknowledged limitations, or it might be due to a poorly set up learning environment where you are not given the autonomy to set up and carry out expectations in an effective manner. Or both. Students will push to get away with absolutely as much as they can. And that's true of even students without severe behavioral problems. Throw in students in a detention facility, and it's even more the case. If you don't have the tools at your disposal to properly handle kids who are going to be "mad" at you a good portion of the time just due to the fact that you are maintaining control over their environment, it's going to be impossible to succeed.
I personally don't think that teaching is the right professional for kmb501. She graduated college 5 years ago and has been in a large variety of school environments for 5 years. She is not a new teacher. She also has a masters degree in education. She has posted a questions on here for over 2 years now and received lots of tips and advice. I'm sure she is active on other teaching forums and probably also active asking questions in real life as well. I think she's received plenty of good advice, but is not effective at classroom management.
KMB501 - it's my opinion that it is time for you to look at a different profession.
FTR, in teaching behaviorally disordered students, I've had plenty of instances where a student or students was "mad at me."
Why? Because it's my job to assign and carry out consequences their behavior earns, both positive and negative. The buck stops with me. Countercontrol kids have a hard time with that, and the reaction is that they get "mad at me," because they're not in control. Tough, 'tis life.
The difference in your situation, OP, I suspect, is that the students actually ARE in control, to some degree. This might be due to you and your acknowledged limitations, or it might be due to a poorly set up learning environment where you are not given the autonomy to set up and carry out expectations in an effective manner. Or both. Students will push to get away with absolutely as much as they can. And that's true of even students without severe behavioral problems. Throw in students in a detention facility, and it's even more the case. If you don't have the tools at your disposal to properly handle kids who are going to be "mad" at you a good portion of the time just due to the fact that you are maintaining control over their environment, it's going to be impossible to succeed.
Very good post.
Kmb, what is the turnover rate for your position at this facility? I would imagine that it's fairly high.
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