Why do people say teachers make so little? (score, learning, question)

[TuborgP]

Originally Posted by tejano2828

Every Year there is mass shortages of teachers in just about any state...Why? because yes teachers are in fact underpaid. A person in pharmaceutical is paid way more and in my opinion does much less than a teacher does in a work day. At minimum teachers should start off at 60,000 minimum and go up from there....believe me there would be much lower shortages if this was the case. For years teachers have been called professionals and go to some of the best schools. At minimum teachers do around 6 years of schooling, especially if you are doing secondary. New schools are popping up everywhere in Texas and they are scrambling to fill positions. Quick remedy pay them more for highly qualified teachers and there won't be no problems. For those who say that teachers get paid alright, why don't you come down and try it out for a school year. you got to deal with parents, teens, fights, boyfriend/girlfriend in same classroom issues, drugs, HIV, gangs, TAKS, TEKS, principals, ETC ETC ETC......teachers should be getting above 60,000 that's just my opinion

If tax payers agree they will. If not they won't.

[SeaSideBay]

Originally Posted by Ivorytickler

What does a SAHM have to complain about? Her wages? Her benefits package? SAH isn't a job. It's the absence of a job.

What you're not getting is SAH is taking care of your own life. If you're complaining about that, you need to do some serious reflection on your life. Working moms do what SAHM's do when they are off work but I don't here them complaining about it. Taking care of our lives is something we're expected to do. Whether you work or not is a personal choice if you're lucky enough to be able to afford the choice. I'm not getting what SAHM's have to complain about.

Teachers, OTOH, are public workers. They serve society. They educate society's children. Often in circumstances that are wanting. They work very long hours making sure kids have an education. They deliver something very valuable to society. Complaining about being underpaid when you perform a valuable service for society is not out of line. Some of us won't be able to keep delivering this service if the pay situation isn't remedied. I'm one of them. As things are, I cannot afford to teach. I based this career change on district wages not realizing that I'd never have that option, so I'll return to engineering. Apparently, I'm move valuable to society as an engineer. I don't get it but that's what society has declared in that they'll pay me three times as much to be an engineer. I guess I'm three times more valuable as an engineer than as a teacher. Whatever.

I see that you have completely missed my point.

[Ivorytickler]

Originally Posted by SeaSideBay

I see that you have completely missed my point.

Perhaps you should clarify. I see no comparison between a SAHM and a teacher. One is taking care of her own life. The other is a career that benefits society. The former has value to your family. The latter value to society, or, at least, it should.

[SeaSideBay]

Originally Posted by Ivorytickler

Perhaps you should clarify. I see no comparison between a SAHM and a teacher. One is taking care of her own life. The other is a career that benefits society. The former has value to your family. The latter value to society, or, at least, it should.

That's the problem. I already have clarified and you do not care to be compassionate to toward people's careers. Yes ***careers*** Just because someone is not being paid does not mean they are not doing a job, a very important one at that. I am not saying your job is less important in anyway. I you need to invest in that compassion you are asking for as a teacher and realize your job is not the only worries, frustrations, stress, under-appreciation, etc....You ask for sympathy, yet you are not willing to give any yourself.

Until you realize that what a GOOD SAHM is not just on a long vacation, you are no better than the people you claim will not listen to your pleas.

[Ivorytickler]

Originally Posted by SeaSideBay

That's the problem. I already have clarified and you do not care to be compassionate to toward people's careers. Yes ***careers*** Just because someone is not being paid does not mean they are not doing a job, a very important one at that. I am not saying your job is less important in anyway. I you need to invest in that compassion you are asking for as a teacher and realize your job is not the only worries, frustrations, stress, under-appreciation, etc....You ask for sympathy, yet you are not willing to give any yourself.

Until you realize that what a GOOD SAHM is not just on a long vacation, you are no better than the people you claim will not listen to your pleas.

Taking care of our families is not a career. It's taking care of our lives. EVERYONE does this. We all clean our houses, take care of our kids, mow our lawns, pay our bills, cook meals, help kids with homework...ect, etc, etc, regardless of our work status. It doesn't become a career because you choose to it to the exclusion of a paying job.

I'm sorry but what we do as parents does not compare to what I do as a teacher. Not even close. I know, I do both. I'm a parent and a teacher. Get back to me after you complete your first year teaching 7 high school classes with 30 students in each class and then we'll talk. What I do as a parent at home is like being on vacation by comparison. In fact, I'm "on vacation" right now and doing exactly what SAHM's do, lol.

Why are you so gung ho to have SAH (AKA Parenting which we all do) considered like a career? Since when is caring for our own families compared to a job we do for others? I can't paint my own house and call myself a painter. I can't change my own oil in my car and call myself a mechanic. I can't cook a meal and call myself a chef. Why do you want to teach your own kids and call yourself a teacher? Doing something for yourself is doing something for yourself. DIY doesn't rank you with the professionals.

What sympathy does a SAHM need? What I asked for is valuing and fair compensation for what I do for society. I'm both a teacher and a parent. I do what SAHM's do when I'm home. Why would I want sympathy for that?

[SeaSideBay]

Originally Posted by Ivorytickler

Taking care of our families is not a career. It's taking care of our lives. EVERYONE does this. We all clean our houses, take care of our kids, mow our lawns, pay our bills, cook meals, help kids with homework...ect, etc, etc, regardless of our work status. It doesn't become a career because you choose to it to the exclusion of a paying job.

I'm sorry but what we do as parents does not compare to what I do as a teacher. Not even close. I know, I do both. I'm a parent and a teacher. Get back to me after you complete your first year teaching 7 high school classes with 30 students in each class and then we'll talk. What I do as a parent at home is like being on vacation by comparison. In fact, I'm "on vacation" right now and doing exactly what SAHM's do, lol.

Why are you so gung ho to have SAH (AKA Parenting which we all do) considered like a career? Since when is caring for our own families compared to a job we do for others? I can't paint my own house and call myself a painter. I can't change my own oil in my car and call myself a mechanic. I can't cook a meal and call myself a chef. Why do you want to teach your own kids and call yourself a teacher? Doing something for yourself is doing something for yourself. DIY doesn't rank you with the professionals.

What sympathy does a SAHM need? What I asked for is valuing and fair compensation for what I do for society. I'm both a teacher and a parent. I do what SAHM's do when I'm home. Why would I want sympathy for that?

Clearly you have an inability to see someone anyone's perspective than your own. Some teacher you must be.

There is no point in me trying to explain anything because whatever I say is going to be wrong and whatever you say is going to be right.

Have fun arguing with yourself. I'm done.

[TouchOfWhimsy]

Why are you so gung ho to have SAH (AKA Parenting which we all do) considered like a career? Since when is caring for our own families compared to a job we do for others? I can't paint my own house and call myself a painter. I can't change my own oil in my car and call myself a mechanic. I can't cook a meal and call myself a chef. Why do you want to teach your own kids and call yourself a teacher? Doing something for yourself is doing something for yourself. DIY doesn't rank you with the professionals.

*shrug* You can call yourself whatever you want. Many places offer teacher/educator discounts, and as a homeschooler, I qualify for (and accept) all of them. I don't have to deal with crowd control, but I am very much teaching my two students. (On the crowd control issue, I have absolutely no desire to ever have to deal with that... I imagine after corralling 200 teenagers per day, you DO feel like you're on vacation when you're home! There are many days that I feel like I'm on vacation... one of the perks of SAHMing!)

[Ivorytickler]

Originally Posted by beanandpumpkin

*shrug* You can call yourself whatever you want. Many places offer teacher/educator discounts, and as a homeschooler, I qualify for (and accept) all of them. I don't have to deal with crowd control, but I am very much teaching my two students. (On the crowd control issue, I have absolutely no desire to ever have to deal with that... I imagine after corralling 200 teenagers per day, you DO feel like you're on vacation when you're home! There are many days that I feel like I'm on vacation... one of the perks of SAHMing!)

There is a huge difference between DIY with a few kids and teaching professionally. As I said, get back to me when you finish your first year teaching 200+ students and then tell me it's the same. I know it's not. I've done both.

That's right I feel like I'm on vacation when I'm home because teaching is way harder than being home.

However, back to the point. Teaching is my profession and it is not unreasonable to expect decent compensation for what I do. I don't complain about my hours or even my work load (to a point as I think our classes are overcrowded which is no good for anyone). I complain that the pay is so low I need a second job to make ends meet. THAT should not happen given what I do for a living.

I don't expect any compensation for what I do at home. Nor do I expect recognition. I hope I never look at my family as a job I'd expect sympathy for taking care of.

[Braunwyn]

Originally Posted by tejano2828

Every Year there is mass shortages of teachers in just about any state...Why? because yes teachers are in fact underpaid. A person in pharmaceutical is paid way more and in my opinion does much less than a teacher does in a work day.

I agree that teachers should be paid more, but what does this (in bold) mean?

[flik_becky]

Originally Posted by Ivorytickler

I don't get this "logic". You can choose a career but not like the wage package. By this logic, anyone who chooses any career should just accept any wages they are given, quietly. No one should ever fight for better wages because no one should ever complain they're underpaid. This is not logical.

If no one knows you're unhappy with your wages, why would anyone ever change it?

A SAHM is different in that she does't work. There is no wage package to comlain about. No requirements for the job that are rediculous. Given the educations teachers are expected to have, the work loads they have and the importance of what they do, they should be paid a fair wage. And there is nothing wrong with saying that.

And why are we comparing SAH to teaching? They're worlds apart. What I do as a teacher does not compare to what I do as a mom. By comparison, being a mom is easy. Being a mom is taking care of my life. As a teacher, I take care of other people's children. I do a service for society.

OH MY GOODNESS! I was NOT saying that a SAHM was under appreciated in any way or trying to compare staying at home with teaching. I was just saying, you made your choice and it is annoying and pointless to me to hear someone complain about that choice they made, like a SAHM who complains about being with her kids all day, which is about as pointless as it gets.

UNDERPAID is when you have been working for someone for 10 years, actually do a decent job at what you do with loads of experince, and then the new guy comes along and starts out making more than what you started with. UNDERPAID is when you look at similar cities or towns and compare their teachers median wage and you and/or your coworkers make significantly less.

THIS is what the rest of America has to deal with. TEACHERS have it pretty easy...A TENURE...who gets that these days?? Summers off? Holidays off? Weekends off? Evenings without having to be at work so you can eat dinner with your family every night and be their to put your kids to bed? Sick days? Who gets these luxuries today??? Not too many people. In this economy, be happy with the choice you made and that your job is at least more secure than more than 50% of the rest of working Americans. The fact remains, its an average paying job, with a hell of a lot more job security and perks than the rest of us have.