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That's partly what I'm saying. For example, VA is a RTW state. If I wait until August for example, to resign and take a job with another district, my district doesn't have to release me. Being in a RTW state wouldn't keep me from losing my license.
There is a deadline by which one has to notify the district in order to resign without prejudice. If the employee notifies the district after the deadline then the employee is not eligible for reemployment with the district; when giving references, the district will advise that the employee resigned with prejudice and the district may recommend that teacher's certificate be revoked.
The poster I was referring to actually does not know what right to work is vs. at will employment. Right to work just means there is no more "closed shop" aka you do not have to join the union and it is federal law. At will employment is a separate statute that varies somewhat from state to state, and ultimately, a teaching contract trumps all of that. I am literally shocked that this person things a contract can simply be walked away from, it literally is the opposite of what a contract means.
No as for whether or not a state goes after a certificate after a contract is broken, that will vary from state to state and has nothing to do with right to work at all.
Ivory that is not because you are in a right-to-work state, you and the district still have a contractual agreement. A contract is not voidable simply because one party decides they no longer want to honor it, both parties must agree to end the contract to void it. What makes Michigan different is that there is no state certification sanctions for you walking away from your contract. In most states, including quite a few that are right-to-work states, the state laws specifically spell out that they can suspend your certification until the contract expires. In other words, they will not allow another public school system to enter into a contract with you until your original contract has ended. The only thing Michigan's laws specify for breaking your contract is that your tenure is automatically voided and you would have to start over at any new district. However, some districts in Michigan have addressed that issue in their contracts, maybe yours isn't one of them. From what you have described yours is considered a desirable district to work in, so that isn't surprising.
Just for FYI:
We start over at a new district no matter what. If I left my district I would have no tenure in a new district even if I gave notice in June. That's just how it is here. You start at the bottom every time you move. FTR that's how it works in industry too. Now that districts don't give steps it doesn't matter. Before it would be hard to leave because you'd give up income. Now you just start at the entry level somewhere else. It is rare for a district to give steps to a new hire. I've heard of it happening in districts in the boonies that have a shortage of teachers but not in the suburban areas. Even then you would not have tenure when you start.
RTW made my employment contract like any employment contract. It's not enforceable after one party decides they no longer want to employ someone or be employed by the company/schoool. They can't make me work for them anymore than I can make them keep me on. RTW eliminated any power the union had left to stop them from dismissing people at will. It also gave us the right to opt out of the union. I chose to stay in for the legal representation if I ever needed it. After the nonsense I went through with my last principal I'm not taking any chances. I'll pay my $1000/year and know I have legal representation if I need it. Wage wise it doesn't help me because when they passed RTW they gave schools the right to ignore the pay scale (I don't think this is part of RTW but it happened around the same time. The THEORY was that schools would give steps to good teachers and not to bad ones but they chose to give them to no one.). Even though my district told me when I hired in that my pay would increase with seniority, it doesn't. I don't know how it is legal to do that. Tell people you get steps for every year you stay and then just don't give them. They're in the contract.....which means nothing. RTW was the final depowering of the union. Unfortunately, teaching is not a mobile profession like other professions. We can't move for better pay and benefits. The only benefit of belonging to the union is legal representation now.
Last edited by Ivorytickler; 08-29-2016 at 09:28 AM..
No instructor gives their all. It is perfectly acceptable to leave something left over for my family. I do not have to expend all of my efforts on teaching. I am not required to sacrifice my family for this or any other career. I don't know a single teacher who sacrifices their own kids, which would be the case if you gave your all to teaching (if you give all, there is nothing left ). That is, simply not required. What is required is resonable effort. One could say giving your all when you are teaching. That I am committed to my trade. (personally, I put in more effort than I should because I do cut into my ability to meet my family's needs. I need to work on that.) I'm only required to accept low pay to do this job until I can rectify the situation. One nice thing about rectifying the wage situation will be that I will have more time to work on teaching because I'll be able to affor help at home.
I guarantee you don't give your all. I guarantee, you give effort to things besides teaching. (I'm going to guess you make a pretty good living and have decent benefits. Even if you chose to go broke working in low paying districts, that is your choice. It's not required.) Saying you give your all is just self pontification. I know a few teachers who come close but they're married to their jobs because they have nothing else in their lives (not a put down, just a statement of fact), but they make good money so I guess they're not dedicated in your definition because they went after the decent paying job.
There is nothing wrong with a teacher wanting and going after decent pay. It's an unfortunate fact of life that some opportunities to achieve that goal will come after September 1st. If that happens, there is no requirement to martyr oneself. There are kids to be taught in the better paying school too and there are teachers out of work who will take the job in the lesser paying school until they too can find something reasonable. At the end of the day, the kids all get taught.
I owe my students a good education while I am their teacher. What I don't owe them is a set amount of time I will remain their teacher. I owe it to them to do this job to the best of my ability while standing in front of the classroom. I owe it to them to do my homework, to be prepared.....to live up to my contract by doing the job I contracted to do. I dont owe it to them to accept, what I consider, unreasonable wages any longer than I have to. For the time being, this is the job I have. I hope to have a better one someday. I'll be teaching a different group of kids then but I'll be teaching a different set of kids in 12 months if I stay where I am. Teachers are not permanent fixtures in kids lives. They are transient and kids move on when teachers do. It's not the issue you make it out to be.
You're a teacher? You have zero understanding of how and where to put commas; it makes reading your posts extremely aggravating.
I consider it unethical for a teacher to leave in the middle of the year just to take a different, higher paying position.
I think it tells the students that money is more important than they are in the eyes of the quitting teacher. That may be true, but it sure isn't a message I would want to be giving the kids.
I wouldn't do it as a teacher. I wouldn't want it done to me, as a student.
On the other hand, some students might welcome a change of teachers, at any time of year. A teacher contemplating this, might consider whether they are really loved by the students or would not be missed at all. When I was in school, there were only nine teachers, out of about 35, who I really liked and would have missed.
Last edited by Steve McDonald; 02-07-2017 at 12:27 AM..
IMO whether you are working in education or not, you do what you have to do whether it is about a spouse getting another job promo, you getting a better deal elsewhere, miserable going to work etc. I'm kind of sick of the whole teacher having to be a saint thing. Kids are resilient. Yes it could be harder for some to get used to a new teacher but they will move on. You need to put yourself first.
Well, while I think that sometimes teachers may need to quit, I wish that they would give the kids some notice. We had a situation where two teachers left after Winter break in the middle of my 5th grade granddaughter's year and the school did not tell us in advance. One was retiring - we thought she would not retire until the end of the school year. The other had a spouse who got a job out of state. The kids came back from break to two new teachers and not only were they new to the school, they were new to teaching. We ended up having to change my granddaughter out of those classes because she has asperger's syndrome and change without notice is just not a good thing. If they had told us before the break, we could have prepared her.
The two new teachers were clueless about how to handle kids like my granddaughter.
An educator who knowingly chooses not to prep students for transition when he or she has students with special needs with known deficits in this specific area is behaving inethically.
Well, while I think that sometimes teachers may need to quit, I wish that they would give the kids some notice. We had a situation where two teachers left after Winter break in the middle of my 5th grade granddaughter's year and the school did not tell us in advance. One was retiring - we thought she would not retire until the end of the school year. The other had a spouse who got a job out of state. The kids came back from break to two new teachers and not only were they new to the school, they were new to teaching. We ended up having to change my granddaughter out of those classes because she has asperger's syndrome and change without notice is just not a good thing. If they had told us before the break, we could have prepared her.
The two new teachers were clueless about how to handle kids like my granddaughter.
That may have been the fault of the school. My dd had a teacher put in her notice only to be escorted off of the property and told not to return. She was not allowed to say good bye to the kids. The school bad mouthed her and said it was unethical for her to quit. IMO what she school did was unethical.
An educator who knowingly chooses not to prep students for transition when he or she has students with special needs with known deficits in this specific area is behaving inethically.
In fairness while that may be great for students with disabilities, I could see other students deliberately throwing in the towel if they know their teacher will end up leaving. I've see that happen with every teacher who has ever ended up leaving while giving kids notice (this wasn't too common though-these were teachers who got promoted for something outside the school). The others who ended up quitting, moving, whatever typically would do it over a break.
I don't think there is ever a clear answer what you should do.
In fairness while that may be great for students with disabilities, I could see other students deliberately throwing in the towel if they know their teacher will end up leaving. I've see that happen with every teacher who has ever ended up leaving while giving kids notice (this wasn't too common though-these were teachers who got promoted for something outside the school). The others who ended up quitting, moving, whatever typically would do it over a break.
I don't think there is ever a clear answer what you should do.
I don't think kids will throw in the towel if the school gives us notice a few days before Winter Break when the teachers are leaving after break. That may be a unique situation, but it is what happened to us.
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). That is, simply not required. What is required is resonable effort. One could say giving your all when you are teaching. That I am committed to my trade. (personally, I put in more effort than I should because I do cut into my ability to meet my family's needs. I need to work on that.) I'm only required to accept low pay to do this job until I can rectify the situation. One nice thing about rectifying the wage situation will be that I will have more time to work on teaching because I'll be able to affor help at home. 
