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The real question is does the test actually measure what children need to know?
My third graders take 5 days worth of standardized tests at the end of the school year. Each test has about 50 multiple choice answers which they answer by bubbling in the answer form.
Even though we practice, and I try hard to monitor the students during testing, every year, without fail, I face this scenario with a couple of students:
Student: (raises hand) I am on question number 37 in my booklet, but only number 33 on my answer sheet.
The student, somehow, has come off track with his bubbling of the answer form. As the teacher, I am not allowed to help the student get back on track by saying anything other than, "Go back and carefully check over your answers". I can't stop and ask, "Did you answer this one? Do you remember answering this one?" That could get me into big time trouble. So, the 8 or 9 year old student is left to figure out where he went wrong. He will possibly get frustrated and just go on with the rest of the test. The results will show where he mis-bubbled, but for the third grader, immediate gratifcation of finishing the test will take over and he won't have to worry about holding up the rest of the class.
My third graders take 5 days worth of standardized tests at the end of the school year. Each test has about 50 multiple choice answers which they answer by bubbling in the answer form.
Even though we practice, and I try hard to monitor the students during testing, every year, without fail, I face this scenario with a couple of students:
Student: (raises hand) I am on question number 37 in my booklet, but only number 33 on my answer sheet.
The student, somehow, has come off track with his bubbling of the answer form. As the teacher, I am not allowed to help the student get back on track by saying anything other than, "Go back and carefully check over your answers". I can't stop and ask, "Did you answer this one? Do you remember answering this one?" That could get me into big time trouble. So, the 8 or 9 year old student is left to figure out where he went wrong. He will possibly get frustrated and just go on with the rest of the test. The results will show where he mis-bubbled, but for the third grader, immediate gratifcation of finishing the test will take over and he won't have to worry about holding up the rest of the class.
I couldn't agree more. If they know they aren't going to do well on the test, then by gawd they're going to be the best at getting done 1st.
Last edited by cebdark; 05-02-2010 at 10:44 AM..
Reason: Just realized other thread was an old one.
Oh I have had it up to here with ST. This really is just a fine whine or a rant and rave, whatever you want to call it. We did end-of-course testing this week and the testing company is like the gestapo. They had a seminar for us about how to administer the test and much of it was thinly veiled threats. If we get caught looking at the test questions, we can be fired. We can be fired for paraphrasing a question for a student or a host of other "sins." None of the teachers can see the questions--unless they read a test for the student and I did quite a lot of that, and I'd even be afraid to post an example of a test question on here for fear of the corporation looking me up--sounds a bit paranoid I know, but these guys are serious and that's the way they talk. I love working with
Then there is the sheer amount of work of tabulating the tests and going thru them to make sure that they are all labeled properly and that nothing suspicious went on and of course the school personnel does that at the taxpayer's expense and you can be sure that none of us gets paid nearly as well as those who work for the testing corporation, b/c this is big, big business and sanctioned by the government. Anyway, I love working with kids but I hate the bureaucratic crap. Rant over, thanks for reading.
I support standardized testing. I understand why things have to be so tight in regards to not helping kids etc.
Where I do feel you is what you said at the end. It is quite ironic that the people who run the testing companies are paid more than the people that actually spend all yearb teaching the material to be tested. I also feel that the state-mandated, private corporation generated test itself is 100% separate from the job of teaching the state standards. They-the ETS people-ought to be the ones administering the tests, not the teachers. They want it done a certain way, bring your people in and do it your way. It's B.S. that we have to go to a training-which is often very brief and insufficient-on how to give the test and if we slip up even once we're faced with harsh consequences. ETS should administer their own test.
I love when we have our testing meeting for the end of year state tests and the administrator hands us all a form that basically says we will not discuss the test with anyone, look at the questions, lose the booklets, etc. or we could lose our licenses. To "agree" you have to sign. Every year some one asks, "What if I choose not to sign? Why should I set myself up for something like this?" The answer is, "Just sign it".
Exactly. Why can't the people that make up the test and want it administered a certain way just do it? No teaching credentialing program includes a course on how to administer ETS tests. Administering ETS tests is not a part of being a teacher. Teachers make up their own tests and administer them how they see fit. If ETS wants to give our kids their test. they should come in and do it. Don't put it on ME to administer YOUR test the way you want it done.
Welcome to the coporate model which should not be anywhere near schools as far as I'm concerned. At all. We can't discuss it - "loose lips sink ships." Therefore, IMHO, schools are left with little recourse but to follow along like a good sheep, or else.
Politicians need to leave education the heck alone as far as I'm concerned. Children shouldn't be raised to be cogs in the wheels of the work force by factory manufacturing their knowledge. When we focus on test, test, test, then it's a natural progression to me that we'll have teachers who fear losing their jobs to the point where they'll simply comply. There is a place for testing, but it should not completely dictate the curriculum as it does now IMO.
I'm fine with politicians leaving education alone. Problem is, understandably, if they leave it alone they're also not going to give us any money. Which is probably also a good thing. You can't go to politicians and ask for money to fund schools, pay teachers etc and then not expect any guidelines or expectations from the funding source.
The real question is does the test actually measure what children need to know? If it does, then there should be no issue with teaching to the test becasuse you will be teaching them what they need to know.
However, what happens is they get taught how to weed out potential wrong answers to increase their chances of guessing the right one rather than being taught the material they need to know to pass the test. The intention of the test was to determine if they knew what they should but I don't think that's what we're testing. I think we're testing how well our students take tests.
I think you're right here. If teaching to the test simply involves teaching kids what they are supposed to know anyway, teaching to the test is a good thing. As far mulitple choice tests go, they seem to do a decent job of devising questions that are comprehensive and require critical thinking.
But, the quality of a testing model that is almost entirely multiple-choice in nature is questionable. Ideally, they would improve the evaluation method to test for a deeper level of understanding across several different mediums ( open response questions, verbal responses etc). But that would cost a lot of money nobody seems to have or is willing to spend.
Politicians are so involved in education with funded, but mostly unfunded mandates, that 80-90% of what education does now is managed directly or indirectly by the government. There is no occupation in the country that is more managed by the government is not the government. And though everyone in education knows that we are a branch of the state and federal governments, most private citizens think that because their tax dollars pay for the school directly, that it is their operation. Many private citizens then blame the actual educators, their unions, and anyone else locally that they can, without any knowledge that they should be blaming their elected officials at the state and federal levels. The local school hasn't been local since about 1974 when the first federal special education laws came into effect.
The answer? Make education funding a more localized process. Meaning, the residents of Town A pay taxes DIRECTLY to the schools in Town A and only to the schools of Town A. The federal and state governments are left out of it. The schools in Town A functionas the taxpaying residents of Town A see fit. There can be differing levels of support based on whetehr or not you have a kid currently enrolled in school or not. Really, it's almsot like a privitization process but it's still publicly funded. Instead of paying taxes to the government, your money goes directly to the schools in your town. You can still have a set of standards all schools should follow. And a report card can still be issued telling the public how well a school did in getting kids to learn those standards. And then people can decide whether or not they want to send their kids to a school.
Politicians are so involved in education with funded, but mostly unfunded mandates, that 80-90% of what education does now is managed directly or indirectly by the government. There is no occupation in the country that is more managed by the government is not the government. And though everyone in education knows that we are a branch of the state and federal governments, most private citizens think that because their tax dollars pay for the school directly, that it is their operation. Many private citizens then blame the actual educators, their unions, and anyone else locally that they can, without any knowledge that they should be blaming their elected officials at the state and federal levels. The local school hasn't been local since about 1974 when the first federal special education laws came into effect.
I agree. This doesn't - see below - help (although I find the admission of being wrong refreshing) I will never buy into schools being successfully operated using the "corporate" (or federal control for that matter) model:
The answer? Make education funding a more localized process. Meaning, the residents of Town A pay taxes DIRECTLY to the schools in Town A and only to the schools of Town A. The federal and state governments are left out of it. The schools in Town A functionas the taxpaying residents of Town A see fit. There can be differing levels of support based on whetehr or not you have a kid currently enrolled in school or not. Really, it's almsot like a privitization process but it's still publicly funded. Instead of paying taxes to the government, your money goes directly to the schools in your town. You can still have a set of standards all schools should follow. And a report card can still be issued telling the public how well a school did in getting kids to learn those standards. And then people can decide whether or not they want to send their kids to a school.
You are not listening. No school could function financially without the federal dollars, and accomplish all the mandates required by law.
What you're saying might have been still possible in 1973. Its impossible now unless the fed go bankrupt.
I agree. I don't think a child should be tested more than once a year - and I certainly don't agree that a child should be tested on material that they've not even seen yetin order to establish a baseline for the end of the year tests. Talk about setting a kid up to fret. Not only that, but what a way to develop the mindset of "Oh, I don't have to worry about getting that right - I'm not supposed to know that yet." I've heard that from more than just my kids.
Oy Vey! Talk about dropping a pellet everytime the mouse rings the bell. This is a perfect example of what I was talking about on your query as to why older kids seem to lack the motivation to study now. I realize there are many other factors, but this is a big one to me.
I am glad to see, however, that our school is no longer diving into the preparathon-like test fests like they were earlier in hopes to take off the pressure. While it's admirable for them to want their kids to not be stressed about a test, I think it does more harm than good.
I say this from the experience of hearing "My stomach hurts!" every morning for 3 weeks before they have an assessment or test of some sort.
They SHOULD have seen all of the material on the test. If they haven't, that's on the teacher.
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This is a perfect example of what I was talking about on your query as to why older kids seem to lack the motivation to study now. I realize there are many other factors, but this is a big one to me.
