Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
That is lame. I think switching them around might be a good idea.
Unfortunately, the concepts are in the right order the way they are. My observation lab is the exciting one because I want them observing as many things as possible. The heating curve of water one is a state CCE. be able to go into the lab and generate that curve. Freezing point depression is about as much fun as watching paint dry too but, at least, you calculate the molecular weight of an unknown.
Now if I could pace faster, we could get to a preciptates lab that is really fun. I remember doing it in high school. Our final was we walked into the room and the teacher handed us two test tubes. Before we left, we had to identify what was in them. There were stations set up around the room for different tests but we had to figure out which ones to do first to get done. Part of your grade was based on how many tests you had to do. If I had two more weeks of school, we'd make it to that one.
Most chemistry labs are designed to teach a concept with the least amount of risk and waste. They're just not designed to be exciting. For most concepts, I can't even think how to make them exciting. Most labs are microscale now to minimize waste so even when you do see something, it's very small.
Last edited by Ivorytickler; 05-16-2010 at 07:01 AM..
Status:
"A fool is only as foolish as the people around him"
(set 22 hours ago)
Location: In the north country fair
4,987 posts, read 10,653,816 times
Reputation: 7800
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivorytickler
Unfortunately, the concepts are in the right order the way they are. My observation lab is the exciting one because I want them observing as many things as possible. The heating curve of water one is a state CCE. be able to go into the lab and generate that curve. Freezing point depression is about as much fun as watching paint dry too but, at least, you calculate the molecular weight of an unknown.
Now if I could pace faster, we could get to a preciptates lab that is really fun. I remember doing it in high school. Our final was we walked into the room and the teacher handed us two test tubes. Before we left, we had to identify what was in them. There were stations set up around the room for different tests but we had to figure out which ones to do first to get done. Part of your grade was based on how many tests you had to do. If I had two more weeks of school, we'd make it to that one.
Most chemistry labs are designed to teach a concept with the least amount of risk and waste. They're just not designed to be exciting. For most concepts, I can't even think how to make them exciting. Most labs are microscale now to minimize waste so even when you do see something, it's very small.
Honestly, I really don't know what you want me to say at this point. When I suggest modifications, you state a bunch of reasons why they won't work. When you suggest your own modifications and I agree with you, you then contradict yourself and state a bunch of reasons why they won't work. You want the students to be more engaged in your classroom but then, you don't want to change anything. You shoot down every idea or possible solution regarding your initial issue, even your own.
You can't change your students. So, you either have to accept that or accept that you need to change your curriculum. But honestly, it sounds more as if you are trying to justify your lessons b/c of criticisms that others (probably your students) have made about them rather than seeking actual advice that will help you resolve the issues in your classroom.
Honestly, I really don't know what you want me to say at this point. When I suggest modifications, you state a bunch of reasons why they won't work. When you suggest your own modifications and I agree with you, you then contradict yourself and state a bunch of reasons why they won't work. You want the students to be more engaged in your classroom but then, you don't want to change anything. You shoot down every idea or possible solution regarding your initial issue, even your own.
You can't change your students. So, you either have to accept that or accept that you need to change your curriculum. But honestly, it sounds more as if you are trying to justify your lessons b/c of criticisms that others (probably your students) have made about them rather than seeking actual advice that will help you resolve the issues in your classroom.
That's usually how brainstorming works. Obviously, you didn't realize that the observation lab is the lab it is because it offers lots of observations. Since observation is taught early in chemistry, that lab belongs early in chemistry. Switching them would mean we'd do the heating curve lab before I teach enthalpy and I'd do the observation lab about 12 labs into the year long after students, hopefully, have learned to do observations.
Now, if you know of an exciting lab for heating curves, let me know. Watching ice melt and water boil is about as much fun as watching paint dry, though the graph usually catches them by surprise. They always come running up to tell me something is wrong because the temperature isn't changing during phase changes and then look at me funny when I tell them it shouldn't.
To the chemistry teachers out there, what are your most exciting labs? And what do you do with boring labs to spice them up?
Mine are the observation lab (an aluminum ball and copper II chloride crystals dissolved in water) and the S'mores lab if I do it. I only do it if I can get the students to bring in the supplies as it costs too much to buy chocolate bars for four classes.
Ivory, don't you have access to people in your school or district to help you learn to be a better teacher? How about other chemistry teachers who you could get together with and brainstorm with, maybe observe some classes, etc. More experienced teachers in any subject area will be able to help you learn how to bridge the gaps in student interests, learning styles, abilities, etc. This is common stuff that teachers have know how to do to be a good teacher and you continually struggle with it. You may need more intensive training/advice/resources than what you will find in a forum like this.
I know many engineers and a few who have gone from engineering to teaching and it usually isn't a smooth transition. Honestly, for the the few I know it is awkward at best. I hate to generalize too much but engineers have 'wiring' that often makes it difficult for them to engage the students in a meaningful way while accomplishing the expected educational goals. Heck, engineers often have trouble engaging co-workers, peers in a regular work environment, or people in general...it's even more of a challenge being a teacher. It's clear that you are struggling in that regard.
Would you consider a professional psychological assessment? It may help reveal to you some blind spots in your personality and thinking, show you where you can improve your relational skills, listening skills, etc. Understanding your 'wiring', knowing your strengths and weaknesses, understanding how you relate to those around you will help you adapt yourself to any setting, social or professional.
Ivory, don't you have access to people in your school or district to help you learn to be a better teacher? How about other chemistry teachers who you could get together with and brainstorm with, maybe observe some classes, etc. More experienced teachers in any subject area will be able to help you learn how to bridge the gaps in student interests, learning styles, abilities, etc. This is common stuff that teachers have know how to do to be a good teacher and you continually struggle with it. You may need more intensive training/advice/resources than what you will find in a forum like this.
I know many engineers and a few who have gone from engineering to teaching and it usually isn't a smooth transition. Honestly, for the the few I know it is awkward at best. I hate to generalize too much but engineers have 'wiring' that often makes it difficult for them to engage the students in a meaningful way while accomplishing the expected educational goals. Heck, engineers often have trouble engaging co-workers, peers in a regular work environment, or people in general...it's even more of a challenge being a teacher. It's clear that you are struggling in that regard.
Would you consider a professional psychological assessment? It may help reveal to you some blind spots in your personality and thinking, show you where you can improve your relational skills, listening skills, etc. Understanding your 'wiring', knowing your strengths and weaknesses, understanding how you relate to those around you will help you adapt yourself to any setting, social or professional.
I'm the only chemistry teacher in my school. I WISH I had access to other teachers. That's why I'm here. I need the input from other teachers who operate under the same conditions I do.
Interesting, according to the princiapals of three high schools I know, they claim it's a very smooth transition from engineering to teaching. They claim we track much faster than the average ed major. They also love the teachers they've hired who are former engineers. I'm not sure what engineers you know but we LOVE to play and that can make things very interesting. What stops me is safety concerns. I'd be having a blast sacrificing gummy bears and running the flaming wheel of death if I could get away with it. I don't know which engineers you know but every one of them I've known is quite capable of making life very interesting....sometimes on purpose If we're nothing else, we're risk takers. I feel like I'm handcuffed in a wooden box in my current position and I don't like it. There's so much I'd love to be doing but can't so I'm looking for input from other teachers in my position. Teachers who deal with classes that are too large to monitor well during labs, who teach in rooms with ceilings too low to do many demos and who have to do the demos they do on the same table students are seated at.
The sad truth is I have more fun in my basement with chemsitry than I can in my classrom because of over crowding and lack of space and equipment. So, I'm looking for ways to spice things up within the constraints I've been given.
Well, maybe you should ask those 3 principals what their teachers (former engineers) do that you aren't doing since your school isn't happy with your failure rate and you seem to be asking the same sorts of questions here repeatedly...generally unwilling to accept that the advice offered could actually apply to you.
I'm going to say it again because I think it could help you, it certainly couldn't hurt....consider a professional psychological assessment. Many (if not the majority) of engineers have specific skills and traits, some of which are well suited for careers in teaching, others diametrically opposed. Until you understand and recognize how those traits manifest in you they may continue to cause you to stumble in your new career. I recognize several of the potentially opposing traits as themes in your threads.
I've probably said more than I should....because I think the chance that you will actually consider it is 10% or less.
Here's little joke for those who aren't used to engineering personality types.
Perhaps it also explains why those who are giving sound advice in this thread (and the others) are often met with negation.
Quote:
Arguing with an Engineer . . is a lot like wrestling in the mud with a pig.
Well, maybe you should ask those 3 principals what their teachers (former engineers) do that you aren't doing since your school isn't happy with your failure rate and you seem to be asking the same sorts of questions here repeatedly...generally unwilling to accept that the advice offered could actually apply to you.
I'm going to say it again because I think it could help you, it certainly couldn't hurt....consider a professional psychological assessment. Many (if not the majority) of engineers have specific skills and traits, some of which are well suited for careers in teaching, others diametrically opposed. Until you understand and recognize how those traits manifest in you they may continue to cause you to stumble in your new career. I recognize several of the potentially opposing traits as themes in your threads.
I've probably said more than I should....because I think the chance that you will actually consider it is 10% or less.
Here's little joke for those who aren't used to engineering personality types.
Perhaps it also explains why those who are giving sound advice in this thread (and the others) are often met with negation.
Do you read my posts? My failure rate is typical for my school. The three principals in question are dealing with a different demographic. They don't have the failure rates we do because they don't have our students so me asking what their teachers do that I don't, really isn't going to help. For starters, the majority of their students are college bound (in one of these schools 96% of students go to a 4 year college and the remainging 4% go to community college. In contrast, most of our students aren't planning on going to college. It's a different world.)
Engineers are, definitely, analytical but we are also optimzers. Education is just a process to be optimized. The trick is to figure out how best to approach the problem because of the many variables. That makes it a cool challenge.
As to not accepting what has been offered, I don't accept it because I don't believe it fits. I'm not going to do something just because someone else thinks it's a good idea knowing the little they know about me and my situation from an internet board. I'll take the ideas that seem a good fit and toss the others back. Mostly, I just come here to vent because I can't IRL. I've taken a few things from this board because they did fit. None were offered by you though. I get the impression that you and I teach in two different worlds.
And yeah, engineers like to debate. Are you really just figuring that out? Debating involves thinking. We tend to like that.
Already been through personality assessments for career purposes. Six of my top nine involve teaching . They say it's my best fit. So far, the biggest difference I see in myself compared to other teachers is I seem to realize there is a problem faster. Most of my classmates are still in the honeymoon phase. I'm long past that.
Do you read my posts? My failure rate is typical for my school. The three principals in question are dealing with a different demographic. They don't have the failure rates we do because they don't have our students so me asking what their teachers do that I don't, really isn't going to help. For starters, the majority of their students are college bound (in one of these schools 96% of students go to a 4 year college and the remainging 4% go to community college. In contrast, most of our students aren't planning on going to college. It's a different world.)
Engineers are, definitely, analytical but we are also optimzers. Education is just a process to be optimized. The trick is to figure out how best to approach the problem because of the many variables. That makes it a cool challenge.
As to not accepting what has been offered, I don't accept it because I don't believe it fits. I'm not going to do something just because someone else thinks it's a good idea knowing the little they know about me and my situation from an internet board. I'll take the ideas that seem a good fit and toss the others back. Mostly, I just come here to vent because I can't IRL. I've taken a few things from this board because they did fit. None were offered by you though. I get the impression that you and I teach in two different worlds.
And yeah, engineers like to debate. Are you really just figuring that out? Debating involves thinking. We tend to like that.
Already been through personality assessments for career purposes. Six of my top nine involve teaching . They say it's my best fit. So far, the biggest difference I see in myself compared to other teachers is I seem to realize there is a problem faster. Most of my classmates are still in the honeymoon phase. I'm long past that.
Yeah, your post proves my point further.
I just wanted to clarify, I didn't suggest a personality assessment, I suggested a complete, professional psychological assessment. A personality assessment may be a small part of the overall assessment but by itself doesn't mean much. Doesn't matter though....you'd probably argue with the psychologist too.
Ivory, I don't know if you've already posted this somewhere, but can you give us an idea of what concepts you cover and what labs you do? Maybe some posters can then recall labs they've done (as students), that were fun, yet educational.
Uhm, why are you a teacher? If you are so enamored of being an engineer (and I am not sure if you are aware of it but you seem to project some disdain for non-engineer teachers) why arent you still one?
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
If we're nothing else, we're risk takers. I feel like I'm handcuffed in a wooden box in my current position and I don't like it. There's so much I'd love to be doing but can't so I'm looking for input from other teachers in my position. Teachers who deal with classes that are too large to monitor well during labs, who teach in rooms with ceilings too low to do many demos and who have to do the demos they do on the same table students are seated at. 
