Should the Texas Legislature Pass a Law to Allow the Open Carrying of Firearms? (Alamo: crime rates, felons)

[TexasRedneck]

It's a crying shame to see that we've allowed ourselves to get to the point that we'll wring our hands over what how MIGHT offend someone by saying "Merry Christmas", yet not think twice about denying someone their ability to exercise a Constitutional right. We worry over extending "free speech" to include comments on electronic media, yet try to say "these weapons weren't invented yet". In their day, private ownership of cannons (THE weapon of Mass Destruction during their day) was not only routine, it wasn't even worthy of comment.
Sorry - but to me, a Right is a Right. In my mind you have the legal right to carry a weapon in any form/fashion you so desire. The legal system is there to deal with those who misuse/abuse the rights. For me, I know that there's not a cop sitting on my shoulder waiting to protect me, so it's my responsibility alone. Allow me the tools with which to do it!

[harleytexas]

Another fun idea is to be in a shootout because everyone wants to be John Wayne and maybe not know what is going on in that situation and kills or wounds people because they are shooting the wrong people, but that's ok, the responsible people that got shot will be happy knowing they died for the right to become the wild west again.

I hope the survivors have health care, because we all know that only wasteful people don't have it......bangs head.

[TexasRedneck]

My friend, statements such as yours readily identify those who don't have guns, or don't routinely carry them. There are guns carried around in our society daily, and you aren't even aware of it. Those that would open carry are typically doing so because there's no readily available method for them to conceal carry. Texas presents some unique challenges to those carrying a sidearm - heat. It's very difficult to carry a firearm concealed in the high summer temperatures, so open carry provides an option to remain armed.
Believe me - a criminal won't carry what the rules/laws are - and being able to open carry provides the one real chance that the law-abiding have to be able to defend themselves. Since 1996, Texas citizens have easily proved themselves capable of the necessary discrimination to know when to safely utilize their sidearms - I have no doubt they can continue to do so with Open Carry.

[majormadmax]

Agreed, those comments only show how uninformed some people are about the number of Texans (~300,000) who have concealed carry licenses and who are not only much more law-abiding than their non-carrying counterparts (per DPS (http://www.txdps.state.tx.us/administration/crime_records/chl/convrates.htm - broken link), in 2007 CHL holders were responsible for only 0.26% of the crimes tracked while making up ~1.2% of the total population), but who are also very aware of both the moral and legal ramifications of lethal force.

Honestly, it's those who don't carry that you should be worried about, as they are the ones that are almost six times more likely to commit crime!

But please point out where in the Constitution that health care is a right. I have it for both myself and my family, but I work and pay for it. I don't know why some people expect it for free...

[TexasReb]

Originally Posted by harleytexas

Another fun idea is to be in a shootout because everyone wants to be John Wayne and maybe not know what is going on in that situation and kills or wounds people because they are shooting the wrong people, but that's ok, the responsible people that got shot will be happy knowing they died for the right to become the wild west again.

This is just ridiculous. But on a related tangent here, were people safer back in the so-called "Wild West" days, or on the streets of today? Really, Hollywood aside, the idea that everyone openly carried a gun on their hips back then is just that...a "western movie" myth.

But anyway, the histronics, hyperbole, and outright falsehoods perpetuated by the anti-personal self defense crowd (and the "Brady Bunch") is almost amusing if didn't -- in reality -- mean people getting seriously injured/ killed..but legislated out of their right to protect themselves (and their loved ones, and property).

If you knew anything about it at all, you would know that the stats are clear in that in every single instance where either concealed or open carry has been passed, then the rates of stranger on stranger attacks (which is the real indicator of just how dangerous a given area is to live) has, at worst, remained constant. But it most cases, it has declined.

And also, your theatrics in the opening sentence not withstanding about people wanting to be John Wayne, it is also shown by the most extensive studies ever done, that an innocent person is noteably more likely to be killed by a law-enforcement officer, than an armed civilian.

The reason? It is really just common-sense. Often, when a police officer arrives on the scene of what has only been dispatched to them as a "burglary in progress" or a "unknown trouble" situation, the cop comes upon the scene with limited knowledge (thru no fault of his/her own). The classic example is the police officer who, upon arriving on the scene in the night-time, sees a guy with a gun. The officer orders stop, the guy turns with the gun, and get shot.

It turns out to be a mistake. The guy shot was the homeowner who had just been burglarized, and was chasing the criminal. He turned with the gun -- scared anyway, instinctively -- and the officer shot him, not knowing who was who, or what was what...s/he (officer) just believed their own safety, understandably, was in danger.

On the other hand, when armed civilians are attacked/accosted/burglarized/etc by scum -- or they find themselves in an armed robbery situation -- there is not so much ambiguity as to who the bad guy is.

Bottom line is, again, one is much more likely to be the mistake of deadly force by a law enforcement officer than by an armed civilian. Read the Kleck studies.

Just another way to have people talk about something that should never have been part of the constitution in the first place. Guns because they are part of the constitution are a right, and important, but not health care. Sigh.

How sad an outlook.

The reason for the Second Amendment is that the armed citizen is necessary for the security of a free people. It is the ultimate check on a tyrannical government. That is what the whole Bill of Rights is about. Those things intrinsic to a free people and free state.

On the other hand, "health care" is not an inherent right because it imposes an obligation on others to provide it. Involving finances, time, and countless other aspects.

Question: If there were no doctors, would health care still be a "right"?

Anyway, my intention is not to argue one way or another "health care". Hell, at my age, I worry about the costs as much as anybody, and there are other threads for that one.

No, it is to dispute the ludicrous assertion -- based on the intentions and understandings of the Founding Fathers and the Bill of Rights --that "Affordable Health Care" is a necessary component for a free people...but that the right to protect oneself and their country from tyranny should never have been included?

Let's see. One reads:

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

Should this (hypothetical) one have been added in its stead?:

The health of a free people, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to affordable health care shall be provided by physicians within these United States.

[Marine Forever]

If Texas allowed Open Carry of firearms I firmly believe the criminal element would be greatly intimidated and more reluctant to commit crimes against law abiding citizens who do carry.

Of all states, I am amazed that Texas does not allow Open Carry. I believe this law should be changed, the sooner the better.

[TX75007]

Originally Posted by harleytexas

Another fun idea is to be in a shootout because everyone wants to be John Wayne and maybe not know what is going on in that situation and kills or wounds people because they are shooting the wrong people, but that's ok, the responsible people that got shot will be happy knowing they died for the right to become the wild west again.

I hope the survivors have health care, because we all know that only wasteful people don't have it......bangs head.

You must have been one of the same people who said that CCW would lead to shoot outs in the street - rivers of blood.

OK? Ten plus years later.... can you tell me...

Where are the rivers of blood?

[UTHORNS96]

I realize this thread is as old as dirt. But I don't believe in any civilians carrying openly for multiple reasons.

[jeremy2788]

I am fine with Concealed, but I do not personally approve of open carry.

I think it's arrogant and it takes away element of surprise.

[majormadmax]

Originally Posted by UTHORNS96

I realize this thread is as old as dirt. But I don't believe in any civilians carrying openly for multiple reasons.

Care to explain why?