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Unread 11-04-2007, 06:55 AM
 
Location: Chambers County
366 posts, read 966,758 times
Reputation: 148
Farmers Branch in the D-FW metroplex is overwhelmed with illeagls. In fact, the whole D-FW area is just as Mexican as Houston and San Antonio is. Its time to change the state name back to Tejas...

 
Unread 11-04-2007, 07:08 AM
 
9,630 posts, read 9,959,528 times
Reputation: 4758
Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesAbilene View Post
Sorry, I grew up in the Panhandle. All of my government/history books and the Texas Almanacs of the 50's and 60's stated that the Panhandle, socially and culturally, was more Midwestern than Southern or Western--even if they are not Midwestern geographically. I stand by my statement but agree that the Panhandle is on the southern end of the Great Plains.
You have a good point here. I remember taking a course on Texas history back in college and the text book had a map in it showing the migration patterns of settlers coming into the state. The upper Panhandle (generally north of and possibly including Amarillo) showed that, unlike the rest of the state which was overwhelmingly dominated by Southerners, that newcomer to this area had a heavy influx of those from the Lower Midwest (Kansas, and southern parts of Illinois, Indiana and Ohio). And also, I have seen the results of sociological surveys which showed that residents of the same upper Panhandle area tended to identify more with the Midwest than with the South (which was the majority regional affliliation expressed elsewhere in Texas, other than the trans-pecos which expectedly went with West). Well, perhaps, if I recall correctly, maybe not MORE, but "Midwest" as the answer to the question "What region of the country do you live in" was high enough to be an anomoly compared to the rest of Texas.

Still, I very much agree with BlueSkies as to making certain distinctions. That is, if by Midwest one means Iowa, Illinois, Ohio, etc, then no, the Panhandle isn't part of it. If on the other hand, "Great Plains" is meant, then there is definitely something to that.

Concerning your earlier post -- if I read correctly -- about West Texas (as in Abilene, Lubbock, Odessa, etc, not the El Paso extension) being something between South and Southwest, I agree. Noting particularly that the "Southern" elements of West Texas are often ignored and/or not even thought of when considering cultural aspects of the region. In fact, it was settlers from the Upper South (Arkansas, Tennessee, North Carolina) who first came to the area. There is a large hispanic population today which gives it more of a southwestern connection, and the topography of the land is definitely southwestern. Still, the speech, the dominance of the Southern Baptist Church, voting patterns, etc, speak strongly of its basic Southern roots.
 
Unread 11-04-2007, 11:00 AM
 
Location: 77059
7,593 posts, read 16,333,759 times
Reputation: 3528
Quote:
Originally Posted by southeasttexas View Post
Farmers Branch in the D-FW metroplex is overwhelmed with illeagls. In fact, the whole D-FW area is just as Mexican as Houston and San Antonio is. Its time to change the state name back to Tejas...

The whole DFW area still seems a hell of a lot more WASPy than any of the large metro areas in the south half of Texas. Maybe because it is more strongly segregated.
 
Unread 01-30-2009, 11:26 AM
 
1 posts, read 1,026 times
Reputation: 10
well im from dallas tx and to me dallas and over east is southern.... fort worth and over west is western. So texas is split between the two. I know my family have a strong southern accent and we have soul food down home southern cookin. howver my friend is from lubbock and he does not have an accent or have southern cookin in his life. So texas to me is split. Dallas, Houston, and east texas have strong southern influence.
 
Unread 01-30-2009, 12:02 PM
 
56 posts, read 174,105 times
Reputation: 36
Texas, due to it's size and proximity, could literally be considered both.

However, if you split the state into four directional regions (North, South, East, West), you might could put East & South Texas with "the South" and North & West Texas with "the West" but it's pretty subjective.
 
Unread 01-30-2009, 12:08 PM
 
9,630 posts, read 9,959,528 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by creoleintexas View Post
well im from dallas tx and to me dallas and over east is southern.... fort worth and over west is western. So texas is split between the two. I know my family have a strong southern accent and we have soul food down home southern cookin. howver my friend is from lubbock and he does not have an accent or have southern cookin in his life. So texas to me is split. Dallas, Houston, and east texas have strong southern influence.
LOL Oh man, NOW you have done it. We will be here all night long!

Just kiddin' CIT.

Seriously, this subject has been so oft discussed/debated/beaten to death that most of us here just agree to disagree on Texas' regional affliliation. And agree Texas is Texas!

You have your die-hard "Texas is essentially Southern" folk (like me), and those who say is is mostly Western. And all sorts of opinions in between. And lots of good reasons for all so offered..

Welcome to the Texas forum.
 
Unread 01-30-2009, 09:11 PM
 
11 posts, read 12,108 times
Reputation: 13
Well, it depends on where you live in texas. East Texas(piney woods) is where most texas "southernfolk" are, and anywhere west of Austin is the West(cowboy hat wearing, ranching people) in my mind.
 
Unread 01-31-2009, 03:35 PM
 
84 posts, read 137,099 times
Reputation: 44
I have often thought of the answer to the question of whether TX is a southern, a western, or a southwestern state.
Of course, I HAVE to break TX down into regions and distinct cultural classifications.

Regionally, the piney woods of east Texas are more characteristic of Texas as a southern state. I would call the dividing line between this southern section and the rest of TX as everything east of I-45 between Houston and Dallas. Houston itself would be distinctly southern-influenced, but I understand that it is so cosmopolitan these days that it has its' own identity almost separate from Texas itself. (I have often joked with friends that Hoston is the "Gotham City" of Texas! LOL!) Dallas itself does feel more western than Houston, and I would have to characterize it as western (i.e. having the state fair of TX and more TX symbols and pride in comparison). This is not to knock Houston, b/c I beleive it to be a great city -- I grew up there.

Everything west of I-45 to I-35 (I-35 is the hwy between Laredo, San Antonio and Dallas) I would have to characterize as a mix of southern and western. The original settlers of TX (mostly from the south) settled all the way west to Austin. But it is also western because the "cowboy" culture was born there. The american cowboy was born in Texas after the civil war because of the huge availability of free roaming cattle and the influence of the Mexican "vaquero" and what americans took from the vaquero and made their own. All of the cattle drives from Texas originated in central and west Texas.

Finally, I would characterize everything west of I-35 as being exclusively western. Cattle ranching and the cowboy culture are prevalent here, and the spanish influence is felt more.

To complicate matters more, I would have to classify part of the "western" part of Texas as "southwestern" i.e. the part of the state that has a spanish/mexican historical influence. To me this is clearly San Antonio, and everything westward of I-35, but south of I-10 (includes El Paso).

Being a native of Amarillo, I cannot possibly call the panhandle "southern" for a couple of reasons. First, cattle ranching reighns here, and second, the accent of the natives is more western than southern.

What are everyone's thoughts?
 
Unread 01-31-2009, 04:13 PM
 
9,630 posts, read 9,959,528 times
Reputation: 4758
Quote:
Originally Posted by TXSooner View Post
I have often thought of the answer to the question of whether TX is a southern, a western, or a southwestern state.
Of course, I HAVE to break TX down into regions and distinct cultural classifications.

Regionally, the piney woods of east Texas are more characteristic of Texas as a southern state. I would call the dividing line between this southern section and the rest of TX as everything east of I-45 between Houston and Dallas. Houston itself would be distinctly southern-influenced, but I understand that it is so cosmopolitan these days that it has its' own identity almost separate from Texas itself. (I have often joked with friends that Hoston is the "Gotham City" of Texas! LOL!) Dallas itself does feel more western than Houston, and I would have to characterize it as western (i.e. having the state fair of TX and more TX symbols and pride in comparison). This is not to knock Houston, b/c I beleive it to be a great city -- I grew up there.

Everything west of I-45 to I-35 (I-35 is the hwy between Laredo, San Antonio and Dallas) I would have to characterize as a mix of southern and western. The original settlers of TX (mostly from the south) settled all the way west to Austin. But it is also western because the "cowboy" culture was born there. The american cowboy was born in Texas after the civil war because of the huge availability of free roaming cattle and the influence of the Mexican "vaquero" and what americans took from the vaquero and made their own. All of the cattle drives from Texas originated in central and west Texas.

Finally, I would characterize everything west of I-35 as being exclusively western. Cattle ranching and the cowboy culture are prevalent here, and the spanish influence is felt more.

To complicate matters more, I would have to classify part of the "western" part of Texas as "southwestern" i.e. the part of the state that has a spanish/mexican historical influence. To me this is clearly San Antonio, and everything westward of I-35, but south of I-10 (includes El Paso).

Being a native of Amarillo, I cannot possibly call the panhandle "southern" for a couple of reasons. First, cattle ranching reighns here, and second, the accent of the natives is more western than southern.

What are everyone's thoughts?[/
To be honest, that perhaps this topic should be made a "sub-forum" along with the different cities...? LOL

And really, perhaps it should....? That way, those (like me) who enjoy discussing/debating regional/cultural studies...especially as applies to Texas...can do so. Because, yes, Texas regional affiliation is a very interesting subject, and one that will forever remain tied to the state's uniqueness. And also remain ever debatable.

And those who don't -- or are just purely burnt out on the topic (which even the most interested are, in some ways! LOL) -- don't have to deal with it. If that makes sense.

TXSooner? To me, Texas is essentially Southern. Even most of West Texas -- IMHO -- is more Southern than not in terms of history and outlook (that is, when stacked up to the Rocky Moutain and Interior SW states). Which only makes sense as it was southeastern settlers who did the settling. Of course, the physical environment -- much different that east of the 98th parallel, and removed a bit from the immediate devastation of the "Civil War"...transformed the breed into something very unique. Yet it was still Southern in essence.

For instannce, the prototype of the Texas cowboy was the Old South cattle drover, not the Mexican vaquero. As to speech and dialect? Texas easily falls within the range of what is classified as Southern American English...and this according to the most extensive and recent ever done on the subject. There is not really any such thing as a "western accent" which can be associated with the vast majority of Texas.

Anyway, since this subject will never die (and in many ways, no reason it should) why not make it a seperate sub-forum? Perhaps..?

With all that said though, TXSooner, you make some very good points on the subject!

Last edited by TexasReb; 01-31-2009 at 04:51 PM..
 
Unread 01-31-2009, 04:18 PM
 
Location: Central Texas
15,352 posts, read 19,754,015 times
Reputation: 10783
Quote:
Originally Posted by TXSooner View Post
I have often thought of the answer to the question of whether TX is a southern, a western, or a southwestern state.
Of course, I HAVE to break TX down into regions and distinct cultural classifications.

Regionally, the piney woods of east Texas are more characteristic of Texas as a southern state. I would call the dividing line between this southern section and the rest of TX as everything east of I-45 between Houston and Dallas. Houston itself would be distinctly southern-influenced, but I understand that it is so cosmopolitan these days that it has its' own identity almost separate from Texas itself. (I have often joked with friends that Hoston is the "Gotham City" of Texas! LOL!) Dallas itself does feel more western than Houston, and I would have to characterize it as western (i.e. having the state fair of TX and more TX symbols and pride in comparison). This is not to knock Houston, b/c I beleive it to be a great city -- I grew up there.

Everything west of I-45 to I-35 (I-35 is the hwy between Laredo, San Antonio and Dallas) I would have to characterize as a mix of southern and western. The original settlers of TX (mostly from the south) settled all the way west to Austin. But it is also western because the "cowboy" culture was born there. The american cowboy was born in Texas after the civil war because of the huge availability of free roaming cattle and the influence of the Mexican "vaquero" and what americans took from the vaquero and made their own. All of the cattle drives from Texas originated in central and west Texas.

Finally, I would characterize everything west of I-35 as being exclusively western. Cattle ranching and the cowboy culture are prevalent here, and the spanish influence is felt more.

To complicate matters more, I would have to classify part of the "western" part of Texas as "southwestern" i.e. the part of the state that has a spanish/mexican historical influence. To me this is clearly San Antonio, and everything westward of I-35, but south of I-10 (includes El Paso).

Being a native of Amarillo, I cannot possibly call the panhandle "southern" for a couple of reasons. First, cattle ranching reighns here, and second, the accent of the natives is more western than southern.

What are everyone's thoughts?


What are my thoughts? I think this is a pretty fair analysis, actually, having been born and raised in East Texas, and lived in Dallas and Central Texas (and visited most of the rest of the state at some point or other over the last 60 years).
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