What do you hate the most: The Texas property taxes or the toll roads? (San Antonio: real estate, rental)

[EDS_]

Originally Posted by lonestar2007

Aw gee, the OP just asked a simple question and got some simple answers and then here comes the inevitable, the holier than thou, know it all who just has to get on their high horse and deliver a sermon to the poor uninformed, ignorant folks who have no clue (unlike you) as to how the system works. lol You really need to lighten up.

Not so much the OP's question because I can't tell where s/he is coming from. But a surprising number people are profoundly ignorant about how low the overall state+local aggregate tax burden is in Texas. Some people note our higher than average property taxes and whine about them while missing the bigger picture entirely.

[hound 109]

Originally Posted by stan4

Not really upset about either. Better than income tax, IMO.

This is my take as well. Both of these expenses can be easily lowered by me (unlike the Federal Income tax or my Health Insurance premium....which are both controlled or required at the Federal Level).

- I can avoid toll fees (obviously) by avoiding toll roads.

- I can significantly lower my property tax by moving to a lower tax area & to a lower priced home. (& I will). I currently choose to pay higher property taxes so my kid can attend a private school quality school track (since the ISD tax is the bulk of the overall property tax bill). Once he graduates HS, I'll choose to scale back on our home (significantly) which will lower my property taxes (significantly).

Unlike the Federal Income tax (& forced health insurance), I derive direct benefit from the property taxes I pay. (local money used to fix local roads, update local parks and educate local kids etc, etc.) I prefer to have my taxes confiscated locally (so I can look my representative in the eye) as opposed to Federal taxes, which aside from our armed forces, the national park service & upkeep of our interstates...I derive minimal benefit from.

Local toll fees are user fees (if you don't use, you don't pay), and local property taxes are both spent locally (if one doesn't like the way it's spent, boot your local politician out). But Federal taxes and forced Health Insurance premiums is re-distributing my meager income & assets that I worked for to those who may or may not be less fortunate.

[Trainwreck20]

and local property taxes are both spent locally

Pretty much, except around 20-25 percent (and rising) of AISD school taxes are redistributed via Robin Hood to other districts.

[PCALMike]

One thing that is annoying about property taxes is this idea that one never really owns the home, just rent it from the government and it is not related to income or financial wealth of the person. What do you think about that? Me personally, I prefer sales taxes or income taxes over property taxes.

[lonestar2007]

Since the OP only asked about the two things (toll roads and property taxes) I chose property taxes as the one more 'pesky' to me. By being more 'pesky' I did not say there should be no property taxes. So why does a lesson on taxes and how economical structure is based seem to be warranted?

I didn't feel the need to go into detail (i.e. I'm not affected personally by the toll roads n my present situation, etc.).

There was no question regarding state income tax (which btw I'm happy we don't have) in the OP, so I did not refer to it. There was no question about the mandatory enforced health care (which btw, I am dead set against), so I did not refer to it.

As to the property tax, sometimes it seems enough is never enough. This is just my humble opinion and I am not asking anyone to agree with me. It sounds simple enough to confront your local politician and if you don't like how he's doing things then boot him out. The truth is, it's not that simple.

I remember when Texas was trying to get the lottery passed. Ah, the glowing promises of how the money generated off of it would reduce property taxes significantly. Yep, that was the politician's top plug. Well, they got it passed and years ago and we're still waiting on all that revenue to help out on the property taxes. Uh huh, soon as they got their lottery, they forgot all about that promise, but I don't think that came as a surprise to anyone.

Originally Posted by PCALMike

One thing that is annoying about property taxes is this idea that one never really owns the home, just rent it from the government and it is not related to income or financial wealth of the person. What do you think about that? Me personally, I prefer sales taxes or income taxes over property taxes.

Yep, you'd be surprised at the number of people who think once their house is paid for in full, they owned it. They want to keep owning it, they will keep their taxes paid. To reiterate for those always ready to jump, I know economics and I know the gives and takes to make the system work to provide us with our way of life, so I'm not advocating no taxes at all. Even so, I sometimes have to fall back on the when is enough enough question.

This is getting much deeper than I ever intended it to be, but since it is and since the question of home ownership was brought up, let me ask you, what do you think the United States is putting up for collateral against the ever growing debt to China? Kinda makes you rethink these words "this land is my land, this land is your land" to the old song we all learned as children.

Oops, I better add (since I can hear it coming already) yes, I realize the U.S. has loans out as well. Hope this helps in the keeping the stump jumping down.

Wow, now I'm way off topic here. So, going back to the OP's original question, I'm sticking with property taxes as my answer.

[KathrynAragon]

Originally Posted by stan4

Not really upset about either.
Better than income tax, IMO.

Bingo.

And though the property tax RATES are higher than the national average, the actual amounts are about averages since our housing costs tend to be so reasonable.

I mean, would you rather pay 3 percent of $200,000 or 2 percent of $400,000, for the same home basically?

[KathrynAragon]

Originally Posted by PCALMike

One thing that is annoying about property taxes is this idea that one never really owns the home, just rent it from the government and it is not related to income or financial wealth of the person. What do you think about that? Me personally, I prefer sales taxes or income taxes over property taxes.

Can you tell me where in the US you WON'T have to pay property taxes?

[Trainwreck20]

Originally Posted by KathrynAragon

Can you tell me where in the US you WON'T have to pay property taxes?

As far as I can tell, every state has some property tax, although the median property tax on several are less than $1,000 per year - Arkansas, Louisiana, Alabama, West Virginia, and South Carolina (based on a quick search). For comparison, the median tax paid on a home in Texas is $2,510. This is less than many states (even ones with lower rates): Rhode Island, Vermont, Wisconsin, Connecticut, New Hampshire, Illinois, and New Jersey, to name a few.

Of course, median incomes are higher in many of those places, too, so it isn't a completely accurate comparison.

For maybe a closer comparison, I would start by comparing to other states with no income tax:
Alaska, Florida, Nevada, South Dakota, Washington, and Wyoming. New Hampshire and Tennessee don't tax earnings, but do tax some investment income.

[testmo]

I knew the math but guess never saw the number. My father hit 65 and I saw his property tax bill fall from $5000+ to $726. If you cant afford that at retirement you cant afford retirement. He didnt downsize and lives in an upper middle class golf oriented MPC

[lonestar2007]

Originally Posted by testmo

I knew the math but guess never saw the number. My father hit 65 and I saw his property tax bill fall from $5000+ to $726. If you cant afford that at retirement you cant afford retirement. He didnt downsize and lives in an upper middle class golf oriented MPC

I was under the impression your taxes were locked in when you reached age 65, but not necessarily lowered. I don't know why I thought this, maybe from hearing something about it at some time or other. In short, I don't know exactly how it works, except you do get a break on them when you reach 65.

I would think each county would have their own protocol in how they operate on this. Does anyone know? Could be some appraisal districts might be more generous than others? Regardless, testmo, it is fortunate for your father that it worked out so well for him. That is a big difference.