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Old 03-29-2017, 05:28 PM
 
Location: Wonderland
67,654 posts, read 60,315,731 times
Reputation: 101015

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Quote:
Originally Posted by IC_deLight View Post
The "fee" is not going to the HOA corporation. It is a windfall fee that the management companies receive. This is really about capping rent-seeking windfall fees charged by HOA industry management companies. This industry group opposes disclosure unless they can sell the information. There is no reason for the information to be hidden or provided only behind firewalls that existing property owners have access to. If the house is an "investment" then the information should be freely provided no differently than a prospectus.

LOL our $125 a year fee doesn't go to any HOA corporation or management company. It simply goes into a bank account and mowing, signage, etc are paid out of that account. We have a financial meeting once a year and then everyone (there are about 200 houses in our neighborhood) gets a copy of the financial statement. It's very unremarkable and actually very boring.
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Old 03-30-2017, 02:07 AM
 
3,423 posts, read 4,419,241 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KathrynAragon View Post
LOL our $125 a year fee doesn't go to any HOA corporation or management company. It simply goes into a bank account and mowing, signage, etc are paid out of that account. We have a financial meeting once a year and then everyone (there are about 200 houses in our neighborhood) gets a copy of the financial statement. It's very unremarkable and actually very boring.
The fee you are talking about ("assessment") does go to the HOA corporation.

The assessment is separate and apart from the "disclosure fee" the other poster was referring to. The "disclosure fee" is a fee the management company charges for copies of information required by statute.
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Old 03-30-2017, 07:25 AM
 
Location: Wonderland
67,654 posts, read 60,315,731 times
Reputation: 101015
Quote:
Originally Posted by IC_deLight View Post
The fee you are talking about ("assessment") does go to the HOA corporation.

The assessment is separate and apart from the "disclosure fee" the other poster was referring to. The "disclosure fee" is a fee the management company charges for copies of information required by statute.
All I can tell you is this, about our HOA (also applies to several other HOAs we've had in the past in other neighborhoods in this area):

All fees go directly into a checking account and are used throughout the year for maintenance of common areas. There is a thorough accounting of all fees collected and this information is given to all residents. If the HOA is a "corporation," it's sure not a wealthy one.

Our HOA does not charge a "disclosure fee." The bylaws are short, there's been no legal action against the HOA ever, and these bylaws are generally just uploaded with the listing information and given to prospective buyers when a house is listed.

Our local title companies have the bylaws and other information on most local HOAs even if the realtors don't have them. I do not recall ever paying a fee at closing (or before -or any time) to receive HOA information.

See what I mean about many different variations of HOAs?
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Old 03-30-2017, 08:21 AM
 
185 posts, read 420,901 times
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Thanks for the input on deed restrictions ICdelight. I am "lucky" to be looking for an older home that needs renovation, so I am going to limit our search to no HOA for now. We are quiet and neighborly, but definitely do not like anyone sticking their nose in our business - probably better suited to life outside of the DFW metroplex. However, we still have a child in high school, and our lives were spent in convenience/traffic/small lot suburbia, so moving out to remote areas will have to wait, as it would be too much of an adjustment. Kathy - I have my sights set on your Chandler area for retirement (if we get there someday, lol)
Hoping for the best as our arrival coincides with the "hottest" market timing - summer!!! I am stubbornly choosing to believe that I will find something in an area that can still be decent on its own...found one area to be good on the advice of WorldKlas, who posts here. I could never consider some of the areas that people on these boards frequently suggest. I don't buy into the "best schools" thing and wouldn't buy a shack in a top district just to be there...forget HOAs, can't wait not to be "governed" by school zoning as well. I suspect I will be crying when I am an empty nester - as it won't be long...grass is always greener!
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Old 03-30-2017, 05:51 PM
 
3,423 posts, read 4,419,241 times
Reputation: 3633
Quote:
Originally Posted by KathrynAragon View Post
All I can tell you is this, about our HOA (also applies to several other HOAs we've had in the past in other neighborhoods in this area):

All fees go directly into a checking account and are used throughout the year for maintenance of common areas. There is a thorough accounting of all fees collected and this information is given to all residents. If the HOA is a "corporation," it's sure not a wealthy one.
You should know whether your property is actually burdened by an involuntary membership HOA or not and what the organizational form of the entity is. Do you know the name of the HOA? You can perform a search Secretary of State's office if you want to find the organizational form of the entity you are dealing with.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KathrynAragon View Post
Our HOA does not charge a "disclosure fee." The bylaws are short, there's been no legal action against the HOA ever, and these bylaws are generally just uploaded with the listing information and given to prospective buyers when a house is listed.
Well that could change later today.
If you have an involuntary membership HOA, a prospective lot purchaser can ask for "subdivision information" which includes the information you refer to plus a resale certificate. There is no regulation on the fee charged for a resale certificate. This subdivision information in Texas is similar to the disclosure documents the AZ poster was talking about for Arizona. Management companies and/or the HOA often charge an arm and a leg for these documents - or they'll claim to provide it at one price on a timeframe that isn't really feasible such that requesters have to pay yet another fee, an "expedite fee" to the management company on top of the subdivision information fee in order to get the information on a timely basis.

As a practical matter the information should be available prior to a buyer making an offer and not only after the buyer has invested money in inspections, due diligence, etc.


Quote:
Originally Posted by KathrynAragon View Post
Our local title companies have the bylaws and other information on most local HOAs even if the realtors don't have them. I do not recall ever paying a fee at closing (or before -or any time) to receive HOA information.

See what I mean about many different variations of HOAs?
You probably didn't examine the closing documents closely enough to realize whether a fee was paid or not. Regardless of whether you requested it or not, the title company is going to request the resale certificate information. The title company is insuring title and wants to limit its liability. So if the parties don't request it the title company requests the resale certificate in order to get a statement of how much money is allegedly owed. The HOA is bound by what is stated in the resale certificate.

You might want to familiarize yourself with Texas Property Code §207 entitled "Disclosure of Information by Property Owners Associations".... Note the title "disclosure of information" - same topic as the AZ poster's post. Note 207.003(c) concerning the charging of a fee for the disclosure. This statute and much of the HOA legislation was crafted by the lobbyists employed by the HOA management companies. What they perceive as "reasonable" is often not reasonable from the prospective buyer's or owners' perspective. I haven't seen the AZ legislation but it is either trying to reign in predatory management companies or to essentially offer no protection to consumers from the fees management companies try to bilk.
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Old 03-30-2017, 08:36 PM
 
Location: Wonderland
67,654 posts, read 60,315,731 times
Reputation: 101015
Quote:
Originally Posted by IC_deLight View Post
Quote:
You should know whether your property is actually burdened by an involuntary membership HOA or not and what the organizational form of the entity is. Do you know the name of the HOA? You can perform a search Secretary of State's office if you want to find the organizational form of the entity you are dealing with.
It's completely voluntary because no one is forcing anyone to buy a house in this beautiful, well maintained, convenient neighborhood. If you want the advantages of the neighborhood as well as the HOA, come on - if not, no worries, see ya later.

Quote:
If you have an involuntary membership HOA, a prospective lot purchaser can ask for "subdivision information" which includes the information you refer to plus a resale certificate. There is no regulation on the fee charged for a resale certificate. This subdivision information in Texas is similar to the disclosure documents the AZ poster was talking about for Arizona. Management companies and/or the HOA often charge an arm and a leg for these documents - or they'll claim to provide it at one price on a timeframe that isn't really feasible such that requesters have to pay yet another fee, an "expedite fee" to the management company on top of the subdivision information fee in order to get the information on a timely basis.
Much ado about nothing when it comes to our HOA. No fees for the HOA information at all. No problem getting the information either. It simply wasn't an issue. Our realtor got it for us as soon as we asked for it and just emailed it over.

By the way, we have no lots for sale in the neighborhood. It's an established neighborhood with no vacant lots at all.

Quote:
As a practical matter the information should be available prior to a buyer making an offer and not only after the buyer has invested money in inspections, due diligence, etc.
We got it as soon as we asked for it, which was well within the option period and before any inspections. In fact, it might have even been before the offer was accepted - I'm nearly positive it was.

Quote:
You probably didn't examine the closing documents closely enough to realize whether a fee was paid or not.
Yes, I did. There was no fee.

Quote:
You might want to familiarize yourself with Texas Property Code §207 entitled "Disclosure of Information by Property Owners Associations"....
I'm already familiar with that statute but thanks anyway. I'm not concerned. Very pleased with our HOA.
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Old 03-30-2017, 08:38 PM
 
Location: Wonderland
67,654 posts, read 60,315,731 times
Reputation: 101015
Quote:
Originally Posted by eileen824 View Post
Kathy - I have my sights set on your Chandler area for retirement (if we get there someday, lol)
We love Chandler! Come on! Hope you'll love it too.
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Old 03-31-2017, 07:53 AM
 
3,423 posts, read 4,419,241 times
Reputation: 3633
Quote:
Originally Posted by KathrynAragon View Post
It's completely voluntary because no one is forcing anyone to buy a house in this beautiful, well maintained, convenient neighborhood. If you want the advantages of the neighborhood as well as the HOA, come on - if not, no worries, see ya later.
It's involuntary and the choice in much of the state boils down to which involuntary membership HOA one would be stuck with.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KathrynAragon View Post
Much ado about nothing when it comes to our HOA. No fees for the HOA information at all. No problem getting the information either. It simply wasn't an issue. Our realtor got it for us as soon as we asked for it and just emailed it over.
The real estate agent's provision to you is not binding on the organization and likely consisted of only some of the documents.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KathrynAragon View Post
By the way, we have no lots for sale in the neighborhood. It's an established neighborhood with no vacant lots at all.
That tends to happen when the population is increasing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KathrynAragon View Post
We got it as soon as we asked for it, which was well within the option period and before any inspections. In fact, it might have even been before the offer was accepted - I'm nearly positive it was.
So in other words you did not have it before making an offer. That's a bit backwards. No one should have to invest in making an offer, the option fee, subdivision information fee, and potentially the costs of physical inspection, etc. before having basic information.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KathrynAragon View Post
Yes, I did. There was no fee.
You likely did not receive a full set of dedicatory instruments. You also did not receive the information that would be provided by a resale certificate.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KathrynAragon View Post
I'm already familiar with that statute but thanks anyway. I'm not concerned. Very pleased with our HOA.
You did not seem to even know whether it was a corporate entity. In any event none of your comments addresses the issues of caps on disclosure fees or optional/involuntary membership HOAs. To the OP an "optional HOA" means that membership in the organization is optional but does not mean that the restrictive covenants are optional.
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Old 03-31-2017, 10:36 AM
JH6
 
1,435 posts, read 3,203,262 times
Reputation: 1162
Most of the new homes in central Texas have HOA's.

Mine offers two swimming facilities, workout room, and common area lawn upkeep.

I pay 90 per quarter.

They seem to be mostly concerned about people keeping the home up, and lawn free of huge amounts of weeds.

I did receive a letter about weeds growing in expansion cracks of my driveway. I remedied the problem and haven't heard back.

They did want a color chip sample before I painted my house a different color, but that was approved in 24 hours.

Also they did not want plastic sheds in peoples backyards, they had to be wood and painted the same color as the house.

If I had to do it again, I wouldn't get a house in a HOA but in the sub 250k pricepoint, you aren't getting a house on acreage in a rural area. So if you want anything newer 0-10 years old, then you will get an HOA.
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Old 04-02-2017, 08:36 AM
 
Location: Wonderland
67,654 posts, read 60,315,731 times
Reputation: 101015
Quote:
Originally Posted by IC_deLight View Post



Quote:
It's involuntary and the choice in much of the state boils down to which involuntary membership HOA one would be stuck with.
No one is forcing anyone to buy in this neighborhood.

Quote:
The real estate agent's provision to you is not binding on the organization and likely consisted of only some of the documents.
Nope, you're wrong. I got all the docs from the realtor - she got them from the title company where they were on file.

Quote:
That tends to happen when the population is increasing.
Ya think? And why are there no lots left in this neighborhood, in spite of the HOA? Or maybe because of the HOA? It's because people love this neighborhood. Houses also move quickly when they come on the market, in spite of the median price being well above the median price for this area. People don't tend to move out often and houses in this neighborhood are in great demand. No worries! We love it here. We get to know our neighbors because this is a "walking and biking" neighborhood, and also we use our common area pretty often for neighborhood get togethers which are well attended. What we hear over and over again is "Oh my gosh, we love living in this neighborhood." Hate to burst your bubble but we've lived here for three years and have literally not heard one negative comment about the HOA, not from newer residents or long term residents. It's a great place to live, which is precisely why the population is increasing. Our town has grown by about 30 percent over the past ten years. Love it here.

Quote:
So in other words you did not have it before making an offer. That's a bit backwards.
Are you not reading what I am actually saying? I told you clearly I'm nearly positive we had the docs BEFORE making the offer. We certainly had them well before the option period was up. They are on file with the title companies and it was super easy for our realtor to get them. I do know for a fact that she read them prior to us making the offer and discussed them with us and we had them very quickly. Sorry I can't remember the exact time frame but it simply wasn't an issue for us then and hasn't been since.

Quote:
No one should have to invest in making an offer, the option fee, subdivision information fee, and potentially the costs of physical inspection, etc. before having basic information.
This wasn't the case for us - not sure about other folks but this simply wasn't an issue. We knew before making the offer that the HOA was very minimally involved, that the fees were super low, and that there were no lots left in the subdivision and that basically what the HOA "governs" is maintenance of the common areas and any significant additions people may be considering to the preexisting homes. We had no problem with any of that so we moved forward with the offer.

Quote:
You likely did not receive a full set of dedicatory instruments. You also did not receive the information that would be provided by a resale certificate.
Sorry, but you have no idea what we received and didn't receive. Conjecture and assumption on your part.

Quote:
You did not seem to even know whether it was a corporate entity.
LOL my brain retains things on a "need to know" basis. It doesn't really matter to me whether our HOA is a corporate entity or not. I am not overly fearful or overly concerned about HOAs in general or ours in particular. It's cost is minimal. My involvement with it is minimal. What I do know and care about is that our beautiful common areas and entry ways are well maintained and that we get a financial statement each year and it all looks great and makes sense.

Quote:
In any event none of your comments addresses the issues of caps on disclosure fees or optional/involuntary membership HOAs.
Yeah, I was simply giving a recap of my own ongoing experiences with HOAs in Texas - which I've voluntarily chosen to be a part of for the past 25 years or so. Not one negative experience that entire time. Sorry that the narative of my own long running experiences with HOAs in Texas doesn't fit your agenda but it is what it is whether you accept it or not.

Have a great day - I will have another pleasant day in my pleasant neighborhood and if the incoming storms knock down a tree in the common area (like one did a couple of years ago) the HOA will pay to have it cut up and removed so I don't have to look at it from across the road!
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