Is Texas really as conservative/narrow-minded as people say it is? (best, money)
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I think the opposite in these terms. I mean really, Republicans only have a small marginal hold on Texas. The level of migration, and voters registering, really this is in the bag, it can go blue today, it can go blue tomorrow. It can go blue any day it wants.
I mean its really only 900,000 voters that separate Texas from being blue to being red. There's a large pool of residents that Texas has, that if they cared enough to register, it can and will be overwhelmingly blue. But its not the kind of state where most people really care in a political sense to do such:
This isn't true. Texas is the worst state when it comes to voter turn outs in the nation. It's registered voter population in correlation to a total population ratio is the among the worst in the nation for such.
Honestly people can ring around this on all day if they like, but the question is, how is the 5th most diverse state in the entire country, one with 38% Hispanic population, a predominant border state with Mexico, and a international job network, be this conservative? Because much of the liberal mindset in Texas has yet to realize that voting and being a registered voter is important.
I always knew people over dramatize Texas's conservative roots, everywhere I've been in Texas as a minority Asian and Hindu (religiously) has been open minded and accepting for my religion and background. So when I see these posts on this website from posters, I know whose been here and who hasn't when people use harsh demeaning terms to describe the attitude of the states residents.
I'm not saying its a liberal paradise by any means, but Texas is one of those states where if you judge it by the voter turnout of how liberal it is or not, you wont win. Texas is far more liberal than anyone can give it credit for. When the locals get it through their heads that being a registered voter in this state is important, it will show for it then.
To respond to the first part, we just came off of 8 years of Bush. Even places that are majority Republican were voting slightly left of what they usually do. Texas isnt an exception to that. Even so, Texas may be becoming slightly more blue, but it will not be a blue state any time soon. For proof of that, look how the sate voted in 2010.
To the second part, what are you disagreeing with? My point was that voting Democratic does not equal being open minded or liberal or voting Republican does not equal being closed minded or conservative. There are Republicans that are socially liberal and economically conservative (or vice-versa). Same goes with Democrats. We cant really judge based on that.
Location: Austin, TX/Chicago, IL/Houston, TX/Washington, DC
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Quote:
Originally Posted by justme02
To respond to the first part, we just came off of 8 years of Bush. Even places that are majority Republican were voting slightly left of what they usually do. Texas isnt an exception to that. Even so, Texas may be becoming slightly more blue, but it will not be a blue state any time soon. For proof of that, look how the sate voted in 2010.
But here's the thing about it though.
Since when do only the registered voters in Texas attribute to the atmosphere of Texas being solidly blue or red? One can easily find a Texan of any background that may be a "Republican" or a "Democrat" but does not vote nor is a registered voter.
In a state with the 4th largest minority presence, especially a border state with Mexico, even the Republican candidates have to watch what they say because of a few simple things:
1. It's not a secret that Texas represents well beneath its weight when voters come out to vote, especially the involvement with Hispanic voters.
2. They have to focus on driving an argument that doesn't involve zero benefits to any minorities, the 1930's days for Texas are done and over with. The state needs to get used to the fact that there is an ever increasing Black, Hispanic, & Asian population and the regulations from the 20th century are no good here.
The Bush backlash doesn't mean much in configuration either. It doesn't have anything necessarily to do with the Bush years, and more so over the fact that people cling on what benefits them the most. In a state that is supposed "bible belt" in many parts, there was absolutely no benefit for going Obama over McCain, and in fact wasn't this the state that Clinton won over Obama in the primaries? There was no absolute need for a heavy turn out for Obama in the election against McCain, it did so on its own merits.
But I never said it will be a blue state any time soon, I'm just trying to say it can and potentially it can become a blue state as early as today when people register to vote. The state of Texas isn't nearly at all as conservative as you think it is, and what's being confused here is that Republicans are running the state (by such a small numerical margin of 900,000 people) where as Democrats are not. There is more then enough credentials to go blue today, if people cared enough about the state politics or politics in general in this state to register to vote.
If the residents of this state cared more, the state wouldn't have the worst voter turn out rate in the entire nation. It wouldn't be a state that Republicans would flag as a "MUST HAVE" state and declare their worries of "we may lose Texas in the coming decade". The principles of Texas compared to Massachusetts, more people in Massachusetts are politically involved in their state, they have a strong voter turn out. Texas doesn't. And Republicans KNOW that they cant hold on and cling on Texas, its only a temporary thing for them.
Again, its not possible for a border state with Mexico to ever stay as conservative as Texas supposedly does. Republicans know that, and that is why they spend Billion (not millions but billions) into funding advertisements, better negotiations with foreign countries, and emphasize on quality of life issues like economy and housing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by justme02
To the second part, what are you disagreeing with?
I think you're misunderstanding me in general, I wasn't disagreeing with anything in your post. I just quoted you to elaborate on your post for the other people in this thread to get the idea.
Quote:
Originally Posted by justme02
My point was that voting Democratic does not equal being open minded or liberal or voting Republican does not equal being closed minded or conservative. There are Republicans that are socially liberal and economically conservative (or vice-versa). Same goes with Democrats. We cant really judge based on that.
No one can judge based off that at all. But its a general view, that Republican & Conservative are more economically based, and in for more ideas that involve minimal government influence.
Democrats are more into environmentalism, quality of life aspects, and a larger presence from a government. To be liberal is to be open minded as they say, but that is just propaganda.
I'm neither Liberal nor Conservative, am open minded. The general consensus in ideology is that a blue state is more environmentally progressive than a red state. And I do wholeheartedly agree with that, I like some policies from both political parties. If I had to choose, I would say combine economical policies of the Republicans with the environmental policies of the Democrats and its a real winner.
But it wont work that way. And Texas knows it has to change its political standpoint, its been tarnishing its own environment for far too long with waste, sewage, nuclear biohazard, and sprawly development. Texas really has no choice regardless of take.
Republicans are losing grasp of Texas at a fast rate because of the fact that they don't know how to present themselves and take charge of public issues, you cant keep lying about "rainy day funds" to the public all day to win one election and then when the budget comes out, hide. That's not how it works, Republicans are losing because they don't know how to talk to a state with residents that make up a minority of what they think and aren't properly represented for.
That's Republican Texas's downfall. That's where Democrats take advantage of what Texas is becoming.
Texas is damn full of trash all together. People there are petty and have no lives and cant seem to mind their own business (because they have no lives) so they mind everyone elses.
Its true what people say about Texas being trash. I had to live in that dumphole for 3 years and peopel there were backwards.
Its like I always say the only person who can stand a Texan is another dumb lowly texan.
Rest assured some idiot lowlife from texas will respond to try to defend their precious state.
So in the OP's mind, conservative = narrow minded and "progressive" = open minded. I think not. It's exactly the opposite.
I agree. Liberals are completely wedded to their beliefs and unable to seriously consider an alternative point of view. If you believe in the liberal ideology, you will defend your belief, since it is part of your identity.
The fault of liberalism is not its fixed beliefs. Every ideology is like that. Its fault is that it claims to be open minded.
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Originally Posted by buzzpost So in the OP's mind, conservative = narrow minded and "progressive" = open minded. I think not. It's exactly the opposite.
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Originally Posted by savanite
I agree. Liberals are completely wedded to their beliefs and unable to seriously consider an alternative point of view. If you believe in the liberal ideology, you will defend your belief, since it is part of your identity.
This is inaccurate. BOTH liberals and conservatives have this flaw.
Quote:
Originally Posted by buzzpost So in the OP's mind, conservative = narrow minded and "progressive" = open minded. I think not. It's exactly the opposite.
This is inaccurate. BOTH liberals and conservatives have this flaw.
That's an interesting comment. You mean someone who actually looks at the facts and the issues and the individual candidates and doesn't close their eyes and just vote the party line is a fool?
Texas used to be a Yellow Dog Democrat state. What that means is, in essence, "He'd vote fer a yeller dawg iffen it was a Democrat." Now, think about what that means, exactly, about the voter in question and the thought they've put into the issues and the deep evaluation they've done of the candidate and his or her qualifications for the job. There are Yellow Dog Democrats and there are Yellow Dog Republicans, and they are exactly the same - they hand over their brain to someone else to make all their decisions for them. Those, to me, are the fools.
That's an interesting comment. You mean someone who actually looks at the facts and the issues and the individual candidates and doesn't close their eyes and just vote the party line is a fool?
No, just someone with an open mind is a fool.
If someone's core principles and values change every time somebody talks him into it, he's an idiot. And a fool.
Are there any liberals open minded enough to vote for a racist?
So we have different definitions of "open mind". To me, someone with an open mind means not someone who changes their core principles and values, but who looks at ALL the facts before making a judgment, not just those that shore up their preferred world view, and then makes a judgment based on principles and values AND facts.
Someone with a closed mind will decide that their preferred world view is the only one there is and that any facts that might shake that world view are either invisible or are not facts, without really examining them at all. People who vote the party line without question just because it's "liberal" or "conservative" fall into that category.
So we have different definitions of "open mind". To me, someone with an open mind means not someone who changes their core principles and values, but who looks at ALL the facts before making a judgment, not just those that shore up their preferred world view, and then makes a judgment based on principles and values AND facts.
Someone with a closed mind will decide that their preferred world view is the only one there is and that any facts that might shake that world view are either invisible or are not facts, without really examining them at all. People who vote the party line without question just because it's "liberal" or "conservative" fall into that category.
OK, people are closed minded on their core values, and open minded about the most expedient survival strategy for a given situation.
Do Liberals claim that Conservatives cannot use strategy to choose the best options under a given set of circumstances? They'd be foolish if they believed that.
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