Texas secede? (Houston, Dallas, San Antonio: license, best, permit)

[TexasReb]

Originally Posted by Steel Man

Why don't we ask all the dead Texas Veterans who fought and died for our country?

I want to make it clear that I am not advocating secession (at least not at this point in time), but this epigram makes presumptions that -- while appealing to the patriotism and love of country most Texans feel -- is nonetheless rather simplistic. And I hasten to add this is not to ridicule what I think is, in essence, a very well intended and sincere point and outlook.

One can fight for our country -- and Texans/Southerners have always been disproportionately respresented in the United States armed forces -- out of a sense of duty, honor and devotion to the ideal of the United States of America. And when it is directly attacked from the outside (whether Pearl Harbor or 9/11) then this nation always unites. As it should.

But that doesn't necessarily mean one cannot also believe that the United States Constitution has been perverted over the years by certain powers which will use it to their own ends. The phrase "I love my country but fear my government" is not at all unreasonable nor paranoid...

Most secession movements (whether in the past or contemplated) are not born out of sense of disloyalty nor hostility to the United States. Granting the few nuts out there...far from it. Rather, the feeling that the federal government today is/has/becoming the antithesis of what the Founding Fathers intended this nation to be.

Anway, again, I don't advocate secession. However, I DO believe there are many justifications for it, that it is the inherent right of a free people. And that it usually reflects a desire to re-affirm the Constitution of the United States and what this country was intended to be. Not destroy it.

There is no reason to presume the millions of Texans who proudly served in our armed forces would feel any different.

[WillysB]

Originally Posted by TexasReb

- Modified for clarity -

The United States Constitution has been perverted over the years by certain powers which will use it to their own ends

The feeling that the federal government today is/has/becoming the antithesis of what the Founding Fathers intended this nation to be

Thanks TexasReb. That would be the basis of my sentiment for secession. It's not gonna happen, but not due to any effort on my behalf.

[Sandy Springs Rep.]

Originally Posted by Westerner92

I don't agree with Texas seceding, but please, just keep to the Georgia forum and stop trying to instigate fights.

I'm not trying to instigate fights I just don't understand why on earth anybody would want to secede from the United States.

When I said "you people" I meant the people who want Texas to secede, not everybody on this forum.

[Back2TX]

Originally Posted by High_Plains_Retired

As a native Texan who left the State a long time ago, it's not Texans who think Texans are better. I didn't know Texas was anything but just another state until I left and met people who told me differently. And after living in several other states, I now know why.

How funny! I was informed of that when I lived the past 5 yrs out of Texas. Interesting how others have labeled us as being that way.

[High_Plains_Retired]

Originally Posted by Back2TX

How funny! I was informed of that when I lived the past 5 yrs out of Texas. Interesting how others have labeled us as being that way.

Years ago while working in Chile alongside the Chilean government counterparts to my agency, I was invited to a Chilean co-worker's home for dinner one night. I was told to be sure to wear my western boots so the co-worker's son could meet a "real Texan."

[TX_AGGIE13]

Hmm...I don't really agree with this topic either unless things get out of hand. I will say to whoever said Texas is the 9th from the bottom in wealth....that's ignorance. I don't think the person who said Texas is the richest state is necessarily right, but he more than likely is. You used an argument talking about "the Texas people" to his statement. I don't think he was saying the people of Texas are the richest, but rather the State government. The only US states that may have the endowment of Texas would be California, Alaska, and New York.....and if Texas were to say "secede" it would deffinately be the largest loss of resources the US could have. Hence, the most wealthy State. That was taken out of context, which is the only way anyone would win an argument against Texas in this sense.

As for the Texans who do wish for this.... I posted in a similar, actually pretty much the same, post somewhere else. I am a US Veteran, and I think untill something like that is iminent, or in progress it is disrespectful to us former soldiers who have risk our lives for your luxuries. I deffinately bleed red, white, and blue with a Lone Star leading the other 50, but I also bleed for the other 50. If the sad fact happened that Texas went on it's own I would then stand for my home which is Texas, but why do you ignorant people wish something like that on heros of our country who have given you your liberties?

Lastly....here's the "reality" of what would occour if Texas were to do so.... The US will not sit back and watch happily, and let us be. They would impose trade sanctions on any Nation in the world who did business with us, and would make our lives he double l. We may make it hard on the US too, but not as bad as we would eventually have it after about 10 years or less where we would eventually fall under Mexican governing more than likely. We also would possibly face an initial "civil" war with the US, and then afterwards face a continuous border battle the likes of those you see in the Middle East. That is just a start to the reality of what seceding would really entail.

Oh, and lastly.....for those out of state individuals in here who are putting your two cents in..... I say thanks, because this is a stupid topic, and a disgracefull one. Stupid in the sense that it would never happen? Not really, but stupid in the sence that someone would want it to. As for the out of state individuals who are only putting your two cents in because you have issues with "Texas Pride", Texans being all about Texas, etc... take your p3^!2 envy somewhere else cause no one here gives a you know what what you think.

[Steel Man]

Originally Posted by TexasReb

I want to make it clear that I am not advocating secession (at least not at this point in time), but this epigram makes presumptions that -- while appealing to the patriotism and love of country most Texans feel -- is nonetheless rather simplistic. And I hasten to add this is not to ridicule what I think is, in essence, a very well intended and sincere point and outlook.

One can fight for our country -- and Texans/Southerners have always been disproportionately respresented in the United States armed forces -- out of a sense of duty, honor and devotion to the ideal of the United States of America. And when it is directly attacked from the outside (whether Pearl Harbor or 9/11) then this nation always unites. As it should.

But that doesn't necessarily mean one cannot also believe that the United States Constitution has been perverted over the years by certain powers which will use it to their own ends. The phrase "I love my country but fear my government" is not at all unreasonable nor paranoid...

Most secession movements (whether in the past or contemplated) are not born out of sense of disloyalty nor hostility to the United States. Granting the few nuts out there...far from it. Rather, the feeling that the federal government today is/has/becoming the antithesis of what the Founding Fathers intended this nation to be.

Anway, again, I don't advocate secession. However, I DO believe there are many justifications for it, that it is the inherent right of a free people. And that it usually reflects a desire to re-affirm the Constitution of the United States and what this country was intended to be. Not destroy it.

There is no reason to presume the millions of Texans who proudly served in our armed forces would feel any different.

Hypothetically, if Texas did secede, what would happen if other groups want to secede within Texas? The U.S. Constitution was written for a pluralistic society and is a living document. Sure, it is interpreted differently, and there will always be challenges, but its tenets remain the same. IMO, the United States needs Texas AND Texas needs the United States.

[TexasReb]

Originally Posted by Steel Man

Hypothetically, if Texas did secede, what would happen if other groups want to secede within Texas?

Interesting question. The individual states are the basic soveriegn unit in our federalist system and are recognized as such by the division of powers within the U.S. Constutition. Not sure how counties are within the Texas Constitution, which would probably be the key to the answer, perhaps. Anyway, interesting question.

The U.S. Constitution was written for a pluralistic society and is a living document. Sure, it is interpreted differently, and there will always be challenges, but its tenets remain the same.

I don't agree with the "living document" thing IF by the phrase it means (as I think Justice William Brennan once put it) "it can be adapted to fit current needs." This is really just an ingenious way of saying the document can be used as a license to steal.

IMO, the United States needs Texas AND Texas needs the United States.

I don't necessarily disagree with this sentiment. In fact, it forms the basis of why the United States was formed to begin with. The individual states did not band together out of love or even compatibility with one another, but out of practical recognition that alone, none were strong enough economically and militarily to compete with the powers of Europe. However, they were careful to keep their individual soveriegnty and delegate only limited and specific powers to the shared (federal) government. Over the years however, at least IHMO, the 9th and 10th ammendments have become virtually meaningless (and in one case before the Warren Court, it was almost stated as such) and the federal government assuming powers which far exceed anything granted them originally. It is objection to this type power-grabbing which has formed the nucleus of many so-called secessionist movements. And to repeat again, I am not a secessionist at this point in time...but I very much sympathize with rationale behind some of them.

[Cathy4017]

Originally Posted by Sandy Springs Rep.

Wtf WHY IS IT A GOOD IDEA? What would you gain by seceding?!?!

I don't understand you people.

For the third time in so many words, we don't CARE whether you like or understand us.

As another poster mentioned, why do you come to this forum and try to stir crap up, anyway?

Get a life, would you?!?

[austinguy2009]

this is really retarded.

besides we'd be pwn3d by the modern military.

how backwards of a thing to do anyway!