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Dropping in and laughing at the whole gay village thing. Lived in T.O. in the early 80's and that was the whole gay village back then too..... Loved the gay village....St.Josephs, Katrina's.....
Even though New York has 5 boroughs, Manhattan is the icon of NYC that most people identify with. Toronto doesn't have anything that comes close to Manhattan and never will.
Well, a lot of people identify the Downtown Area with Toronto. The skyline is impressive. There are many similarities between the two cities, and I happen to think they are much more alike than other viewpoints some here have shared (Toronto & Chicago being the most similar). For one, they are the biggest cities in their respective countries, the economic center/centre of their countries, and some of the most important cities of their countries, as well as some of the most diverse and dense. Both offer the urban, busy lifestyle (of course, Toronto, being smaller, is nicer and a bit more relaxed). Both have a whole lot to do, though New York City, being bigger, probably has a bit more. However, I personally prefer Toronto. It's cheaper, safer and cleaner, along with other things I mentioned above. Yes, it has worse weather, but I'd be fine overlooking that since it has so many other benefits. But there are many areas that are similar to NYC-The Beaches are kinda like The Hamptons, or other wealthy suburban areas of NYC. Yonge-Dundas Square is like Times Square (not as breathtaking, but impressive nonetheless). Downtown Toronto in many ways is like Manhattan.
Well, a lot of people identify the Downtown Area with Toronto. The skyline is impressive. There are many similarities between the two cities, and I happen to think they are much more alike than other viewpoints some here have shared (Toronto & Chicago being the most similar). For one, they are the biggest cities in their respective countries, the economic center/centre of their countries, and some of the most important cities of their countries, as well as some of the most diverse and dense. Both offer the urban, busy lifestyle (of course, Toronto, being smaller, is nicer and a bit more relaxed). Both have a whole lot to do, though New York City, being bigger, probably has a bit more. However, I personally prefer Toronto. It's cheaper, safer and cleaner, along with other things I mentioned above. Yes, it has worse weather, but I'd be fine overlooking that since it has so many other benefits. But there are many areas that are similar to NYC-The Beaches are kinda like The Hamptons, or other wealthy suburban areas of NYC. Yonge-Dundas Square is like Times Square (not as breathtaking, but impressive nonetheless). Downtown Toronto in many ways is like Manhattan.
New York, the Big Apple, ''probably has a bit more to do'' than Toronto does...
Dropping in and laughing at the whole gay village thing. Lived in T.O. in the early 80's and that was the whole gay village back then too..... Loved the gay village....St.Josephs, Katrina's.....
Aww, good old Katrina's, I lived in Toronto in the early 80s as well and have many great memories! Also loved going to Fran's restaurant after the bars or on Sundays.
Yonge-Dundas Square is like Times Square (not as breathtaking, but impressive nonetheless). Downtown Toronto in many ways is like Manhattan.
oh, Yonge-Dundas Square resembles Times Square in what way exactly? I honestly don't know how YD Square can be described as "impressive". Its often seemingly vibrancy is only because of the existance of a large shopping mall on one side, and all the corporate advertisement in the square itself. YD Square if anything only represents Toronto's small-mindness and short-sightedness, along with its barren culture and complete lack of aesthetic taste. If I name 20 top public squares in the cities I have been to, YD Square won't be anywhere close to the list. (Not to say Times Square is anything particularly interesting but there are a lot more going on there (Broadway theatres for example).
And how downtown Toronto is like Manhattan, you mean all the 1-2 story decrepit stores on Yonge st and Queen west, or dozens of desperate surface parking lots between Spadina and Jarvis, or countless lowrise houses between Church and Parliament or University and Bathurst? Is there anything as hopelessly miserable and boring as Bathurst St, Dundas st or Sherbourne st in Manhattan?
People may dream Queen W is SOHO and Bloor/Yorkville is Fifth Ave when in reality they can't be more different. Or should we compare ROM/AGO with the Met or MOMA? High Park vs Central Park? King W vs Broadway?
New York offers a bit more, RIGHT. Warren Buffett is a bit richer than you too.
But there are many areas that are similar to NYC-The Beaches are kinda like The Hamptons, or other wealthy suburban areas of NYC. Yonge-Dundas Square is like Times Square (not as breathtaking, but impressive nonetheless). Downtown Toronto in many ways is like Manhattan.
I really don't get these comparisons.
The beaches like the Hamptons? The Hamptons is perhaps one of the most exclusive vacation spots in the world where celebs, and the upper-middle to upper class elite and their families go to play. The Beaches is a small middle to upper-middle family-oriented neighborhood in Toronto which no celeb buzz or true exclusivity like the Hamptons. I have family who are school teachers who live there who I visit regularly. I would equate the Hamptons more to certain parts of Muskoka where local well-to-do people vacation from Toronto if anything. Rosedale or Forest Hill may be more like the Upper East side of New York if you had to draw comparisons - old money neighborhoods in the city near the core. Oakville is a well-to-do suburban enclave outside of the city, which is akin to parts of upstate NY like Weschester, all those places in NJ with mansions, some deep parts of Queens like Forest Hill, high income towns in CT like Stamford, etc.
And Times Square and even Dundas square impressive? When I lived in NYC, it would social suicide for a New Yorker to be caught hanging around Times Square. I agree Dundas Square is a smaller copy of Times Square but its full of tourists, people from the suburbs and small towns, shady people standing around and evangelists who want an audience. I would hardly call Dundas Square or Times Square impressive places in Toronto and New York to hang out in for an urbanite.
Last edited by johnathanc; 10-15-2013 at 01:56 PM..
Well, a lot of people identify the Downtown Area with Toronto. The skyline is impressive. There are many similarities between the two cities, and I happen to think they are much more alike than other viewpoints some here have shared (Toronto & Chicago being the most similar). For one, they are the biggest cities in their respective countries, the economic center/centre of their countries, and some of the most important cities of their countries, as well as some of the most diverse and dense. Both offer the urban, busy lifestyle (of course, Toronto, being smaller, is nicer and a bit more relaxed). Both have a whole lot to do, though New York City, being bigger, probably has a bit more. However, I personally prefer Toronto. It's cheaper, safer and cleaner, along with other things I mentioned above. Yes, it has worse weather, but I'd be fine overlooking that since it has so many other benefits. But there are many areas that are similar to NYC-The Beaches are kinda like The Hamptons, or other wealthy suburban areas of NYC. Yonge-Dundas Square is like Times Square (not as breathtaking, but impressive nonetheless). Downtown Toronto in many ways is like Manhattan.
Toronto is cheaper, the only thing more expensive about New York is housing dont even go there. Umm the beaches are not like the hamptons trust me, Times Square is different, New York recieves much high tourism levels than New York but Toronto is cleaner and safer!
Rosedale and Forest Hill feel more like Westchester County than they do like Manhattan. That whole Yonge corridor zone from Rosedale to Lawrence) resembles northwest DC quite a bit: an affluent area which has a bit more of a commercial vibe, better transit, lots of young professionals etc. but also a bit of a "suburb-in-the-city" feel in certain residential sections.
Most of the "old money" departed major Northeastern and Midwestern cities with the exception of Manhattan where they're in apartments on the UES not single family houses.
Last edited by King of Kensington; 10-15-2013 at 06:45 PM..
Rosedale and Forest Hill feel more like Westchester County than they do like Manhattan. That whole Yonge corridor zone from Rosedale to Lawrence) resembles northwest DC quite a bit: an affluent area which has a bit more of a commercial vibe, better transit, lots of young professionals etc. but also a bit of a "suburb-in-the-city" feel in certain residential sections.
Most of the "old money" departed major Northeastern and Midwestern cities with the exception of Manhattan where they're in apartments on the UES not single family houses.
Much of what you say is true but I was not referring to structural form but the substance of what the areas represent. The structural form of Toronto is nothing like Manhattan, where there are no stand alone houses period. In terms of structure, TO neighborhoods remind me more of Queens with tightly packed homes with a lot of street parking. I think there is quite a lot of "old money" in the east coast cities of the US compared to the rest of the country. In terms of Canada, there is relatively a lot of old monied people in Toronto. Most rich people in Canada come from old money, whereas the US has a much bigger % of new money among the rich.
Last edited by johnathanc; 10-15-2013 at 07:11 PM..
Much of what you say is true but I was not referring to structural form but the substance of what the areas represent. The structural form of Toronto is nothing like Manhattan, where there are no stand alone houses period. In terms of structure, TO neighborhoods remind me more of Queens with tightly packed homes with a lot of street parking. I think there is quite a lot of "old money" in the east coast cities of the US compared to the rest of the country. In terms of Canada, there is relatively a lot of old monied people in Toronto. Most rich people in Canada come from old money, whereas the US has a much bigger % of new money among the rich.
I meant that they departed for the suburbs more than they left their metro areas. It's hard to think of anything like the Yonge corridor in a US Northeastern or Midwestern city. The closest is DC (and it's technically a Southern city though also part of BosWash). Indeed, the transition from DC into Maryland kind of resembles the transition from wealthy North Toronto to wealthy southern North York and Leaside.
Take Chicago: Gold Coast and Streeterville is a Yorkville-type area and then you basically have "yuppies" in the lakefront districts further north. Imagine Yonge and St. Clair and Yonge and Eg apartments without SFHs right around the corner. The Rosedales and Lawrence Parks are basically the North Shore communities.
Philadephia has Chestnut Hill which is kind of akin to Rosedale or Lawrence Park.
Buffalo has an "old money" district near Delaware Park but I'm not sure how wealthy it is anymore.
Probably more akin to upper Jarvis St. than Rosedale at this point.
I get the sense that for the most part the departure of "old money" in the Northeast and Midwest (or in those days, "money") occurred in the early 1900s - to so-called garden suburbs and streetcar suburbs that were outside the city limits - i.e. prior to the mass suburbanization of the postwar years. In Toronto these suburbs developed both in the city limits (i.e. Rosedale, Casa Loma/South Hill, Lawrence Park) as well as outside (the Kingsway, Leaside, the village of Forest Hill). In Chicago they had already migrated to the North Shore and in New York you either accepted apartment living near Central Park or moved to Westchester, with the exception of a few enclaves like Riverdale and Forest Hills Gardens. (In Washington most of the pre-war "old money" districts are mostly in the District itself, the suburbs of Bethesda, Potomac, etc. are mostly postwar and are more akin to York Mills).
...so that's why it's really hard to come up with a New York or Chicago equivalent for Rosedale, North Toronto, etc.
I agree Toronto quite much resembles Queens in urban form - a sort of mix between Queens and Chicago's North Side.
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New York, the Big Apple, ''probably has a bit more to do'' than Toronto does...
